Talk:Green hydrogen

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Section sizes

Section size for Green hydrogen (33 sections)
Section name	Byte count	Section total
(Top)	2,910	2,910
Definition	3,306	3,306
Electrolysis	626	2,291
Biochar-assisted	1,665	1,665
Uses	6,170	9,888
Green methanol	3,718	3,718
Market	8,569	8,569
Projects	13	27,889
Australia	2,119	2,119
Brazil	1,758	1,758
Canada	710	710
Chile	933	933
China	3,100	3,100
Egypt	726	726
Germany	601	601
India	2,595	2,595
Japan	446	446
Mauritania	836	836
Namibia	949	949
Oman	785	785
Portugal	1,378	1,378
Saudi Arabia	686	686
Singapore	476	476
Spain	703	703
United Arab Emirates	732	732
United Kingdom	2,958	2,958
United States	4,793	4,793
Public-private projects	592	592
Government support	14,279	14,279
Regulations and standards	3,472	3,472
See also	203	203
References	29	29
External links	218	218
Total	73,054	73,054

Economics

Here are some articles with a lot of economic considerations which I would add now if my schedule wasn't completely smashed this week:

https://gawg.info/files/papers/IRENA20a.pdf

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S254243512200410X

https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1748-9326/acacb5

https://www.hydrogenfuelnews.com/green-hydrogen-technology-cheap/8559025/

Maybe someone else can add the salient points? Sandizer (talk) 14:59, 6 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Definition section

Difficult to comprehend. Need someone with knowledge in this area who can break it down and make the language simpler. Eatthecrow (talk) 16:08, 7 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I'll try to sort it out. Part of the issue is we're discussing four things: 1) "green hydrogen", 2) renewable hydrogen, 3) "low-carbon hydrogen", and 4) government policies designed to promote green and low-carbon hydrogen, without explaining the relationship between them or saying what is what. Thanks for bringing this up. Clayoquot (talk | contribs) 16:27, 7 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I've started by moving some content to a "Regulations and standards" section as it wasn't about definitions per se.[1] I've done some reading and the story about definitions is complicated enough even without going into how to regulate or certify this stuff. Will try to unpack the complexity now. Clayoquot (talk | contribs) 23:34, 8 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I gave the section an overhaul. As often happens with climate articles, our job is complicated by conflicting definitions and "green hydrogen" is most often used as a narrow term of art. I didn't want to add too many citations, but for reference the narrow meaning is used by IRENA, the IEA, the National Academy of Science and the World Nuclear Association. It's interesting that even the World Nuclear Association doesn't call hydrogen from nuclear power "green hydrogen". I tried to see if the IPCC has a definition of green hydrogen and could not find one. Clayoquot (talk | contribs) 23:59, 8 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Issues with the first sentence

The first sentence of the lead currently says green hydrogen is generated from either "renewable energy^[1] or low-carbon power.^[2]" This fails verification - the cited source for low-carbon power actually says that green H2 uses electricity generated from renewables.

The sentence doesn't align with any definition I've seen. The narrow, most-commonly-used definition excludes non-renewable power sources. The broader, less-used definition includes hydrogen generated from low-carbon power, but it also includes things like hydrogen produced by reforming landfill gas or even (some would argue) from fossil gas with CCS. I plan to change this sentence to match the narrow definition, which is now well-cited in the article and supported by additional authoritative sources as described above. Since the main purpose of the first sentence is to tell the reader what the article is about and the article does seem to be about the narrow meaning, I think this is the only definition that belongs in the lead. Clayoquot (talk | contribs) 00:10, 9 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

References

^ Magill, Jim. "Blue Vs. Green Hydrogen: Which Will The Market Choose?". Forbes. Retrieved 2022-01-22.
^ Jones, Florence (21 February 2023). "EU considers definition of green hydrogen, as rules reignite debate over nuclear". Power Technology. Retrieved 4 September 2023.

