Talk:Hollow Knight/GA2

GA Review

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Reviewer: Lee Vilenski (talk · contribs) 14:30, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Hello, I am planning on reviewing this article for GA Status, over the next couple of days. Thank you for nominating the article for GA status. I hope I will learn some new information, and that my feedback is helpful.

If nominators or editors could refrain from updating the particular section that I am updating until it is complete, I would appreciate it to remove a edit conflict. Please address concerns in the section that has been completed above (If I've raised concerns up to references, feel free to comment on things like the lede.)

I generally provide an overview of things I read through the article on a first glance. Then do a thorough sweep of the article after the feedback is addressed. After this, I will present the pass/failure. I may use strikethrough tags when concerns are met. Even if something is obvious why my concern is met, please leave a message as courtesy.

Best of luck! you can also use the {{done}} tag to state when something is addressed. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)}

Please let me know after the review is done, if you were happy with the review! Obviously this is regarding the article's quality, however, I want to be happy and civil to all, so let me know if I have done a good job, regardless of the article's outcome.

Links

The google docs source isn't really suitable. Just cite the actual paper. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:04, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done. I've just removed the ref - the ref after it covered the same information ― Levi_OP^Talk 18:02, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Please don't cite reddit. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:04, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Question: According to WP:REDDIT,
Self-published and questionable sources may be used as sources of information about themselves, usually in articles about themselves or their activities ...
Considering that this is an AMA over reddit, where the post contains info directly from the developer, is this not fine? ― Levi_OP^Talk 15:21, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
If it's not commented about on other RS, it's not all that important to retain. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:35, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done. I see what you're saying now. ― Levi_OP^Talk 17:18, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Prose

Lede

We don't need to cite in the lede, could we not move them into the body? Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:15, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done ― Levi_OP^Talk 17:16, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The lede is a bit short. We have a section on development that isn't mentioned at all. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:15, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done ― Tuna ^No_SurprisesPlease 01:20, 17 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
fighting bosses, and unlocking new powers and abilities to progress through the game - literally about 50% of all games do this. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:15, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: I understand your point here, but arguably the two most unique things about Hollow Knight are it's boss design and various abilities you unlock. They're integral to the progression of the story and are some of the game's main features, which I assume is why they were included in the lede in the first place.― Tuna ^No_SurprisesPlease 21:18, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Can we expand what the critics liked about the game in the led? Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:15, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done ― Tuna ^No_SurprisesPlease 01:20, 17 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

General

Some uncited pieces:
- The game continues from the last visited bench they sat on which are scattered throughout the game world and act as save points. Initially the player can only use Soul to "Focus" and regenerate masks, but as the game progresses players unlock several offensive spells, which consume Soul.
  Done ― Tuna ^No_SurprisesPlease 00:29, 17 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
- If the player defeats the final boss of the game, called "The Hollow Knight", they are given access to a mode called "Steel Soul". In this mode, dying is permanent, and if the Knight loses all of their masks, the save slot will be reset.
  Done ― Tuna ^No_SurprisesPlease 00:29, 17 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
- Equipping a charm takes up a certain number of limited slots, called notches. Wearing a charm that requires more than the available number of notches is possible, but it results in being "overcharmed", causing the Knight to receive double damage from all sources.
  Fixed: Removed the last sentence since there isn't a good source on the mechanic and it's not very notable in the game ― Tuna ^No_SurprisesPlease 00:29, 17 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Plot is very long, can it be shortened? Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:55, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: I've read through the plot section several times now and pretty much all of the information is relevant to the game. The only thing that I would consider removing are the two paragraphs on the endings of the game, as they are arguably the most vital aspects of someone's playthrough, but I will look into shortening them. ― Tuna ^No_SurprisesPlease 16:13, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The only issue I still have, is that WP:VG/PLOT states plot summaries should be no more than 700 words. This one is still over 1000. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:45, 24 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@Lee Vilenski: Pinging as it seems like he hasn't seen this ― Levi_OP^Talk 14:54, 28 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

