Talk:Helena Springs

Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by SL93 (talk) 22:48, 9 May 2022 (UTC)

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• Comment or view
• Article history

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• ... that Helena Springs is credited as co-writer with Bob Dylan on 19 songs, more than any of his other collaborators? Source: Michael Gray, The Bob Dylan Encyclopedia (2008 edition), page 642. Quote: "She co-wote a larger number of songs with him than any other collaborator in his career – nineteen"
  • Comment: Left the wording slightly open as to whether this is still a record (I believe it is) as the source is from 2008. Always open to any ALT suggestions.

Created by BennyOnTheLoose (talk). Self-nominated at 16:30, 16 April 2022 (UTC).

• Hook is interesting and length complaint. Article is new enough, created on April 16. No obvious copyvio, article is NPOV, no image to review, and QPQ done. The source is written by Michael Gray who is a known expert on Dylan so is RS. Given Dylan's recent activities and age, I think we can reasonably extend some common sense to suppose that the record has not been surpassed in the intervening 13 years since the book's publication. Chetsford (talk) 03:48, 17 April 2022 (UTC)

  I forgot to mention the QPQ - it's Template:Did you know nominations/Khalid ibn Barmak. Regards, BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 09:13, 17 April 2022 (UTC)

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Helena Springs/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: K. Peake (talk · contribs) 09:16, 30 July 2022 (UTC)

Good Article review progress box

Criteria: 1a. prose () 1b. MoS () 2a. ref layout () 2b. cites WP:RS () 2c. no WP:OR () 2d. no WP:CV () 3a. broadness () 3b. focus () 4. neutral () 5. stable () 6a. free or tagged images () 6b. pics relevant () Note: this represents where the article stands relative to the Good Article criteria. Criteria marked are unassessed

This has been in the queue for over two months, making a review well due! --K. Peake 09:16, 30 July 2022 (UTC)

Infobox and lead

• Can't any other parameters like children or spouse be added to the infobox; try genres too if you can source any in the body?

• Amended. I made "Infobox musical artist" a module as it doesn't support the "children" parameter. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 09:35, 1 August 2022 (UTC)

• "(born c. 1961) is an" → "(born c. 1961), is an"
• "She was previously a" → "The singer was first a"
• Wikilink Bob Dylan
• "and appeared on his albums" → "Springs appeared on his albums" starting a new sentence at this point, to avoid a run-on like current
• Pipe compilation to Compilation album
• "she released the albums" → "Springs released the albums"
• "for other artists including" → "for other artists, including"
• "Pet Shop Boys and Elton John." → "Pet Shop Boys, and Elton John."

• Amended the article per the eight points above. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 13:31, 31 July 2022 (UTC)

• Add sentences mentioning Springs' work in cabaret and her relationships plus children to the lead

• Added. Let me know what you think. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 09:35, 1 August 2022 (UTC)

Career

• "aged 5, at" → "aged five, at"
• "When she was 17," → "When Springs was 17,"
• "She appears on" → "She appeared on"
• Pipe compilation to Compilation album
• "with Dylan was her" → "with him was her"
• "than any of Dylan's other" → "than any of his other"
• I would suggest changing claimed to said per WP:CLAIM

• Amended per the seven points above. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 08:13, 1 August 2022 (UTC)

• Should you change "are published" to using were instead for the correct tense?

• Yes, done. The source is from 2008, so "were" seems a better option. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 08:13, 1 August 2022 (UTC)

• "Both of those, and another collaboration, "Stop Now"," → "Both the tracks and fellow collaboration "Stop Now""
• Lowercase the Searchers per MOS:THEMUSIC

• Amended per the two points above. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 08:13, 1 August 2022 (UTC)

• Why is "performed just once" at the end of the sentence when you have already mentioned this fact?

• Incompetence. Now removed. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 08:13, 1 August 2022 (UTC)

• "this was on" → "the meeting was on"
• "for a time afterwards." → "for some time afterwards."
• "She joined Bette Midler" → "The singer joined Bette Midler"
• "She contributed vocals" → "Springs contributed backing vocals"
• Add speech marks around "West End Girls"
• ""A New Life" with" → ""A New Life", with"
• "b-side of" → "B-side of" with the pipe
• "she toured with" → "the singer toured with"
• ""Paper Money" and" → ""Paper Money", and"
• Merge the fifth para with the fourth one
• Pipe Birmingham Evening Mail to Birmingham Mail

• Amended per the eleven points above. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 08:13, 1 August 2022 (UTC)

• Remove or replace the Evening Standard per WP:RSP

• Please see reply under the References section. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 08:14, 1 August 2022 (UTC)

Personal life

• "claimed that the relationship" → "writes the relationship"

• Done. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 13:32, 31 July 2022 (UTC)

Notes

• Good

References

• Copyvio score looks fabulous at 10.7%!!!
• Pipe The Journal to The Journal (Newcastle upon Tyne newspaper) on ref 2
• Pipe Equinox Publishing to Equinox Publishing (Sheffield) on ref 3
• Pipe Billboard to Billboard (magazine) on ref 4
• Faber And Faber → Faber and Faber on ref 6 with the wikilink
• Wikilink The Daily Telegraph on ref 7 and remove the bracket
• Wikilink Grove Press on ref 10
• Wikilink Fort Worth Star-Telegram on ref 11
• Wikilink The Guardian on ref 12
• Pipe Evening Post to Reading Post on ref 13
• Wikilink The Times on ref 15
• Wikilink Birmingham Daily News on ref 16
• Pipe Birmingham Evening Mail to Birmingham Mail on ref 17
• Remove or replace ref 19 per WP:RSP
• Pipe Evening Times to Glasgow Times on ref 22

• All done exept ref 19. I note that there is currently no consensus on the reliability of The Evening Standard at WP:RSP. The information cited is the opinion of a reviewer, rather than any facts which could be disputed, and any alternate source would be no more reliable in stating that reviwer's opinion. Also, from my reading of the discussion on Wikipedia, most of the concerns about The Evening Standard as a source relate to the paper since (or shortly before) 2009, whereas this review was back in 1987. I'd argue that in this particular instance, it's OK the keep the article as-is. Let me know what you think. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 07:58, 1 August 2022 (UTC)

External links

• Good

Final comments and verdict

•  On hold until all of the issues are fixed! --K. Peake 10:31, 30 July 2022 (UTC)

• Many thanks K. Peake. I've replied above. (I also added one further newspaper review to the article.) Regards, BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 09:35, 1 August 2022 (UTC)

• BennyOnTheLoose Same to you for going over all of these issues and I am fine with the Evening Standard usage, however can you use infobox person instead like articles such as Kanye West do? --K. Peake 21:23, 1 August 2022 (UTC)

K. Peake I've amended the infobox. I also added a couple of external links. Regards, BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 11:04, 2 August 2022 (UTC)

• ✓ Pass now, this looks great and I made one brief fix to the infobox! --K. Peake 11:10, 2 August 2022 (UTC)