Talk:List of Arab Americans

Proposal for list inclusion

I have made the following proposal regarding the criteria for inclusion for these lists. If this is something that you have comments or ideas about, please provide feedback. Thanks. Wikibofh 9 July 2005 19:14 (UTC)

Yes, this page acknowledges the race of these people, but I wish it had included ethnicity. Edward Said was Palestinian. I think Tony Shahloub is Lebanese. Etc.

Race of these people? Let's not forget that Arabs are not a race, they're an ethnicity. If we're going to refer to the race of Americans of Arab descent, they are racially White. You are reffering to nationality (not ethnicity) when you mention something like Palestinian and Lebanese. Anyway, I do agree that we should include the ancestries of the people listed, such as who is Syrian, who is Lebanese, Palestinian, Egyptian, etc. Perhaps we should start new articles such as List of Syrian Americans, List of Lebanese Americans, List of Palestinian Americans, etc.--Gramaic | Talk 08:40, 18 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Whether or not Arab is a race depends on ones categorization of races. How many 'races' are there? Some say 2, some say 200. I don't think there are any.

- signed by anon IP

True, you find a large minority of Arab Americans have a fair amount of melanin (skin color) and ethnological characteristics found in a majority of north or east Africans and south Asians. Arabs are of the so-called Semitic branch of the Afro-Asian linguistic family, but are racially labeled as the white race (Caucasians) of "Armenoid" and Mediteranean stock compared to the northern/western Europeans ("Nordic" and "Alpine" stocks) in numerous studies of 20th century anthropology books. But the term "Arab" was derived from the tribes from Arabian peninsula and a certain nationality's native tongue was Arabic, a relative to other Semitic languages like Hebrew and Aramaic. + 63.3.14.2 03:06, 4 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, arabs are not a race, the race that arabs belong to is the semetic race. And, don't really find it relevant whether or not its a race the important thing is expand this page.Ahmadhusseini 18:04, 10 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Scientifically, there are 3 races only from a biological standpoint, ie: if you had a skeleton with no skin you could tell their race (and sex), and infer but not know with certainty their skin colour; skin colour can vary considerably within 'racial' groups. The terms were caucausoid, negroid, and mongoloid, but they are now avoided because of negative racist associations. So the first comment was correct, in the sense that a skeleton of an arab person, and a skeleton of a polish person would not be distinguishable (I'm not certain) Semitic is a social / cultural construct, not a biological one. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.196.191.224 (talk) 17:29, 24 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Paula Abdul

        I feel that who write this page doesn't accept if these famous peoples are arab descendant. what's wrong with you ? how can you trace peoples ethnicity ? and what for ? there are many arabs have contributions to the world...they got the key of sciences gate.

Paula Abdul has been removed because she is not by indication of any Arab ancestry. Her article says that her father was born in Syria but her ethnicity is Sephardi. Ethnicity and nationality are two completely different things whenever there are any minorities within a country. Including Sephardim from an "Arab country" as "Arab" is as absurd as saying that just because an immigrant to the UK is rightfully British, it also makes them ethnically Anglo-Saxon. There are Arab Jews but they are the Mizrahim, a distinct group from the Sephardim; and according the Abdul's article her father is of the latter. - signed by anon IP

I rather kept her nomination to the famous Arab American list, Abdul is a common surname for Arabs of all faithes and Middle Eastern peoples. She's of Brazilian or Latin American descent, then Abdul is considered Latina to many people, but not really Hispanic unless she had Spanish descent. I believe she had French-Canadian and Italian in her, but no doubt about Paula Abdul is of Separdi Jewish ancestry...although they could have Syrian Arab (Christian and Muslim) in them, since religion is a choice to convert or withdraw from. I'm aware of the customs of Jewishness is a special ethnic identity (halakhic law), like Abdul had any children, they would count as Jews. + 63.3.14.2 03:01, 4 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

in interviews since the 80s she always had said that she is proud of her arab jewish descent. She considers herself as an arab

i know tons of yemenite and syrian jews. All of them consider them as arab. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2.247.244.100 (talk) 18:35, 14 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Ethnicity lists discussion

