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Talk:Ice hockey at the 2014 Winter Olympics – Men's tournament

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Quarterfinals

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Sweden is qualified to quarterfinals. If they end up on equal points as Czech republic or Switzerland they'll win the group due to better head-to-head record. Are we planning to colorize teams that qualify directly to the quarterfinals? I noticed green was used last olympics. -- Lejman (talk) 14:52, 14 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Nobody is qualified for anything yet. Sweden could still finish second in their group based on goal differential; head-to-head record does not come into it. Rdroze (talk) 19:38, 14 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]
I'm pretty sure you are wrong, @Rdroze. If Sweden loses to Latvia, they'll finish with 6 points. For either Switzerland or Czech Republic to tie Sweden, they would need to beat the other -- there's no chance for a 3-way tie. Sweden has defeated both Switzerland and Czech Republic head-to-head, so they would win any tiebreaker. Sweden has clinched Group C and is guaranteed a quarterfinal berth. MrArticleOne (talk) 19:41, 14 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]
OK, this is really confusing. This page (http://sochi2014.iihf.com/men/information/#tournament-format) mentions both head-to-head record, and this:

The following criteria will be used in the order presented to determine this ranking following completion of the Preliminary Round (1D – 12D):

  • Higher position in the group
  • Higher number of points
  • Better goal difference
  • Higher number of goals scored for
  • Better 2013 IIHF World Ranking
I understand the 'tie breaking criteria' as being what determines every team's placement within the group. Once the placements within the groups have been determined, the teams get seeded 1D-12D based on the Preliminary round ranking criterias. (Where the main decider, as noted below, is the team's placement within the group.) -- Lejman (talk) 20:18, 14 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]
You may be right, but that's not at all clear from their own description. Why would they not just add in something like "Head-to-head record, if available" as the second ranking criteria? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rdroze (talk • contribs) 20:41, 14 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]
I guess this seems pretty clear to me. Within a group, there's one set of tiebreakers that applies. In an in-group tie, the tiebreaker is head-to-head. This is because the teams in each group need to be ordered 1-2-3-4. Once each group is ordered 1-2-3-4, we then form the cumulative "Group D," where the three 1st place teams are 1D-3D, then the 2nd-place teams are 4D-6D, etc. Within each tier ("higher position in the group"), the teams are then ranked by points, then goal differential, then goals for, and then IIHF Ranking. One set of tiebreakers is used for a situation where the teams will have played each other, as will be the case in group play. The other set is used for a situation where the teams won't have played each other, as when you take 12 teams and seed them across 3 groups that don't play inter-group games, but need to come up with a single 1-12 ranking at the conclusion of group play. MrArticleOne (talk) 20:50, 14 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Guys, keep in mind the Finland-Canada game is yet to be played. It can propel either team up to first seed, or down to sixth seed (if the games ends very lopsided, ruining one of the teams' goal difference. Russia needs to wins the shootout to finish ahead of the loser though). -- Lejman (talk) 14:56, 16 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Indeed. These are the possible outcomes:
  • If the Finland-Canada match is going to an overtime, than the winner will be 3D, the loser 4D, 1D is Sweden, 2D is United States, 5D is Russia and 6D is Switzerland.
  • If it ends in regular time, than the winner will be 1D, Sweden 2D, United States 3D. The further rankings (4D, 5D, 6D) depend on the goal difference:
    • If Finland wins with at most 5 goals difference, then: Canada 4D, Russia 5D, Switzerland 6D.
    • If Finland wins with 6 or 7 goals difference, then: Russia 4D, Canada 5D, Switzerland 6D.
    • If Finland wins with at least 8 goals difference, then: Russia 4D, Switzerland 5D, Canada 6D.
    • If Canada wins with at most 6 goals difference, then: Finland 4D, Russia 5D, Switzerland 6D.
    • If Canada wins with 7 or 8 goals difference, then: Russia 4D, Finland 5D, Switzerland 6D.
    • If Canada wins with at least 9 goals difference, then: Russia 4D, Switzerland 5D, Finland 6D.
So all the seeds from 1D to 6D depend on the match result, and any two of Canada, Finland and Russia can get a first round bye in the play-offs.

Group D

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Folks, I suggest we try to get this right from the start, instead of trying to swim upstream. The Group D rankings are going to go first by standing within the group -- at least assuming that they're using the same format as last time, which has been widely reported. So, the 3 group winners will be 1D-2D-3D. Then the 2nd-place teams will be 4D-5D-6D. The teams should be ordered by tier first, then points. MrArticleOne (talk) 19:39, 14 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Ranking Codes

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What's the correct format? <Number><Letter> or <Letter><Number> (for example, is it "1D" or "D1")? Seems to be a mix of both formats in the article, depending on the editor. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.212.139.102 (talk) 19:15, 17 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

The IIHF, unfortunately, uses both. See http://sochi2014.iihf.com/men/information/ MrArticleOne (talk) 12:32, 18 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Are bracket and semi final game listing inconsistent?

