Talk:List of Ferrari road cars

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List page started

I've just created this page by moving the long list of models from the Ferrari page itself. Some more re-writing and formatting of both this page and the Ferrari page will be required, I'll come back and do some.Spute (talk) 23:09, 22 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed. In particular, we need more specificity and consistency on measurements. At least that's true in the Berlinetta Boxer section, which I will try to work up now. Buzzm (talk) 15:12, 6 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

My thoughts.

I think ("Front-engine V12 2-seats" category) 125 S, 166 MM, 212 Export, 330 TRI/LM and ("Hypercars" category) 250 GTO, 250 LM have nothing to do with a list of road cars. They are race cars and they are already in the List of Ferrari competition cars.
I don't like the "Hypercars" category and the sentence "The pinnacle of the company's road cars are supercars produced in limited numbers". The 288 GTO is the pinnacle of nothing, it was the result of scrapping the Group B regulations, it was supposed to be a race car. Unlike F40, EnzoFerrari and LaFerrari, the 288 GTO acquired its fame among "NO-car connoisseurs" a little too fast, only after its value skyrocketed and it's quite possible that it's the result of a market manipulation. ^[1] It's really beautiful, it's the first longitudinally mounted mid-engine V8 road Ferrari, but it's not a hypercar (as the currently Toyota Yaris WRC is not a hypercar). I don't think "limited editions" would be a better title for this category, because the "Mid-engine V6/V8 2-seats" category is full of "limited editions", which would "flood" this category. This category is just the result of speculative behavior and what Youtube creators (or social networks in general) are pushing the most. If we remove 250 GTO, 250 LM and 288 GTO (for the reason I suggested), this category could be titled something like "celebrative models" or "commemorative models". The only problem I see is the LaFerrari: F40 celebrates Ferrari's 40th anniversary, F50 celebrates Ferrari's 50th anniversary, EnzoFerrari celebrates Ferrari's 55th anniversary. What does the LaFerrari celebrate? Lack of imagination in naming their cars?!
I know the "Front-engine V12 2-seats" category contains some 4-seats/2+2. "Front-engine V12 2+2" category is for cars born as a "2+2" and I think we need some degre of separation to understand how 812 Superfast and GTC4Lusso came into the world. I renamed the "2-seat Gran Turismo" category to "Front-engine V12 2-seats" because in the Ferrari world everything is a GT, so the 2-seats problem was already here. These categories are not perfect, but I don't have a better solution (for now).
I splitted the "Front-engine 2+2" category in "Front-engine V12 2+2" and "Front-engine V8 2+2", because 612 Scaglietti and Portofino in the same category makes no sense, but now I'm thinking if we need to separate California, GTC4Lusso T and Portofino in 2 distinct categories. It's a bad idea to create a "Front-engine V8 2+2 convertible", because a lot of V12 and mid-engine V8 Ferrari have a convertible variant and I don't want to create billions of categories that make the overall view difficult, in any case GTC4Lusso T and Portofino are very different cars. -- Torque Vectoring (talk) 17:23, 13 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The list of road cars should include dual-purpose cars. 166 MM, 340 America etc some of them were race some were road cars. YBSOne (talk) 17:43, 13 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I 100% agree with you. Sorry, I chopped too many cars: too much enthusiasm. -- Torque Vectoring (talk) 19:33, 13 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I looked a little more into the Ferrari 166 MM. Could you please prove that there was a road 166 MM car? No recent photos. If you think the 166 MM Zagato Panoramica was a road car, you're wrong. This car was commissioned in 1948 by Antonio Stagnoli, who raced it, two years later the car was returned to Zagato to have it rebuilt as a cigar-shaped Spyder. Stagnoli raced the Spyder too. It has always been a race car. -- Torque Vectoring (talk) 22:32, 14 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The only non-raced 166 MM. That is not really the point. Early cars were dual-purpose. Intended as a race cars, also used as road cars. Also intended road cars were raced. 212 Inters won Carrera Panamericana.YBSOne (talk) 08:13, 15 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

So, after all this explanation, you removed the 166 MM without any reason. Do you share your account with other people? -- Torque Vectoring (talk) 22:08, 18 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

You wanted it removed, only one was not raced, it is removed from road cars so only Inters remain. YBSOne (talk) 10:54, 19 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for the explanation. Sorry if I'm so pedantic, but if we make unclear changes without giving explanations, new potential contributors could just give up, because not understanding the rules of an article is a really powerful reason to not contribute to that article. -- Torque Vectoring (talk) 16:03, 19 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Problems in the "One-Off & Few-Off" and "Concept/Prototype" categories
I see a lot of race cars here. The most prominent is probably the 1969 Ferrari Sigma Grand Prix. It doesn't look like a road car to me. Should we clean up, or "One-Off & Few-Off" and "Concept/Prototype" follow different rules?

1972 Ferrari 365 GTB/4 Daytona Competizione Spider: I have no idea what this car is. Luigi Chinetti commissioned 5 Daytonas between 1974 and 1976. In 1974 chassis 14897. In 1975 Chinetti ordered a Daytona Competizione, chassis 15965, with Michelotti coachwork. In 1976, Chinetti ordered three Michelotti Spiders based on chassis 14299, 15003, and 16467. I think the 1972 entry is referring to the 1974 Chinetti's commission, which is a 1972 body (chassis 14897), but then another error was made, because the Competizione is the 1975 car and not the 1974 (with 1972 body)

1972 Ferrari 365 GTB/4 Daytona Competizione Spider
1975 Ferrari 365 GTS/4 Michelotti NART Spider

-- Torque Vectoring (talk) 04:37, 15 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Cars are from 1971 but rebodied in 1974-6, it is the same car, each have a different body YBSOne (talk) 08:04, 15 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I saw your fix, but I disagree with the year you use (1975). Furthermore the website you're linking reports 14897 as being at the New York Auto Show in 1973 (1971: accident, 197*: converted to Michelotti N.A.R.T. Spyder), so the year is something between 1971 and 1973. More important: what are we doing with Ferrari Sigma Grand Prix & "friends"? I mean, is this a list about road car, or a list about everything that didn't participate in a car competition? Because I don't know what to do with Ferrari P80/C, which is a 488 GT3 one-off. -- Torque Vectoring (talk) 20:52, 15 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Final stage for every prod car concept does not need to be here To maintain consistency with the "YBSOne's rule", I think we should remove the recently added "2000 Ferrari 550 Sperimentale", which is the 550/575 mule. I'm leaving it, because I don't want to look like I'm trying to pick a fight with the mobile contributor (by undoing almost everything he did) -- Torque Vectoring (talk) 01:38, 24 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

References

^ "288 GTO valuation".

Halo Cars

Halo Cars category should not be changed to "Hyper Cars" per WP:CARCLASS. Also it should only contain modern cars as older America/Superamerica line and 250 GTO do also fit into those criteria. Halo Cars should contain only road cars made every decade by Ferrari with the exception of the race-intended homologation GTO (288 GTO), that started this trend. YBSOne (talk) 15:04, 4 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

[1] "288 GTO valuation".

[1]