WP:VG/PLOT states that for expansions, plot summaries of no more than 300 words per content should be presented in the main plot section, or as an additional sub-section. Currently, the article's main plot section is less than 700 characters, and the two expansions are both subsections with less than 300 words. Isn't this fine? ― Levi_OP^Talk 15:24, 24 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The game, considered "not very good", used to hold a 1/5 star rating on Newgrounds[2] but has since increased to 4/5.[11] - where you have a citation in the middle of the sentence, you can probably move to the end of the sentenceBest Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:55, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done ― Levi_OP^Talk 16:11, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
also true for November 2017[35] . Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:55, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done ― Levi_OP^Talk 16:11, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
You only need to link terms once (in the body and the lede each). A$ is linked twice and so is Metroid Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:55, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done ― Levi_OP^Talk 16:11, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
[7][31][32][33][34] - WP:CITEKILL. Try WP:BUNDLING Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:55, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Question: @Lee Vilenski: Considering that these are all references that are also used in other parts on the page, I don't know how bundling them will work. The way bundling is described makes it seem like it's only for multiple references, where this is the first instance of those references and they're all contributing to the same sentence. I think I've seen on other pages that they include a note that has all the references in it without any text, but I don't know if that is standard practice. Could I do something like {{multiref|<ref name="Destruct"/>|<ref name="NLiferev"/>|<ref name="NWRrev"/>|<ref name="PCPPrev"/>|<ref name="VGrev"/>}}? Thanks, ― Levi_OP^Talk 16:46, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Browsing around articles I happened to stumble on just what I'm talking about. The notes in Veteran (JPEGMafia album) include notes that are just multiple references without any text. They're using {{efn}} with all of the references.
Pending approval: I'm going to do this for now, let me know if it's incorrect. ― Levi_OP^Talk 18:39, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
WP:SEAOFBLUE is a bit of an issue. See "2D Metroidvania action-adventure game" having three links. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:55, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done ― Tuna ^No_SurprisesPlease 16:27, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Could we get an image of a producer or something for the development. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:55, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: I've emailed Team Cherry to ask them to upload a photo for this article, but there aren't any free use images that would fit this purpose elsewhere on the internet. ― Tuna ^No_SurprisesPlease 01:26, 17 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
review aggregator Metacritic - same SEAOFBLUE. I usually use "according to review aggregator website Metacritic. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:55, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done ― Tuna ^No_SurprisesPlease 16:27, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Critics recognized the combat system as simple,[29][30] unsurprising[5] or nuanced;[33] they praised its responsiveness, or "tightness", similarly to the movement system. - probably needs to be expanded to say who said what. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:55, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: I changed the wording of it, but since the details of each publication's reviews are expanded upon later in the section, a general overview of what critics generally agree on without explaining who used each word is not harmful to the article. Plus, if someone does want to see which source each word came from, then they can just click on the reference.― Tuna ^No_SurprisesPlease 20:30, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The quotes all seem a bit long. Can we condense? For example: "Charms offer a huge variety of upgrades ... Some charms ... were so essential that removing them felt like trading a part of myself for a better chance at an upcoming battle." Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:55, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done ― Tuna ^No_SurprisesPlease 16:32, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Hollow Knight has sold over 2,800,000 copies - had sold. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:55, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done ― Tuna ^No_SurprisesPlease 16:18, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
NintendoWorldReport stated - paper doesn't speak. There was an author. Also Destructoid "never"Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:55, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done ― Tuna ^No_SurprisesPlease 16:23, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
On IGN, Tom Marks - he's already been referred to in full.Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:55, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done ― Levi_OP^Talk 17:01, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Marks did three seperate reviews? Huh? Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:55, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: It looks like he only did two, as far as I can tell. ― Tuna ^No_SurprisesPlease 16:41, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: His first review on PC Gamer is mentioned, then his IGN review in the next paragraph, and finally the same PC Gamer review is mentioned. I would assume it's like this because the first paragraph is talking about general game thoughts, where the second paragraph goes into more specifics. This could be clarified if it's a huge issue. ― Levi_OP^Talk 17:06, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Review meta comments

I'll begin the review as soon as I can! If you fancy returning the favour, I have a list of nominations for review at WP:GAN and WP:FAC, respectively. I'd be very grateful if you were to complete one of these if you get time. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 14:30, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]