Talk:Hauran

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Review: September 11, 2019. (Reviewed version).

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Great article I always wanted to learn more about Pre Ghassanid Hauran. (besides the traditional bible records) Did the Nabateans or any other groups settle that region before the Arrival of the Ghassanids? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Skatewalk (talk • contribs) 05:12, 2 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Arran?

Is this the same place as the Arran which is mentioned in Latin sources as having a bishop in Justinian's time? Srnec 17:01, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Fake picture

I removed the fake picture from the article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.46.145.67 (talk) 03:37, 20 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Why do you people continuly remove the hebrew name of an area that has Israeli Hebrew addressing ?

Part of Hurn are owned by Israeli , had been admistrated in Hebrew and Jewish population, that place can be found address as early as 1894 to 1933 ? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.226.49.34 (talk) 13:09, 9 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Because it's just like many places where Jewish communities existed, you don't write their names in Hebrew; this isn't a dictionary. Their existence is highly insignificant to the overall history/present status of the place. By all means, add information about it (with sources), but it makes no sense to add the Hebrew spelling in the lede, per WP:UNDUE. Yazan (talk) 13:55, 9 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

But that area isn't some insignificant village , that is an area that is discussed during peace process (that area has importance as the Golan Highets in land mass and agricultural ) - They are legally Israeli owned (example for a WP:RS http://www.nrg.co.il/online/1/ART1/665/655.html ,

link to english source about Israeli land ownership in Huran)

the hebrew presence is 100 years and Jewish presence is from the second century 109.226.49.34 (talk) 14:24, 9 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

For me the lack of any reference to the Israeli land ownership it is a POV (as the page describe one side for land that had been depopulated from the legal owners) 109.226.49.34 (talk) 14:27, 9 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

53 sq km, out of 3000 sq km is insignificant. The English source is a blog, not an RS. The fact is, this little crusade you're on is the exact definition of WP:FRINGE. There is a reference to land ownership (you added it) no one removed it, although I'm not sure these are RS to begin with, but adding the Hebrew name in the lead is WP:UNDUE. Yazan (talk) 14:36, 9 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Ok I understand now about the lead, the sources are from Prof (Guy Bechor is a Phd ) + news sites + history books, my only wish is to add few lines about the history of some sub region (Hauran) and the depopulated areas on the Siryan-Israeli Jordnain-Israeli Lebanese-Israeli villages between the years 1850 to 1949 (that is the time frame I'm studying).109.226.49.34 (talk) 15:16, 9 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Hauran is exclusively in Syria and Jordan and there is no reason to have a foreign and unaffiliated translation in the lead (Hebrew). If some land there was purchased in the past by a Jewish organization than that doesn't mean the Hebrew name belongs in the lead. For example if a Chinese organization buys a farm in California then the Chinese translation for the United States of America doesn't belong in the USA article.--Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 23:16, 9 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The only reason I wished to add the hebrew name was that it was historically had relation also Eretz Israeli (now I see from 1848 to 1944 , During the Saiks Piko agreement the political scuffle (David Ben Gurion addressed that area specially ) that rose could emphasis the meaning of Huran , and as I said before I gave up - and will not add the translation . — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.226.49.34 (talk) 01:17, 10 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Hauran is not only Jordanian and Syrian

Hauran is also an Israeli land (still officially) - and is described as land that could be used in peace talk, removing all info for Israeli connection to that land is a POV. It was addressed in the Israeli - Syrian peace talks it was also address as part of transjordan districts parts that are legally belong to Israel (some parts had been given to Jordan in the peace treaty). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.226.49.34 (talk) 08:30, 9 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Don't you know the difference between land ownership and sovereignty? Zero^talk 19:28, 9 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I know but that land is disputed (like the west bank for example), now that this page have a few lines about the history of the area it is fine by me. 109.226.49.34 (talk) 19:59, 9 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Where and how should I add villages and Moshavat that parished (stop existing) in Huran (mostly Daraa area)

I'm using the works like this and this (still searching for better RS but that is good enought).

some of the villages stop existing in the early 1920's and some as late as 1944 I don't think there is enough for page for each village but where do you think I could add the names and small history I could find ? 109.226.49.34 (talk) 19:59, 9 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Lets discuss latest edits

1. This: "During the end of the 19th century the Palestine Jewish Colonization Association (PIKA)" is sourced with:

http://www.gplanet.co.il/prodetailsamewin.asp?pro_id=1554

http://www.shishibagolan.co.il/htmls/page_286.aspx?c0=16500&bsp=15594

2. This: "bought land in southern Syria and created several districts" is sourced with:

http://www.nrg.co.il/online/1/ART1/665/655.html

3. This: ",until 1944 land had been administered and used by Jewish communities. Between 1944 and 1948 the Syrian government allegedly confiscated approximately 100,000 dunams in Hauran." is sourced with

http://www.gplanet.co.il/prodetailsamewin.asp?pro_id=1554

http://www.ybz.org.il/_Uploads/dbsAttachedFiles/Article_14.3%281%29.pdf

קשלס, חיים, ראשית הפעילות הציונית, עלייה והתיישבות בארץ ישראל, בתוך:אנצקלופדיה של גלויות-יהדות בולגריה, Jerusalem, 1967, pages 100-104

