Talk:Gwinnett Environmental & Heritage Center

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This article is written in American English, which has its own spelling conventions (color, defense, traveled) and some terms that are used in it may be different or absent from other varieties of English. According to the relevant style guide, this should not be changed without broad consensus.

Gwinnett Environmental & Heritage Center has been listed as one of the Art and architecture good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.
Review: October 10, 2022. (Reviewed version).

A fact from Gwinnett Environmental & Heritage Center appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 16 September 2022 (check views). The text of the entry was as follows:

Did you know... that upon its completion, the Gwinnett Environmental & Heritage Center had the largest sloped green roof in the United States?

A record of the entry may be seen at Wikipedia:Recent additions/2022/September. The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Gwinnett Environmental & Heritage Center.

Wikipedia

Dating

While WP:STRONGNAT does say that strong national ties dictate dating within an article, Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Dates and numbers counters at WP:DATESNO by making a point that "Special rules apply to citations". WP:CITESTYLE's emphasis is on a consistent style, and WP:CITEVAR makes it clear that this style should not be changed and "As with spelling differences, unless there is consensus to change, defer to the style used by the first major contributor." Yet it omits any concession about strong national ties whereas other guidelines include it; it doesn't apply to citations. Dates within the citation style do not have to follow WP:STRONGNAT because they aren't part of the prose and WP:CITESTYLE does not make the "strong national ties" concession whereas other, non-citation guidelines do (such as WP:DATERET and WP:TIES). The citation style does not need to follow the prose date format, but it does need to be consistent within the article. Barring an existing style used in an already existing article, being used to military dating which uses DMY, I use the Oxford style referencing and nothing I can find in the MoS says that I shouldn't be able to, even in American articles. The actual prose needs to follow WP:STRONGNAT and I make sure the dates always do as appropriate when I write articles, but the MoS points out special rules apply to citations for a reason. - Aoidh (talk) 18:51, 10 July 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Your reversion is also undoing fixes to the citation templates and other edits, including one that aligns the article with WP:ORDER. While technically correct may indeed be the best kind of correct, take care to only change the parts of an article that should be changed. - Dravecky (talk) 21:53, 10 July 2014 (UTC)[reply]

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Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Theleekycauldron (talk) 08:25, 12 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(

Comment or view
Article history

)

... that upon its completion, the Gwinnett Environmental & Heritage Center had the largest sloped green roof in the United States? Source: https://www.lordaecksargent.com/assets/news_releases/GEHC_GrnStrategies_fnl_e.pdf Quote: "A 40,000-square-foot green roof – one of the largest in the Southeast and the largest sloped green roof installation in the United States"
- ALT1: ... that the Gwinnett Environmental & Heritage Center is designed to use 75 percent less potable water than a typical building of the same size? Source: https://www.architecturalrecord.com/articles/12083-the-gwinnett-environmental-and-heritage-center Quote: "Embodying the principles of conservation, the GEHC is projected to use 75 percent less potable water and 35 percent less energy than a conventional building of the same size."
- ALT2: ... that the Gwinnett Environmental & Heritage Center was built over a dry ravine that was turned into a man-made stream that functions as a horizontal cooling tower? Source: https://www.gwinnettcounty.com/web/gwinnett/departments/communityservices/parksandrecreation/ourparksandfacilities/guidetoyourparks/gwinnettenvironmentalandheritagecenter/greenbuildingtechnologies Quote: "An innovative water feature was created using a formerly dry ravine, reducing site disturbance during construction. Not only stunning to look at, the water feature also functions as a horizontal cooling tower, playing an integral part in heating and cooling the building."
- Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Beth Nealson

5x expanded by Aoidh (talk). Self-nominated at 14:47, 17 August 2022 (UTC).[reply]

392 characters before expansion, now at 6191 which "just barely" makes this eligable with an expansion of 15.79x. Earwig gives 20% which mostly consists of names. All hooks in the article and no prose issues. ALT0 is interesting, ALT1 a bit, but ALT2 has two "that"s which IMO kills the flow, so ALT0 preferred over others. ~Styyx^Talk? 01:52, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
- @Aoidh: is there a source for ALT0 that isn't a press release from the architecture firm? I wouldn't consider that a reliable source under WP:ABOUTSELF... theleekycauldron (talk • contribs) (she/her) 04:03, 8 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Theleekycauldron: There are two other sources that were in the article that I added to that statement to support the claim, this design magazine and this article from the Atlanta Journal-Constitution. - Aoidh (talk) 07:31, 8 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