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The bracket shows, in the semi final, F1 playing F4 and F2 playing F3, which agrees with what is reported on NBC's Olympic coverage.

The game time / location listing in the semi final section shows WQF1 playing WQF2, and WQF3 playing WQF4, which appears inconsistent with the bracket. It's possible I don't understand what WQFx means.

Smitty48823 (talk) 00:24, 18 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I'm sure what was intended by WQFx was "winner of quarterfinal x." But it probably should match the seeding designations that the IIHF is using, although there is no substantive difference. MrArticleOne (talk) 12:34, 18 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

According to IIHf, the bracket is this: http://sochi2014.iihf.com/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.114.133.206 (talk) 20:04, 18 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

About the playoff bracket

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I'm sure we should use more standard template for 2014 ice hockey tournament. For too long, hockey has used a template that is different from the ones used for all other Olympic sports. I would discuss that the seed received by a team could be display next to the team on every round.

Alright, here is my kind of templates I would suggest:

Group phase

Team GP W OTW OTL L GF GA GDF PTS
 Jamaica 3 2 1 0 0 11 2 +9 8
 Trinidad and Tobago 3 2 0 1 0 11 4 +7 7
 Uruguay 3 1 0 0 2 5 10 -5 3
 Puerto Rico 3 0 0 0 3 3 14 -11 0
Team GP W OTW OTL L GF GA GDF PTS
 Turkmenistan 3 2 0 0 1 10 5 +5 6
 Saudi Arabia 3 2 0 0 1 10 6 +4 6
 Iran 3 2 0 0 1 10 6 +4 6
 Pakistan 3 0 0 0 3 0 13 -13 0
Team GP W OTW OTL L GF GA GDF PTS
 Kenya 3 1 2 0 0 14 8 +6 7
 Egypt 3 2 0 0 1 19 8 +9 6
 Ivory Coast 3 1 0 1 1 5 14 -9 4
 Ghana 3 0 0 1 2 5 13 -8 1

Seeding

Seed Team GF GA GDF PTS
A1  Jamaica 11 2 +9 8
C1  Kenya 14 8 +6 7
B1  Turkmenistan 10 5 +5 6
A2  Trinidad and Tobago 11 4 +7 7
C2  Egypt 19 8 +9 6
B2  Saudi Arabia 10 6 +4 6
B3  Iran 10 6 +4 6
C3  Ivory Coast 5 14 -9 4
A3  Uruguay 5 10 -5 3
C4  Ghana 5 13 -8 1
A4  Puerto Rico 3 14 -11 0
B4  Pakistan 0 13 -13 0

Elimination round

1st round Quarterfinals Semifinals Gold medal game
            
A1  Jamaica 4
A3  Uruguay 2
C3  Ivory Coast 2
A3  Uruguay 3
A1  Jamaica 6
B3  Iran 4
C1  Kenya 0
B3  Iran 2
B3  Iran 6
C4  Ghana 0
A1  Jamaica 2
A2  Trinidad and Tobago 0
B1  Turkmenistan 7
A4  Puerto Rico 1
B2  Saudi Arabia 0
A4  Puerto Rico 1
B1  Turkmenistan 1
A2  Trinidad and Tobago 3
Bronze medal game
A2  Trinidad and Tobago 4 B3  Iran 4
C2  Egypt 1 B1  Turkmenistan 1
C2  Egypt 5
B4  Pakistan 3

Final standings

Rank Team
 Jamaica
 Trinidad and Tobago
 Iran
4  Turkmenistan
5  Kenya
6  Egypt
7  Uruguay
8  Puerto Rico
9  Saudi Arabia
10  Ivory Coast
11  Ghana
12  Pakistan

AaronWikia (talk) 20:56, 17 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I think the present playoff bracket is appropriate. The way the IIHF sorts the teams is to place them all in the composite "Group D" at the end of the Preliminary Round. References to their Preliminary Round group position (e.g., A3) suggests that team A3 was always destined to be placed on that particular line of the bracket, as is the case in other sports (e.g., the FIFA World Cup), but that is not true with the hockey tournament. MrArticleOne (talk) 12:30, 18 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]
Per MrArticleOne. It's good as it is. Kante4 (talk) 20:58, 18 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Suggestion

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I have placed WSF1-WSF2-LSF1-LSF2 as placeholder text in the seeding boxes for the medal games. This tracks conventional designations: winner/loser of semifinal 1/2. I suggest that, once the medal game pairings are determined, we change those seeding designations to the F[x] designations the IIHF is using for the teams now. Reading the IIHF's description of the tournament format, the F[x] designations are the last seeding-type designations that it mentions. http://sochi2014.iihf.com/men/information/ Note that the winner of, e.g., 1D-E4 "become[s] F1," with no further indication that it becomes something else after the Semifinal games are over. MrArticleOne (talk) 23:22, 19 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

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