Talk:Khalili Collection of Swedish Textiles

A fact from Khalili Collection of Swedish Textiles appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 31 August 2020 (check views). The text of the entry was as follows:

Did you know... that Nasser Khalili assembled the Khalili Collection of Swedish Textiles (item pictured) because he felt that art historians undervalued works by anonymous creators?

A record of the entry may be seen at Wikipedia:Recent additions/2020/August. The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Khalili Collection of Swedish Textiles.

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Paid editing declaration

I began this article as part of a GLAM partnership with the Khalili Collections (see the project page for more details) for which I am currently (February-August 2020) Wikimedian In Residence. This is why the article was submitted through Articles For Creation. MartinPoulter (talk) 09:51, 31 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Vincent60030 (talk) 15:28, 20 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Article history

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Swedish tapestry from the Khalili Collection

... that the Khalili Collection of Swedish Textiles was assembled over twenty-five years? "His collection of textiles from southern Sweden has been assembled over the past twenty-five years." Franses 1996 p.10

Reviewed: Robert Lee Durham
Comment: The lead paragraph and Exhibitions section of this article are mostly taken from a previously-published, openly-licenced source. The rest — the bulk of the article — is original text. There is some text in common with Swedish carpets and rugs, because some text from this article has been pasted there. Considering just the new text that is specific to this article, that comes to more than 1,900 characters.

Moved to mainspace by MartinPoulter (talk). Self-nominated at 13:45, 30 July 2020 (UTC).[reply]

Comment The hook is not very hooky, collections are often assembled over time. Options I see at a quick glance (without checking sources) might be it being the only collection of Swedish flatweaves outside of Sweden, something about wedding ceremonies and fertility, something about the open mouth deer. CMD (talk) 03:14, 8 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

GTG. New & long enough, well-referenced (though effectively to a single source, funded by the collector - I'm ok with this here). Neutral, though I'm surprised the long article manages not to mention folk art, which is what this essentially is. Earwig picks up the lead and exhibitions as explained above. Pic is ok for MP. Johnbod (talk) 02:06, 10 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hi @MartinPoulter: I came by to promote this, but as the reviewer mentioned, the hook isn't very interesting. Do you like any of the following:

ALT1 ... that many of the works in the Khalili Collection of Swedish Textiles were created by women, who wove in symbolic decorations to demonstrate their skills ahead of marriage?

ALT2 ... that Nasser Khalili assembled the Khalili Collection of Swedish Textiles because he felt art historians undervalued works by anonymous creators?

ALT3 ... that works in the Khalili Collection of Swedish Textiles depict hunt scenes, lions, mythological horses, and the annunciation?

The Squirrel Conspiracy (talk) 22:07, 11 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I didn't actually mention it, though perhaps I should have done. None of those really grab. Perhaps the nominator can think of something? Woven by women on farms in preparing for weddings maybe... Johnbod (talk) 22:21, 11 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I personally like all three of these new suggestions, especially ALT2 and ALT3. ALT1 isn't ideal because all the works in the collection were made by women (stated in second para of the Background section), many of them for wedding ceremonies and the hook could give the impression that only "many" of them are by women. If ALT2 and ALT3 are not acceptable because of Johnbod's objections, then we could take Chipmunkdavis' first suggestion:

ALT4 ... that the Khalili Collection of Swedish Textiles (item pictured) is the only extensive collection of Swedish flatweaves outside of Sweden? "He has also amassed a collection of Meiji period Japanese decorative arts, 2,000 pieces strong; the only extensive collection of Swedish flatweaves outside the country, and an unrivalled collection of Spanish damascene metalwork" Susan Moore, "The collection is a symphony" Financial Times 17 March 2008 (ref 5 in the current version of article) MartinPoulter (talk) 13:43, 13 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Official petition to (whatever the hook) change the image to a close up of File:Khalili Collection Swedish Textiles SW032.jpg for ~~undeniably superior artistry~~ more clarity at a small size and more obvious cultural relevance to Sweden. CMD (talk) 13:59, 13 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Chipmunkdavis: I'm open to this. Do you want to do the crop? MartinPoulter (talk) 19:30, 13 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Something like this. CMD (talk) 01:36, 14 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

A bit Christmas sweatery though? Johnbod (talk) 02:46, 14 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Khalili Collection of Christmas sweaters. It can be something else (although I don't think any would look out of place on a Christmas sweater), but the image would benefit from being be more zoomed in than showing the entire bird tapestry. CMD (talk) 03:03, 14 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

If the original is too small at thumbnail size, and CMD's suggestion is too blocky, then how about this cropped version of the first image? MartinPoulter (talk) 12:57, 14 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

This all raises a question, as the rules say the image must be used in the article. I've queried at Wikipedia_talk:Did_you_know#Using_a_crop_of_the_article_image. Johnbod (talk) 14:14, 14 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Ok, that has been resolved, but I see only the original image has an OTRS ticket - the others have a copyright assertion that doesn't obviously match that on the website. I suppose they are ok under Bridgeman-Corel though. Seeing the above, I think that this might be the best hook:

ALT5 ... that the works in the Khalili Collection of Swedish Textiles (one pictured) were made by women, mostly on farms and in preparation for weddings?

Johnbod (talk) 16:13, 14 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

As I've proposed the last hook. Was GTG for the original hook and picture (or the crop of that). See above for hook queries & on the other pic. No objections to the deer as a pic (licence apart)< & I like the single bird. ALT4 checks out too. Johnbod (talk) 22:16, 15 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- On licencing, I believe under Commons policy all of these images may actually fall under public domain per PD-Art (so we could even use a superior reindeer). Using ALT5 would require the references in the article to be duplicated after each relevant sentence, but aside from that I would be willing to promote it (AGFing on sources). Also happy to promote ALT4 too. MartinPoulter, can you confirm which ALT you would prefer and which picture would be preferred to go with it? CMD (talk) 16:15, 18 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Chipmunkdavis: I think a lot of suggestions have strengths and I've learned a lesson about not suggesting such an uninspiring initial hook. I've very grateful to everyone for their input. My personal preference is for ALT4 and for the last image, i.e. File:Khalili Collection Swedish Textiles SW093.jpg CROP.jpg MartinPoulter (talk) 10:45, 20 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Confirming Johnbod's assessment, noting preference for ALT4 and this bird

. CMD (talk) 12:35, 20 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

ALT4 ... that the Khalili Collection of Swedish Textiles (item pictured) is the only extensive collection of Swedish flatweaves outside of Sweden?