Please see discussion at Wikipedia:Village pump (policy) for current discussion of a potential policy to apply to all ethnicity lists on Wikipedia, including this one. JackO'Lantern 20:45, 11 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Source tag

Although I wasn't the one who put it in, and I won't restore it for now, what the source tag meant was that every name on the list had to be sourced... something like List of Swiss Americans, List of Irish-Americans and a few other lists that are being done right now that way. But it's not urgent. Mad Jack O'Lantern 06:10, 10 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I see. I guess I will restore the source tag as I'm the one who removed it :).--Inahet 06:38, 10 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Well, there's no need to, really. A lot of lists out there are not sourced and don't have tags. I just wrote what I did above to let whoever know that eventually all the lists should be sourced. Mad Jack O'Lantern 06:39, 10 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Actually, now that you mentioned it, the tag should be there to inform other editors that the claims should be sourced. Otherwise, how would they know? But I think another tag should be placed, one that spefically mentions that each claim should be sourced. --Inahet 06:47, 10 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Shakira

Isn't she half-lebanese? Shouldn't she be in this list???

I just added her. According to IMDB she is half lebanese.--Ashmole 20:09, 19 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I think when you define American, you usually mean someone from the U.S., not anyone from the American continent. In this case, we have a person who is from Colombia, not the U.S. so her name should not be on the list. --Inahet 21:36, 19 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Well, actuality there *ISN'T* such a thing as an "American"(except Native Americans), as an Immigrant, she *IS* american, because we all originate from Europe, Africa(slaves), and other, newer immigrants... --82.101.143.34 21:00, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Shakira would be in other categories: Latin American, Hispanic American, Colombian American and likely Arab American. Her mother's side is both French and Spanish born/raised there, but her father is absolutely Lebanese (some people claim they isn't "Arabs" or not like Saudi Arabs, North Africans or due to the fact nearly half of Lebanese are Maronite Christians). The facts are clear since the main language of Lebanon is Arabic and their ancestors originated from the Arabian peninsula, as much the other half are Muslim and descended from the "fertile crescent" region. Would the majority of Israelis and Jews of most backgrounds have the same family tree like Muslim Arabs or Lebanese of the Christian faith? It depends on how you look at it, but the christian bible, the Jewish torah and the Islamic koran all said Abraham was the common ancestors of all Semitic peoples in the holy land! + 63.3.14.2 03:12, 4 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Salma Hayek

She is part Lebanese but I'm not sure if she has US citizenship.--Ashmole 20:07, 21 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah she is, i added her. --82.101.143.23 21:27, 23 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

More descriptions

Some of the people have a dash next to their name that gives a quick overview of who they are.I think that should be done for the rest of the people.--Ashmole 19:13, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Classifying writers?

I think writers and essayists are better fit with the "Academics" category than with "Media." Etel Adnan has a lot more in common with Edward Said than with Tony Shalhoub! Dybryd 05:51, 31 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

No one has replied, so I'm going to create a separate "Writers" category

Pat Benatar don't belong in here

Note the surname "Benatar" is found in Sephardi Jews of the Middle East in Arabic speaking countries and in Europe. Be in mind Pat Benatar is not of Arab descent at all, so disregard her last name. She's a Polish American, but doubt she's Jewish or Christian (nor does it matter). Don't include her on the list since she has no Mid-eastern descent...if you read the wikipedia article, "Benatar" was her husband's name from marriage and she divorced him, but kept the last name for stardom career reasons. + 63.3.14.2 02:54, 4 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Doctors...

Here's one: outstanding achievements: Dr. Fouad Tayfour (syrian) Ahmadhusseini 17:44, 10 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

~I thought Dr. Tayfour was Canadian. [Nawal] —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.200.24.52 (talk) 04:04, 21 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Why are there people who didn't achieve much?

