Talk:Hundred (county subdivision)/Archive 1

Archive 1

Use in the USA

The main topic lists hundreds as being common in New England, yet the part about hundreds in the USA only mentions states conventionally thought of as in the Mid-atlantic.

Changed; article no longer mentions New England. Akb4 13:01, 26 August 2006 (UTC)

Wapentake

Wapentake is listed under the See also section but then Wapentake redirects back to this Hundred (division) article. Personally I think there should be a separate article for Wapentake, otherwise this is a looping link. 194.203.110.127 10:28, 10 June 2006 (UTC)

It is better to establish a new page for "herred". Herred is derived from "hær" = army. Herred is a country subdivision, and is still used as name for counties in Scandinavia. St.Trond (talk) 15:36, 23 November 2009 (UTC)

Centuriation

Any possible relationship between hundred an centuriation, the word used by Roman surveyors?

• Centuria An area of land equal to 100 heredia.

• Centuriation Limitatio, or, the division of land in which limites divide the land into regular squares or rectangles.

• Century A square or rectangle of a centuriation often divided into 100 plots of land.

 Disdero 16:35, 27 August 2006 (UTC)

Hierarchy

Is there a listing of the complete traditional hierarchy of land sizes? (Hundreds < shires < counties (?)) --JD79 16:30, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

anachronism

The coexistence on a map of Cornish hundreds and a reference to the'Celtic Sea' is a severe anachronism----Clive Sweeting

Satakunda vs. Satakunta

I think that "Satakunda" is a Swedish form of the Finnish original term "Satakunta". In modern Finnish Satakunta, not Satakunda means hundred. It might be possible that "kunta" is a loan from the Swedish form "kunda", but I'm not sure. Does someone know which is the original form, kunta or kunda?

Also, in modern Finnish "kunta" means muncipality. I'm not sure if this is just a coincidende or if it is derived from "satakunta", but if it's derived from satakunta, I think it deserves a mention.81.175.134.236 22:39, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

You are correct. The original term is Satakunta, which is the name of the region still existing. In my opinion, this is the form used for it in present-day English texts, so we should use it. The word kunta seems to have meant any corporation with fixed membership in old Finnish language. In many words, it is still used with this meaning: ylioppilaskunta "student union", kadettikunta "corps of cadets". Correspondingly, Satakunta implies the meaning "corporation of hundred". However, this is only an implication, not a certain proof of anything. --MPorciusCato 12:11, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

soilder ratio to hundreds

There is mention of X number of warriors:hundred, there is the centeni mentioned in the introduction, there is mention of Leidang as appling to the Anglo-Saxon culture.

What is the ratio of the various methods?

If you make a connection between land-size and that a certain number of soldiers must come from that land, state and proof that ratio. I do not believe I am the only one hanging on to something like this.

How many Centeni did a warrior get? How many warriors were expected to be supplied for every hundred? Have an average number or a range, use that if it is not a constant. Same with the Anglo-Saxon Fyrd. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.171.208.137 (talk) 00:59, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

Ancient land area measurement

Its nothing to do with the romans. A Hundred was 100 Hides, - a measure of land used in Danelaw (North and Eastern) counties in Domesday. A Carucate was equivalent to a hide and represented the amount of land which could be ploughed by one plough team. A bovate was a measure of land which could be ploughed by one eighth of a plough, in other words equivalent to one eighth of a carucate. Therefore a Hundred was equal to 800 Bovate. Its generally accepted that a Hide was 120 acres in modern measure, so a Hundred was in modern terms 12,000 acres. There's 640 acres in a square mile, so a hundred was roughly an area 4.5 miles x 4.5 miles

Since a bovate was the area of land reckoned to be needed to support one family, A hundred was the area of land that could easily support a small village or three.

A Plough was a team of 8 oxen + one man + the plough itself. When people began using horses to plough, one horse + a plough gave rise to another measure - the Rod, the length of a plough team from the horses nose to the heel of the farmer.

A Rod is equal to 5.5 yards, 11 cubits, 5.0292 meters, 16.5 feet, and can also be a square measure, and even today parcels of land for growing food privately, called Allotments, and rented from Local Authorities are usually 17 rods or submultiples in size 17 rods being the area also reckoned to be able to support a family of four people.

As for rating the article 'low importance', i can assure you knowledge of mediaeval land measure is pretty important if you are going to be an historian, archaeologist, surveyopr or architect. Not important to to whom? Some blonde bimbo in california? some psycho taxi driver i nNew York ? Try coming to rural lincolnshire and reassessing that view. I have nothing but contempt for its arrogance.

Lincolnshire Poacher (talk)

~~ well said! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.172.133.13 (talk) 02:40, 14 May 2010 (UTC)

Acre, Hectare, squaremile are all far more important. I have been through rural linconshire and I reassessed how luck I was not to have been there before or have to go back.--Kitchen Knife (talk) 16:01, 1 February 2009 (UTC)

Present status in England and Wales

I notice some infoboxes for English hundreds say "abolished: 19th century". Although the legal and administrative roles of the hundreds were taken away in the 19th century, I believe it's incorrect to say they have been abolished. The lordships of hundreds still exist and some hundreds still have some odd roles. What do people feel we should say about the present status, if anything? Moonraker (talk) 10:09, 9 October 2011 (UTC)

I have been using Template:infobox historic subdivision for Template:Hundreds of Somerset & this has a parameter End= 19th century. This produces "Abolished 19th century" in the display. Although, as Moonraker says, they may not have been "abolished" in some senses they ceased to be significant for administrative purposes. Therefore any suggestions of an alternative approach (or a different infobox to use) would be great.— Rod ^talk 10:23, 9 October 2011 (UTC)

As technically most English hundreds have not been abolished, I don't see how their current status could be covered easily by an infobox, as infoboxes are very black and white, ie: the hundreds either exist or they don't! I think that the best way round would be not to fill in anything, in the infobox for the end date, and then say something, in the body of the article, like The hundred as a judicial and administrative unit was diminished by various acts of parliament in the 19th century... possibly followed by a qualification of what that means for the hundred in question. Not a very elegant solution, but simple and to the point.Wilfridselsey (talk) 13:22, 9 October 2011 (UTC)

I think Wilfridselsey has the answer to this. Moonraker (talk) 08:57, 10 October 2011 (UTC)

Seems reasonable however for the (Somerset) hundreds I've been looking at I've found no information (let alone reliable sources) describing the current lordships of hundreds or other "odd roles". Does anyone know of a good source for these?— Rod ^talk 18:58, 10 October 2011 (UTC)

Rod. Victoria County History is a good starting point. If you live in Somerset then your library should have a local reference section, also the county will have a County Historian who should be contactable, most are approachable, so will answer questions or point you in the right direction. From the Somerset County Website, it looks like they have a lot of resources that could help you. Wilfridselsey (talk) 20:13, 10 October 2011 (UTC)

To give a short answer to your question about the lordships of hundreds, they were and are a form of property, very much like the lordships of manors. As with manors, in some cases the owner is unknown. Moonraker (talk) 23:18, 19 October 2011 (UTC)