Talk:I know that I know nothing

Philosophy: Epistemology / Logic / Ancient High‑importance

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Text and/or other creative content from this version of Socratic paradox was copied or moved into I know that I know nothing with this edit on 5 March 2013. The former page's history now serves to provide attribution for that content in the latter page, and it must not be deleted as long as the latter page exists.

Greek article

I am a little appalled by the fact that this article still doesn't have a Greek version. Come on Greek pals, this is one of your greatest contributions to the world !!--187.21.144.89 (talk) 06:42, 24 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Moved from article

The following question had been placed in the article. I moved it here. —BillC ^talk 11:12, 19 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The translations from Ancient Greek into other languages shows same impreciseness?

This article needs a lot of work as it misses the real point that Socrates was trying to express. For example, the section from Apology is mistranslated. It should read "this man thinks he knows something, when he does not know it, but I, when I do not know something, neither do I believe that I know it." The crucial part has been omitted in the translation posted here.

Furthermore, the conclusions drawn are also incorrect. The point for Socrates is that the true path to wisdom begins with realizing one's own lack of knowledge. Only when one realizes that he is lacking will he then begin to address his shortcomings. It is by no means clear that Socrates doubts that a human can attain reliable knowledge, as is suggested in this article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bellerephon1 (talk • contribs) 01:39, 29 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

That reminds of Taoism

Is there any Sources covered connection? [funny thing: I'm Greek but it came to mind]. --62.1.24.60 (talk) 22:39, 9 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

It pops up a couple of times in the Tao Te Ching. Lao Tzu calls himself a fool in chapter 20, and the principle is discussed further in chapter 71. There might be other chapters, too.--130.126.107.194 (talk) 04:14, 11 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Better wording

I suggest renaming the article to, "I know that I don't know" —Preceding unsigned comment added by 134.193.112.62 (talk) 20:39, 14 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Original Greek

In Plato's Apology of Socrates there is indeed a phrase that comes very close to 'I know that I know nothing': ἐμαυτῷ συνῄδη οὐδὲν ἐπισταμένῳ (22 d1), that is "I was aware that I knew nothing," or "that I lacked any skill or certain knowledge of anything." — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.71.16.90 (talk) 21:06, 15 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Indeed, this is well-known. In fact, Gail Fine discusses that statement at length and still concludes that "it is better not to attribute" to Socrates the statement "I know that I know nohting." See Gail Fine, "Does Socrates Claim to Know that He Knows Nothing?", Oxford Studies in Ancient Philosophy vol. 35 (2008), pp. 49-88. Isokrates (talk) 22:49, 7 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

(outdent) An editor changed the order of appearance of the falsely attributed phrase in the lead. According to sources the Latin false attribution "ipse se nihil scire id unum sciat" (1st century BC) predates the Greek false attribution "ἓν οἶδα ὅτι οὐδὲν οἶδα." The latter one cannot be dated precisely; the "ὅτι οὐδὲν οἶδα" part appears in some 19th century Katharevousa Greek sources and possible dates include 1837 (Ho theatēs, Issues 11–12, p. 2: "ὅτι οἶδεν οὐδὲν"), 1853 (Anonymus, Prolegomena (preface to Appendix Platonica), paragraph X, p. 62: "οὐδὲν οἶδα οὔτε διδάσκω τι", attributed to Plato; HTML version), and 1878 (Hestia, Vol. 5, p. 232: "εἰδέναι, ὅτι οὐδὲν οἶδα")). The "ἓν οἶδα ὅτι οὐδὲν οἶδα" version appears mostly in 20th and 21st century Greek schoolbooks (e.g., «Αρχαία Ελληνικά, Φιλοσοφικός Λόγος», 9th ed., 2009, p. 34: "Σοφότατος, ο άνθρωπος που διακήρυττε προκλητικά «ἓν οἶδα, ὅτι οὐδὲν οἶδα»" (HTML version); see also the relevant discussion on the Greek Wikipedia). The bottom line is that it would be confusing to place the Greek paraphrase before the Latin one. --Omnipaedista (talk) 22:53, 24 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Diogenes

Is "I know nothing, except the fact of my ignorance" (attributed to Diogenes of Sinope) a phrasing of this?

03:20, 15 July 2013 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.99.140.120 (talk)

Counter

Can this phrase be countered by "I think therefore I am"? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Droonkid (talk • contribs) 23:36, 21 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

i know that i know nothing Can i use it as reference?