Talk:Lois Baxter
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Actor or actress
[edit]see no reason to change this. Sources are driven by their own style guides, and were not beholden to them.Unbh — Preceding unsigned comment added by Unbh (talk • contribs) 18:01, 6 April 2022 (UTC)
- As already clearly pointed out to you in a recent edit summary, the reason to change is made clear at MOS:GNL and WP:WAW. And we should always be guided by sources. Thanks. Also, please sign your comment. Martinevans123 (talk) 18:17, 6 April 2022 (UTC)
GNL is not about changing every instance of a gendered term in Wikipedia. WPWAW is an essay, and nowhere close to policy — Preceding unsigned comment added by Unbh (talk • contribs) 18:25, 6 April 2022 (UTC)
- @Martinevans123: MOS:GNL says nothing about actress. There is a longstanding consensus that we are allowed to use actor or actress, and most articles use actress. Try changing the usage in a big article like Marilyn Monroe to actor: you would be immediately reverted. We are guided by the facts of a source, not its house style; we have our own style guide. For the record, your desired change has now been disputed by two editors. Ficaia (talk) 20:24, 6 April 2022 (UTC) Ficaia (talk) 20:22, 6 April 2022 (UTC)
- Monroe died in 1962, decades before she or her colleagues would have been called "actors". Baxter, like many other women in the profession today, are being described by RADA as an actor now. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:26, 6 April 2022 (UTC)
- More recent examples using "actress": Margot Robbie, Jodie Comer, Sandra Oh, etc. etc. See (1) for the most recent discussion establishing "actor/actress" as a special case where either usage is acceptable. Ficaia (talk) 21:32, 6 April 2022 (UTC)
- WP:OTHERSTUFF is never a justification for ignoring a reliable sourced reference. BTW the Comcast menu uses the term actor for males and females. Being available in 100s of millions of homes it is a good example of "standard usage". MarnetteD|Talk 04:22, 7 April 2022 (UTC)
- Again, this is a matter of style not fact, so we are not bound by the usage in a particular source. I suggest you read the MoS discussion I linked above. Ficaia (talk) 05:04, 7 April 2022 (UTC)
- It is not a matter of style (which boils down WP:IDONTLIKEIT in your case). Unless you can point to a specific policy, guideline or essay the sourced wording will be restored. MarnetteD|Talk 19:51, 7 April 2022 (UTC)
- It clearly is a matter of style. We have our own MoS. We don't follow the house style of any particular source. The article formerly used "actress", and was recently changed to "actor". This change has now been reverted by two editors, so there is no consensus for any change. Again, I suggest you read the MoS discussion here (1) which establishes "actor/actress" as a special case in the MoS: both usages are acceptable, and the matter is decided on a case by case basis either by established usage or consensus at talk. Ficaia (talk) 21:26, 7 April 2022 (UTC)
- It's entirely a matter of style. Her professional bio as a tutor here https://teachyourselfacting.com/lois-baxter/ calls her an actress - (Notably the other bios for female tutors in that organisation DO use the term actor.Unbh (talk) 10:00, 8 April 2022 (UTC)
- So it seems it's not "entirely a matter of style". Martinevans123 (talk) 11:17, 9 April 2022 (UTC)
- It's entirely a matter of style. Her professional bio as a tutor here https://teachyourselfacting.com/lois-baxter/ calls her an actress - (Notably the other bios for female tutors in that organisation DO use the term actor.Unbh (talk) 10:00, 8 April 2022 (UTC)
- It clearly is a matter of style. We have our own MoS. We don't follow the house style of any particular source. The article formerly used "actress", and was recently changed to "actor". This change has now been reverted by two editors, so there is no consensus for any change. Again, I suggest you read the MoS discussion here (1) which establishes "actor/actress" as a special case in the MoS: both usages are acceptable, and the matter is decided on a case by case basis either by established usage or consensus at talk. Ficaia (talk) 21:26, 7 April 2022 (UTC)
- It is not a matter of style (which boils down WP:IDONTLIKEIT in your case). Unless you can point to a specific policy, guideline or essay the sourced wording will be restored. MarnetteD|Talk 19:51, 7 April 2022 (UTC)
- Again, this is a matter of style not fact, so we are not bound by the usage in a particular source. I suggest you read the MoS discussion I linked above. Ficaia (talk) 05:04, 7 April 2022 (UTC)
- WP:OTHERSTUFF is never a justification for ignoring a reliable sourced reference. BTW the Comcast menu uses the term actor for males and females. Being available in 100s of millions of homes it is a good example of "standard usage". MarnetteD|Talk 04:22, 7 April 2022 (UTC)
- More recent examples using "actress": Margot Robbie, Jodie Comer, Sandra Oh, etc. etc. See (1) for the most recent discussion establishing "actor/actress" as a special case where either usage is acceptable. Ficaia (talk) 21:32, 6 April 2022 (UTC)
- Monroe died in 1962, decades before she or her colleagues would have been called "actors". Baxter, like many other women in the profession today, are being described by RADA as an actor now. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:26, 6 April 2022 (UTC)
- @Martinevans123: MOS:GNL says nothing about actress. There is a longstanding consensus that we are allowed to use actor or actress, and most articles use actress. Try changing the usage in a big article like Marilyn Monroe to actor: you would be immediately reverted. We are guided by the facts of a source, not its house style; we have our own style guide. For the record, your desired change has now been disputed by two editors. Ficaia (talk) 20:24, 6 April 2022 (UTC) Ficaia (talk) 20:22, 6 April 2022 (UTC)
no, this is fairly straight forward. there's are sources that call her both. so what we use is a question of style