And or &

@Ravenpuff: I wanted to elaborate on why I reverted the move and an edit-summary seemed inadequate. Aside from this source which was hastily made the "official" website after the original website got their domain taken away, sources (even county sources including the original announcement) overwhelmingly refer to it as "Gwinnett Environmental & Heritage Center" as it's proper name, which a quick look through the sources in the article will verify. The signage at the building (which I did not take photos of unfortunately) uses & (the front sign can be seen on Google Maps as can the front entrance). Becuase MOS:& says "But retain an ampersand when it is a legitimate part of the style of a proper noun" I think it needs to be retained the current way, because that is the proper noun for the center. Some of the sources that do use "and" such as this one and this one are inconsistent and switch between the two, so a lot of the usage of "and" seems to be a desire to spell out of reflex rather than any reflection of the proper name of the center. - Aoidh (talk) 00:33, 14 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

GA Review

Passed. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 06:46, 10 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

This review is transcluded from Talk:Gwinnett Environmental & Heritage Center/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Lee Vilenski (talk · contribs) 21:07, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Hello, I am planning on reviewing this article for GA Status, over the next couple of days. Thank you for nominating the article for GA status. I hope I will learn some new information, and that my feedback is helpful.

If nominators or editors could refrain from updating the particular section that I am updating until it is complete, I would appreciate it to remove a edit conflict. Please address concerns in the section that has been completed above (If I've raised concerns up to references, feel free to comment on things like the lede.)

I generally provide an overview of things I read through the article on a first glance. Then do a thorough sweep of the article after the feedback is addressed. After this, I will present the pass/failure. I may use strikethrough tags when concerns are met. Even if something is obvious why my concern is met, please leave a message as courtesy.

Best of luck! you can also use the {{done}} tag to state when something is addressed. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)}

Please let me know after the review is done, if you were happy with the review! Obviously this is regarding the article's quality, however, I want to be happy and civil to all, so let me know if I have done a good job, regardless of the article's outcome.

Links

Prose

Lede

Starts two sentences with "the center", we can just say "it" on one of these. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:07, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done - Aoidh (talk) 23:22, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Lede is a bit short, could probably include other parts of the article. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:07, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done - I tried to expand it as best I could in a way that touches on all of the content of the article itself. - Aoidh (talk) 23:22, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

General

History doesn't seem to cover why it was built in the first place. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:19, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done - Added a sentence that it was "created as an educational facility for Gwinnett County with a focus on environmental issues." - Aoidh (talk) 23:22, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
will also highlight sustainable construction and environmental technologies. - feels a bit promoy. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:19, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done Reworded it slightly to show that this was the intent if not the result. - Aoidh (talk) 23:22, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The building itself is a LEED Gold certified building,[9] and was Gwinnett County's first LEED Gold certified building.[10][11 - could be reworded to not attend the award twice. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:19, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done - Aoidh (talk) 23:22, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Per cent is two words. See WP:% Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:19, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Not done WP:% says that "percent" is American English and that "per cent" is British English; this article is written in American English. - Aoidh (talk) 23:22, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The building is made of stone and natural pine[12] and is designed to use 75 percent less potable water and 35 percent less energy than a typical building of the same size. - is it because of the stone and pine? Otherwise this sentence makes no sense. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:19, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done Split into two separate sentences. - Aoidh (talk) 23:22, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
You don't need to link square foot on every use. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:19, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done - Aoidh (talk) 23:22, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
What is "grading"? Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:19, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done wikilink added to Grading (earthworks). - Aoidh (talk) 23:22, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Same as above for hectares, acres etc. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:19, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done - Aoidh (talk) 23:22, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Be consistent with Oxford commas. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:19, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Question: I'm sure it's right in front of me and I'm overlooking it but can you tell me where in the article it's not used? - Aoidh (talk) 23:22, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Overall the paragraphs are very short. A lot can be combined. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:19, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Done - Aoidh (talk) 23:22, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

serves as an event center for events - well, yeah. Of course. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:19, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Done That does admittedly sound very silly when you point it out. I reworded it to "venue" which is the more appropriate description anyways. - Aoidh (talk) 23:22, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

There's a few level three headers that have one or two small paragraphs in them, the header isn't necessary. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:19, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Done - Aoidh (talk) 23:22, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Review meta comments

I'll begin the review as soon as I can! If you fancy returning the favour, I have a list of nominations for review at WP:GAN and WP:FAC, respectively. I'd be very grateful if you were to complete one of these if you get time. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 21:07, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Lee Vilenski: thanks for reviewing this. Other than the percent/per cent point and a question I had about the Oxford commas, I believe I've addressed each of the points above, but I'm more than happy to make additional changes as needed. - Aoidh (talk) 23:22, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

- - My mistake - I should have read the policy before inacting it. I've done the Oxford comma from where I was talking about, but obviously true for all entries. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 06:46, 10 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.