Some incorrect interpretation of citation, and an ambiguous expression

1. citation never mentioned "converted oil and gas rigs" in Cromarty Firth, 2. "Equinor announced plans to triple UK hydrogen production" should be "Equinor announced plans to triple her hydrogen production in UK" instead. Can anybody help verify what I said and do the auditing? thank you. ThomasYehYeh (talk) 08:58, 21 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I haven't looked into the sourcing here but these sound like things you just go ahead and fix.Be bold. Cheers, Clayoquot (talk | contribs) 19:03, 22 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Citation to South Korean strategy toward green hydrogen seems to be irrelevant

This<ref>{{Cite news |last=Purtill |first=James |date=2021-01-22 |title=What is green hydrogen, how is it made and will it be the fuel of the future? |work=[[ABC News (United States)|ABC News]] |url=https://www.abc.net.au/news/science/2021-01-23/green-hydrogen-renewable-energy-climate-emissions-explainer/13081872 |url-status=live |access-date=2021-01-23 |archive-url=https://web.archive.org/web/20210122200313/https://www.abc.net.au/news/science/2021-01-23/green-hydrogen-renewable-energy-climate-emissions-explainer/13081872 |archive-date=22 January 2021}}</ref>seems to have nothing to do with what the writings are talking about. Can anybody help? ThomasYehYeh (talk) 13:35, 21 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It's used as a citation for the claim "An energy market analyst suggested in early 2021 that the price of green hydrogen would drop 70% by 2031 in countries that have cheap renewable energy". The source backs up that claim. Could you please clarify what you think the problem is? Clayoquot (talk | contribs) 19:02, 22 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I'm wondering the merit of including the section of ==Research== in this article

Is it related green hydrogen? Thank you for your kind attention. ThomasYehYeh (talk) 02:45, 22 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

That's a good question. It's relevant but incomprehensible to the general reader and the research is really early-stage. I've removed it and pasted it here:

A 2023 study reported two uses of a conductive adhesive-barrier (CAB) that converted >99% of photoelectric power to chemical reactions. One experiment examined halide perovskite-based photoelectrochemical cells that achieved efficiency of 13.4% and 16.3 h to t₆₀. The second was formed using a monolithic, stacked, silicon-perovskite tandem (two layered cell, with each layer absorbing a different frequency range), achieving peak efficiency of 20.8% and continuous operation of 102 h.^[1]

Clayoquot (talk | contribs) 18:59, 22 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

They're talking about an integrated water->H2 photovoltaic module. It is relevant but is obviously too technically written for the average wiki reader. Greglocock (talk) 01:08, 23 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

References

^ Fehr, Austin M. K.; Agrawal, Ayush; Mandani, Faiz; Conrad, Christian L.; Jiang, Qi; Park, So Yeon; Alley, Olivia; Li, Bor; Sidhik, Siraj; Metcalf, Isaac; Botello, Christopher; Young, James L.; Even, Jacky; Blancon, Jean Christophe; Deutsch, Todd G. (2023-06-26). "Integrated halide perovskite photoelectrochemical cells with solar-driven water-splitting efficiency of 20.8%". Nature Communications. 14 (1): 3797. Bibcode:2023NatCo..14.3797F. doi:10.1038/s41467-023-39290-y. ISSN 2041-1723. PMC 10293190. PMID 37365175.

[:2-1] Magill, Jim. "Blue Vs. Green Hydrogen: Which Will The Market Choose?". Forbes. Retrieved 2022-01-22.

[2] Jones, Florence (21 February 2023). "EU considers definition of green hydrogen, as rules reignite debate over nuclear". Power Technology. Retrieved 4 September 2023.

[3] Fehr, Austin M. K.; Agrawal, Ayush; Mandani, Faiz; Conrad, Christian L.; Jiang, Qi; Park, So Yeon; Alley, Olivia; Li, Bor; Sidhik, Siraj; Metcalf, Isaac; Botello, Christopher; Young, James L.; Even, Jacky; Blancon, Jean Christophe; Deutsch, Todd G. (2023-06-26). "Integrated halide perovskite photoelectrochemical cells with solar-driven water-splitting efficiency of 20.8%". Nature Communications. 14 (1): 3797. Bibcode:2023NatCo..14.3797F. doi:10.1038/s41467-023-39290-y. ISSN 2041-1723. PMC 10293190. PMID 37365175.

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