Why do we have a linguist under Military. He didn't do much. So I guess I can add my uncle: Khaled Dudin. Which I will be creating a page for. He was a Combat-Medic for the 82nd airborne. Recieved a bronze star, a purple heart, and a bunch of War on Terror ribbons. Keep this page for Famous Arab Americans, because I could fill this up with so many names that it would be pathetic. Ahmadhusseini 17:58, 10 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

ok that's a complete waste of a line, I'm gonna take that guy outAhmad Husseini 21:11, 11 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Please review this...

On some of the bio pages for these arab-americans, it's not mentioned that they're of arabic descent. Can someone check that out? I think some are under the politicians category.Ahmadhusseini 18:07, 10 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

people not qualified to be in this list

As with all such lists, the inclusion criteria is clearly stated:

"To be included in this list, the person must have a Wikipedia article showing they are Arab American or must have references showing they are Arab American and are notable."

There are many names in this list who do not have a WP article or do not have any references. They need to be deleted or they may be moved to this discussion page until such time as they have articles or have references. If no one moves them, then I will delete them. Who will stand up and maintain this list? Hmains (talk) 04:05, 9 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

List

This is a list of people who do not yet qualify to be on this list due to lack of a WP article or lack of references showing the person is Arab American and is notable. Hmains (talk) 16:45, 19 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

academics

Nabil Alkayed, a Professor of Anesthesiology and Peri-Operative Medicine (APOM) at Oregon Health & Science University (OHSU) and holds a joint appointment in Physiology and Pharmacology. He is Director of the newly formed Division of Cerebrovascular Research and Associate Director of the Research Center for Gender-Based Medicine at OHSU. In addition, Dr. Alkayed serves on the Program for Molecular and Cellular Biosciences (PMCB) and the Neuroscience Graduate Program (NGP) at OHSU. (Jordanian American)
Ramzi S. Cotran, famous Lebanese-American Professor of Pathology.
Abdulrahim Nasr Chafi, Professor of Chemistry and Environmental Engineering at National University and Fresno Pacific University.
Hasan Yahya First Palestinian American to achieve 2 Ph.D degrees, recommended to Guinness book of records as the most Arab American author published over 70 books in two years. A former professor of Sociology at Jackson Community College.

Politics

Camille Bud George, member of Pennsylvania House of Representatives
George P. Shadid, Illinois State Police Sherrif, Illinois State Senator (immigrated from Lebanon)

Writers

Elmaz Abinader, author, playwright and activist; PEN Oakland/Josephine Miles Literary Award recipient
Munir Akash, author and translator; founding editor of Jusoor and Targa Europa (Decoration of Europe) recipient
Naseeb Arida, publisher associated with the New York Pen League
Wadi Bahout, poet and member of the New York Pen League
William Catzeflis, poet and member of the New York Pen League
Joseph Geha, author of Through and Through
Abdal-Masih Haddad, publisher associated with the New York Pen League
Nudra Haddad, poet and member of the New York Pen League (Russel Simmons Presents Def Poetry Jam on Broadway)
Natalie Handal, poet, editor and PEN Oakland/Josephine Miles Literary Award recipient
D.H. Melhem, literary scholar and activist, American Book Award recipient
Gregory Orfalea, poet, essayist and historian
Salom Rizk, author of early Arab American immigrant autobiography, Syrian Yankee
Ramzi M. Salti, author of The Native Informant: Six Tales of Defiance from the Arab World
Evelyn Shakir, literary scholar

Others

Kuttab, Jonathan human rights Palestinian activist, New York bar member.

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"Arabs" from matrilineal line

Traditionally Arab culture reckons descent through the father only. I think this tradition is irrational and offensive, and it's slowly changing (now in Egypt and all of North Africa you are considered ethnically Arab through matrilineal descent, at least under the law), but it's still relevant to cultural perception. Therefore, should we be including as "Arabs" anyone with Arab descent on the matrilineal line, without reference to secondary sources referring to them explicitly as Arab? GergisBaki (talk) 13:58, 10 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

"I think this tradition is irrational and offensive"

Did anyone ask about your opinion? Why are you telling us what you think!. I can't tell whether you are trolling or not.

