Talk:Jessica Nabongo

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The primary source of content dispute here seems to be among fans of the article subject vs. those of Woni Spotts. Both women claim a 'first to do' title, both seem to have engaged in UPE. Valereee (talk) 13:00, 4 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]

August 2024

Hello! I would like to request the following change to this page, as it is currently locked.

Please remove the following sentence from the first paragraph: "Her assertion she was the first Black woman to have done so was disputed by Woni Spotts, who said she had completed visits to every country in 2018."

This sentence does not belong here and should be placed further down on the page. Contrary to your earlier claims, it is not what makes Nabongo notable. I have found over 100 reputable sources, including The New York Times, USA Today, Forbes, Washington Post, Good Morning America, CNN, National Geographic, and Outside magazine, that mention Jessica Nabongo as the first Black woman to visit every country in the world, without any mention of Woni Spotts.

National Geographic Partners, LLC, owned by The Walt Disney Company and National Geographic Society, is the publisher of Nabongo's first book, which confirms that she is the first Black woman to travel to every country in the world. This is a highly vetted source with fact-checkers.

I would also like to respond to your previous comment about a "scholar" disagreeing. I reviewed the study you reference, and it does not confirm Spotts' claims. The text only confirms that the claim is being disputed. The author only briefly mentions Woni Spotts, and the section detailing Spotts' claim of being the first Black woman visiting every country in the world does not have a source.

Lastly, I must mention that you have previously wrote "I see we've removed all mention of the Woni Spotts controversy. This seems a little strange, as it's possibly what make this woman actually notable". As I stated earlier, there are over 100 online sources referencing Nabongo, her claim and other achievements without any mention of Spotts. It seems like there have not really been a "controversy" and the facts are well-established. The "controversy" is NOT what makes the woman notable, and your previous statement makes me question your impartiality.

Please make the change requested at your earliest convenience. Log6849129 (talk) 12:48, 8 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, not the controversy by itself. The claim and recognition, which the controversy is an important element in. We can't really remove it from the lead, as it's one of the most important elements in the article. I know this is not what you want, but a Wikipedia article isn't usually what the subject wants it to be. You can make your LinkedIn, FaceBook, Instagram, blog, book -- everything you have control over -- say whatever you like. A Wikipedia article is not within the subject's control.

If you'd like to get further input, you can do it at WP:Teahouse. Valereee (talk) 16:10, 8 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

What do you mean my Linkedin? I have not traveled to every country, not sure why you are assuming that? I am requesting a third party review on this, because you are clearly biased on this issue. Log6849129 (talk) 20:01, 8 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

abandoned dispute

Dispute raised at DRN here and closed as abandoned. Valereee (talk) 22:02, 14 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

New request October 2024

can you please put back those additions I made to the page? It took me time and effort to research and find proper sources from everything. All of those were facts and supported by proper sources, including the book she wrote and the fact that she interviewed Kamala Harris, that is literally on the White House Youtube channel. Log6849129 (talk) 20:39, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Sources need to be WP:independent. Valereee (talk) 22:42, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

What about the below sources is not independent? The Detroit News, ted.com, ted.com, IUCN World Conservation Congress website, The White House?

Furthermore, the lead of the current article is incorrect. I am starting a new dispute. Log6849129 (talk) 09:15, 14 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Her TED talk is referenced at ted.com,^[1] and ted.com.^[2] Ted.com talking about TED is not independent.

Her IUCN talk is cited to IUCN.^[3] Ditto.

Her conversation with Harris is referenced to the White House.^[4] Ditto.

The problem here is not that we think these things didn't happen. We think no independent reliable source is discussing them. We need someone else, in a reliable source, talking about these things. Valereee (talk) 16:28, 14 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

what do you mean you think it did not happen? There's a video of it? Here are some more sources referencing the TED talk:

https://www.ahotellife.com/jessica-nabongo-in-conversation-with-tansy-kaschak/

https://goodlifedetroit.com/seven-inspiring-ted-talks-tedxdetroit/

https://unearthwomen.substack.com/p/follow-these-inspiring-women-in-travel

https://www.globalindian.com/videos/must-watch-ted-talks/we-are-seven-billion-neighbours-sharing-this-single-neighbourhood-called-earth-says-jessica-nabongo-in-this-video-she-is-the-first-black-woman-to-travel-to-every-country-of-the-wor/

video of ted talk: https://www.ted.com/talks/jessica_nabongo_the_world_is_our_neighborhood?subtitle=en

Can you please explain why did remove "author"? Here are some independent sources about the book, it's really easy to find with a simple google search:

https://eu.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/wayne/2024/07/25/meet-jessica-nabongo-the-detroit-woman-whos-visited-every-country-on-planet-earth/74501325007/

https://www.afar.com/magazine/jessica-nabongo-on-her-new-book-the-catch-me-if-you-can

https://eu.detroitnews.com/story/entertainment/books/2022/06/14/world-traveling-detroiter-jessica-nabongo-shares-journey-new-memoir/7608924001/

https://eu.usatoday.com/story/travel/2022/06/14/catch-me-if-you-can-jessica-nabongo-memoir-black-travel/7612420001/

https://travelnoire.com/jessica-nabongo-first-black-woman-to-visit-all-195-countries-to-release-book-in-june

https://news.wm.edu/2023/03/27/travel-writer-influencer-jessica-nabongo-to-give-wms-mcswain-walker-lecture/

https://edition.cnn.com/travel/article/jessica-nabongo-traveling-every-country/index.html

https://www.barrons.com/articles/20-minutes-with-traveler-photographer-and-author-jessica-nabongo-01658158630