4. This: "The hebrew slang also took the word Hurani (person from to Huran) to describe person that dress in a diffrent way or behaves not in the same manners as the caller, the source is from tribas from Huran that came in the early 20 century to work in construction in Jewish villages" is sourced with:

http://www.alfabet.co.il/comments/%D7%97%D7%95%D7%A8%D7%A0%D7%99/888

How are any of these reliable sources? I think the only one that appears to be reliable is nrg.co.il. --Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 23:27, 9 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

gplanet is a pobulicantion source for Dr. Guy Bechor (the best descripton I could find for him is Historian for Arab relation and middle east studies) - according to wikipedia one of his books is published in Beirut - Important note for you guys to Judge he is counted as a right wing scholar. He also state he used traval information from a known Israeli travel book writer (http://www.yoaview.com/Yoaview/SITE/?action=showobject&sn=2_610) , Perahps some would like Jewish Property Claims Against Arab Countries, Columbia Uni both state about from 1944 the 1948 stated in a different source (That also remind the upto 6K dunam in the Golan).

ybz - Resarch facility for Eretz Israel and Jerusalem

קשלס, חיים, ראשית הפעילות הציונית, עלייה והתיישבות בארץ ישראל, בתוך:אנצקלופדיה של גלויות-יהדות בולגריה, Jerusalem, 1967, pages 100-104 official book also cited by the Beth_Hatefutsoth

alfabet - that can be changed via any place (that was one of the first results for the defnition for Hurani).

http://www.shishibagolan.co.il/htmls/page_286.aspx?c0=16500&bsp=15594 news sources (That describe several books as it sources) perhaps would be batter changed with http://www.misham.co.il/uploads/Magazines/Magazine13/p16.pdf (Damascus Jewry organization) that source has more then 10 places he cited109.226.49.34 (talk) 00:57, 10 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I reverted all my changes due to poor english , few more sources I would like if someone else would like to use and edit:

History of agricultural eurpean Jewish settelments in the Hauran :

http://www.knesset.gov.il/library/heb/docs/sif026.htm http://www.golan.org.il/616/325.htm http://www.manoberger.co.il/?page_id=879

National claims - http://www.shishibagolan.co.il/htmls/article_182.aspx?c0=16388&bsp=15594 (1918) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.226.49.34 (talk) 02:22, 10 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

DEFINE BOUNDARIES FIRST, then go into minutia

Another Middle Eastern topic full of petty nationalist squabble, but lacking the most basic data: how can you discuss a region without giving well-sourced info about its bloody geogr. BOUNDARIES? I can assure you, Ajloun is not Hauran, Quneitra is in the Golan, which has its own geological, geographical and historical definition and it belonging to a wider Hauran is a far shot, similarly Irbid and definitely Jarash ar quite far south to be on the Hauran VOLCANIC PLATEAU. Useless talk, as long as the page doesn't start with a well-founded freaking DEFINITION. Is it so hard to get this? Encyclopaedia = sourced definitions, w. or w/o discussions? For an 11-years old article, that much can be expected. ArmindenArminden (talk) 18:37, 23 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Good starting point for Ghasanid period: https://books.google.com/books?id=pfwAG3-rpzcC&pg=PA424&lpg=PA424&dq=golan+hawran+boundaries&source=bl&ots=Imow2j6T7e&sig=JK6qjzC40eAaQvjhhPxv_gUJiYs&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi1mcXToorOAhXKA8AKHeNSApAQ6AEILjAE#v=onepage&q=golan%20hawran%20boundaries&f=false ArmindenArminden (talk) 20:14, 23 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Part of Harrat al-Shamah

Would it be true to say that this region is part of Harrat al-Shamah, or is it indeed identical and a merger is required? Batternut (talk) 10:16, 3 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

This is, largely, the northern part of Harrat al-Shamah, but I suspect it also goes further north slightly. The borders on these regions are obviously not set in stones. But it is certainly not identical. Yazan (talk) 12:43, 3 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Sources

I am editing the Sources section, adding templates to the sources listed, to indicate where they are freely accessible, etc. with a view to reviewing the article. Has anyone found an accessible version of The Encyclopaedia of Islam online? Amitchell125 (talk) 20:23, 26 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Amitchell125: I'm not aware of any free online access, though there is subscription access. However, I have the text. I could answer any questions or scan the encyclopedia's entry on the "Hawran" and send it to you. ~~I intend to nominate this article as a GA sometime soon~~. Forgot that I already nominated it... Al Ameer (talk) 20:33, 27 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Al Ameer son: Thanks, I would appreciate being sent the text. If I reviewed the article (not nominated, sorry!) I would need to access the Lewis pages too. Would it be all right if you sent me them too? Amitchell125 (talk) 02:41, 28 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Amitchell125: I emailed you. Once you reply, I'll send you the attachments for those two sources (I don't have a dropbox). Cheers, --Al Ameer (talk) 22:15, 28 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Al Ameer son: Done. Many thanks. [User:Amitchell125|Amitchell125]] (talk) 05:16, 30 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

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Question

How is "hauran" and "avraham" written in Hebrew and are their reading or writing similar?

Not even remotely similar: הורן אברהם Zero^talk 10:31, 20 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

and with another name: Auran|itis| ↔ Abram? Umud (talk)

אוראניטיס still nothing similar. Zero^talk 01:47, 21 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]