"it's slowly changing (now in Egypt and all of North Africa you are considered ethnically Arab through matrilineal descent, at least under the law)"

That's interesting. Could you provide sources for this?

--SharabSalam (talk) 16:56, 10 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I probably shouldn't have added my opinion. As to the changes I'm referring to, see: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Egyptian_nationality_law, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Algerian_nationality_law#Discrimination_against_women, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tunisian_nationality_law#Transmission_of_nationality_by_the_mother, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moroccan_nationality_law

What do you think of my general point? Should we have a different standard for including matrilineally-descended Arabs in this list? Right now it appears that anyone with known descent from an Arabic-speaking nationality (on the paternal or maternal line) is added to the Arab american list. GergisBaki (talk) 21:06, 10 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

GergisBaki, including matrilineally-descended Arabs would be okay if there are sources that describe these Arabs as Arabs, whether they are matrilineally-descended Arabs or not is not relevant.

If there is a matrilineally-descended Arab but sources dont describe him/her as an Arab we can't write that they are Arab. This would be considered original research and maybe a violation of WP:BLP.

The law in Egypt is all about obtaining the Egyptian citizenship, you can apply for an Egyptian citizenship if your mother is Egyptian. Egypt doesn't have ethnic-based classifications. When you said that in "Egypt and all of North Africa you are considered ethnically Arab through matrilineal descent" you made it sound like if you are talking about ethnicities and that Egypt is going to consider you as Arab if you have a matrilineally-descended Arab mother.--SharabSalam (talk) 21:53, 10 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Well, I'm no expert on Egypt but in North Africa at least (by which I mean countries like Algeria, Tunisia, etc) there is a notion of matrilineal ethnicity descent socially. In the Gulf I don't think there is such a notion (though you would know this better than I). As to the legal changes I referenced, my expectation would be that they may change social ideas about ethnicity as well. (The West used to have a strict patrilineal conception of ethnicity too, and this changed along with feminist legal reforms.) But this is out of the scope of Wikipedia.

Are you agreeing with me that we should apply a different standard to matrilineal-descended Arabs on this page? I.E. That we should include them only if RS describe them as Arab? (Whereas we can include patrilineally descended Arabs as a matter of course?) GergisBaki (talk) 22:00, 10 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

As of now btw the page includes lots of matrilineally-descended Arabs. If you control-f for "mother" you'll find a lot of these cases. GergisBaki (talk) 22:03, 10 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Somalis

People of Somali descent count as "arabs"? Somalia belongs to the Arab League, but they don't speak arabic.--MiguelMadeira (talk) 16:05, 22 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

ethnic backgrounds

about the heavy genetic mixes of individuals with certain dominant genetic DNA 41.113.170.240 (talk) 10:24, 12 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Frank Zappa: Lebanese?

In the Article, the "Real Frank Zappa Book" is referenced as evidence for his supposedly Arab Lebanese ancestry.

Quote:

"My ancestry is Sicilian, Greek, Arab and French. My mother's mother was French and Sicilian, and her Dad was Italian (from Naples). She was first generation. The Greek-Arab side is from my Dad..."

Can it be that Zappa just referred to the fact that his Dad is Sicilian? Historically, Sicily has been first colonized by the Greeks (and still has impressive monuments from the Greek era) and then in the early Middle Ages conquered by the Arabs before it was taken over by the Normans and then by the Roman-German Emperors. Both the Normans and Roman-Germans tolerated Islam and the Arab language for a while. Emperor Frederick II of Staufen had Arab Saracene bodyguards who were extremely loyal to him but created havoc on his occasional visits to Germany, alongside his very impressive Harem and his collection of wild African animals. Very much similar to the havoc Frank Zappa and the mothers created at their first gigs over here in Krautland ... ;-)

Any concrete evidence that Zappas paternal ancestry is genuinely Greek / Arab would be appreciated.

Fritzanneke (talk) 21:04, 11 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Richard Hanania

Richard Hanania, political scientist and former alt-right blogger, is of Palestinian descent. In my opinion, he is prominent enough to be included on this list. 141.226.89.156 (talk) 11:00, 17 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]