The book has a Goodreads page with over 300 reviews: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/58950864-the-catch-me-if-you-can Log6849129 (talk) 16:43, 14 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

White house source: https://www.foxnews.com/media/kamala-harris-laughs-after-saying-theres-work-done-female-leaders-united-states Log6849129 (talk) 16:44, 14 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

No, I did not say I didn't think these things happened. In fact I said the exact opposite: The problem here is not that we think these things didn't happen. (emphasis added)

The problem here is whether they're worth including. Not everything the woman has ever done or said is worth including. One of the ways we decide whether something is worth including is how many people are talking about it, and at what length, in reliable independent sources.

A Hotel Life is an interview, it's considered a self-source, good for basic details like place of birth, age, etc. Good Life Detroit is a blog, not considered a reliable source except in extremely limited cases. Substack, ditto. Global Indian is just the TED talk itself? We need someone discussing it, not simple proof it exists. William & Mary is not independent, as they're promoting one of their own events. Good Reads is crowdsourced, not considered reliable. I've pointed you at wp:independent and wp:reliable before. Please read the links. I am really feeling like I shouldn't have to keep telling you the reasons we can't use the sources you keep trying to argue we should be using. I am a volunteer here, and I could be spending my time trying to help someone who will at least try to understand.

The Detroit News, USA Today, CNN, Barrons, Fox, we can use. Author looks like it just got removed in the revert, I'll add that back in.

The interview...the source is reliable for the fact it occurred, but meh. The source doesn't discuss Nabongo except to name her and refer to her as a travel blogger. Is it really something readers need to know in order to understand the article subject, that Nabongo once interviewed the VP? It seems like a pretty minor detail. We can discuss it, but really that kind of thing should probably go on her LinkedIn, not into an encyclopedia article about her. Valereee (talk) 19:40, 14 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

At the very least the bibliography should be reinstated.

It's irrelevant that you are a volunteer. You seem to suggest that you have a final say in what appears on this page, but I think it would be useful for the community to invite in a third party as you are clearly biased. Log6849129 (talk) 20:09, 14 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I have now added this discussion to the list at WP:3O. Topic: Disagreement about whether the content removed in Special:Diff/1250538557 should be restored. ~ ToBeFree (talk) 21:04, 14 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I still need assistance from a third party. It seems like there's only been a very superficial review. Log6849129 (talk) 19:52, 18 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

References

^ "TEDxDetroit | TED". www.ted.com. Retrieved 2024-09-12.
^ Nabongo, Jessica (2019-11-20). The World is Our Neighborhood. Retrieved 2024-09-12 – via www.ted.com.
^ "Speaker Jessica NABONGO". IUCN World Conservation Congress 2020. Retrieved 2024-09-12.
^ House, The White (2023-04-06). "Remarks by Vice President Harris in Moderated Conversation Following Her Historic Trip to Africa". The White House. Retrieved 2024-09-12.

Response to third opinion request:

I looked over it and the original edit describing her as an author, if she is one, looks better IMO. The statements aren't mutually exclusive and can both exist in that space. Me-123567-Me (talk) 19:18, 15 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Me-123567-Me (talk) 19:18, 15 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

No objection to author rather than writer, made that change. Valereee (talk) 22:42, 15 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

You should add the title of the book to the Career section. Otherwise what is she the author of? Log6849129 (talk) 11:35, 16 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Done Valereee (talk) 12:50, 16 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

"other writing"? Log6849129 (talk) 15:27, 16 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I think my previous version looks better: Her first book, The Catch Me If You Can: One Woman's Journey to Every Country in The World, was published in 2022.

The sentence you wrote has a minor grammatical issue. Log6849129 (talk) 15:30, 16 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

could you fix please? Log6849129 (talk) 15:42, 18 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

can you please explain the rationale behind calling the book "other writing"? Does that make sense? Log6849129 (talk) 19:50, 18 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The main writing is the blog, the book is other writing? Valereee (talk) 02:59, 19 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ongoing COI

Note ongoing attempts to influence the article by COI contributors. Valereee (talk) 03:22, 19 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

[1] "TEDxDetroit | TED". www.ted.com. Retrieved 2024-09-12.

[2] Nabongo, Jessica (2019-11-20). The World is Our Neighborhood. Retrieved 2024-09-12 – via www.ted.com.

[3] "Speaker Jessica NABONGO". IUCN World Conservation Congress 2020. Retrieved 2024-09-12.

[4] House, The White (2023-04-06). "Remarks by Vice President Harris in Moderated Conversation Following Her Historic Trip to Africa". The White House. Retrieved 2024-09-12.

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