Talk:Isaiah 42

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PROFRINGE

Mainstream historians do not accept real predictive prophecy, so the view I have reverted is WP:PROFRINGE. The historical method razes predictive prophecies with Occam's razor. The existence of predictive prophecies is a matter of metaphysics or theology, not one of epistemology (there are no such things as supernatural prophecies in epistemology). tgeorgescu (talk) 12:24, 23 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Islamic interpretation: sloppy edit, failed verification

"Isaiah 42:11 also mentions that the people of "Sela" - interpreted here as the mountain of Sela near present-day Medina, Saudi Arabia - would "sing for joy" and "shout from the mountain tops", and so interpret this passage as prophesising the coming of Muhammad and his migration to Medina." Reference: Rubin, Uri (1995). The eye of the beholder: the life of Muḥammad as viewed by the early Muslims: a textual analysis. Volume 5 of Studies in late antiquity and early Islam. Darwin Press. For 1995 edition see here.

Failed verification. Searches in 1995 ed. for Sela: 0 hits. For Isaiah 42: 3 hits, on pp. 30, 218, 226, none relating to any mountain, rejoicing, etc. The other editions at Google Books offer no preview, this one has snippet view. NO PAGE INDICATED, making the edit even more sloppy and implausible. It also had "(title), vol. 5", which is utterly wrong - the book only has 1 volume, but is itself vol. 5 in a series, "Studies in late antiquity and early Islam". I fixed this. The 2nd rwf placed at end of paragraph only covered the first half of it; I moved it up to where it belongs. Text also firmly identified Sela with mount at Medina, which seems true only in this narrow context (see Sela (Edom), probably meant in most biblical contexts). Also inaccurate wording, "seen as a prophecy of Muhammad" sounds like a prophecy MADE BY M'd; I replaced with "seen as prophesising the coming of Muhammad".

The initial edit which introduced the ref remains useless and not trustworthy. Unless fixed or replaced by other source, this passage about Sela must be removed. Shame, looks like an interesting info. Arminden (talk) 12:52, 3 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

JohnThorne, hi and thank you for the great work. I see this art. is largely yours. Maybe you wish to look up this issue. The material about Sela I'm unhappy about was first introduced last year by Hamza A. Durrani - hi, maybe you can fix it now. Thanks to both. Arminden (talk) 13:12, 3 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

This is exactly what happens when people lean too heavily on vague interpretations and wishful thinking rather than examination, the blatant errors in your reference to Uri Rubin's work are a prime example, someone quite irresponsibly decided to connect dots that weren't there misrepresenting both the biblical text and Islamic tradition in a feeble attempt to rewrite history

I'll dive deeper and bring in more reliable references that can shed light on Islamic interpretations of these scriptures, because clearly there's a lot to unpack here Looshroom (talk) 08:36, 4 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]