Talk:Enriqueta Legorreta/GA1

GA Review

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Reviewer: Aza24 (talk · contribs) 07:41, 21 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

An article this well written, an article about an opera singer (Die Walküre!) and an article written by SusanW? Yeah, no way I'm passing on this review :)

Aza24 Thank you so much for the review. I am excited to learn and appreciate your review and the opportunity to improve the article. In truth, I know nothing about opera. I was fascinated by the fact that she was both an opera singer and an environmental activist. I loved the seeming dichotomy of her life's passions. It'll take me a day or so to get back to the answers here, but just reading through them, you are teaching me a lot. SusunW (talk) 13:20, 21 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Happy to help, and glad to see your interest in the article besides your unfamiliarity with opera. She seems to be a somewhat obscure figure; I could only find one recording of her online (though my search was not exhaustive), and it was a rather clumsy video of someone playing a CD.

It is an interesting dichotomy for sure. It's like she's Greta Thunberg and her mom all at once! Aza24 (talk) 19:47, 21 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Yes! Exactly. SusunW (talk) 15:24, 22 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

General comments

Lead

Could use a short description

Perhaps I did this correctly? In truth, I never put that in, but some lovely gnome always follows along behind me and does.

I simplified it a little; the standard for biographies is just having the simplest form of the first sentence (in this case "soprano and activist") with the birth and death years in parentheses Aza24 (talk) 00:45, 23 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Strange to have "Richard Wagner's" but then "Beethoven's" in the lead—would suggest just last name for both

Done

Surprising that we don't have a Ópera Nacional article—is this a now non-exist opera house?

I was surprised too and es:Ópera mexicana doesn't mention it at all. As near as I can tell, it was the first National company (before only regional) and founded in 1941,[1] and is still operational[2]

Always more to write on Wikipedia... Aza24 (talk) 00:45, 23 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I am not used to the label "Opera singer" in place of something like "soprano", particularly since things like Mozart's Requiem are not operas. The alternative "Singer" seems too vague to me

Done Corrected to soprano.

It seems misleading to include Luis Ximénez in the lead's list; I would not think he is close to the "well-known" that applies to the other figures. Also, "directors and artists" seems like an unnatural way to say "conductors and instrumentalists" or perhaps just "musicians"

Done and replace Ximénez with Arrau.

Would recommend linking pollutants

Done

Why quotes around the Asociación Conciencia Ecológica but not other organizations? Aza24 (talk) 08:48, 21 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Removed.

Early life

Page number for Legorreta 1946?

The cite is there to show he was an author and links to one of his works. I get the idea he was a big deal, but maddeningly there are virtually no digitized sources about him. There was a prize named in his honor and lots of photos at INAH. The most common thing that comes up when I search for him is that book, which leads me to conclude it was well known.

Ah I see. Makes sense then

Why quotes around the Ópera de México? And why no translation like the other Spanish names?

(I am chronologically old . In my day, foreign terms were always in quotes. Wikipedia says don't, hard to break old habits.) Translation seemed obvious to me, but I've added.

Its obvious to me as well, but then so are one's that were already there like Asociación Nacional de Ópera (National Opera Association). Aza24 (talk) 00:57, 23 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

"first solo with the company" is a little vague, though I understand that perhaps the source is not specific. First aria maybe? Aza24 (talk) 08:48, 21 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, the source says all of "En 1940 debutó como solista de la Ópera de México". Not remotely helpful. I've used aria.

Opera career

Would give an introduction to who Ricardo Miranda is

Done

The line "Verna Millan in a review for Musical America noted that the standing ovation for the "Lenore Overture No. 3" brought the production to a halt for several minutes" does not make sense. The "Lenore Overture No. 3" is an orchestra-only piece either performed at the opera's beginning or between the acts (Overture No. 1 usually starts the piece, the numbers being used for differentiation between versions, not actually, afaik, by Beethoven; everything about this opera is a mess, and a good explanation for why Beethoven didn't become an opera composer).

Millan says "The Leonore Overture No. 3 was played between the second and third scenes in the second act. After its performance, the audience spontaneously rose to its feet and cheered for many minutes before the opera could proceed". Are you saying I should delete it?

It would make sense to delete, yes, because no singers are in that piece is what I'm saying. Aza24 (talk) 01:48, 23 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Done

You may want to link "lyric" and "dramatic" to Lyric soprano and Dramatic soprano, as that was doubtless what the author was reffering to, unless you're paraphrasing the exact adjectives here

Done (Collaboration is so good! I would never have found those links.)

As a generic name, Requiem shouldn't be italicized, just like Symphony, Sonata etc.

Done (Again, I would never have known this, assuming it was a title, not just a generic name. Thank you!)

Arrau is really famous! You might consider adding him to the list of musicians in the lead

Done

I have never heard of Stravinsky's Jeu de cartes referred to by its English translation, the other two I've seen both ways, but it may be too awkward to include "Card Games". For consistency (which is why I assume it was used in the first place) you might just use the French names and include translations in parentheses like you've done with the Spanish terms

Almost all of her performances came from English language sources so I have followed what the text used. (I had no idea they were all in French until I started trying to find links). Source says "Igor Stravinsky directed a concert of his own works—The Song of the Nightingale, the Concerto for Strings, Card Party, and the Divertimento from The Fairy's Kiss". As you suggested, I have listed them in French followed by English translation, except see query below.

Why no like to Concerto in D?

Are you saying that is the mysterious "Concerto for Strings" that I couldn't figure out what it was? If so, I am very happy to have your identification of it, as it was beyond my ability to identify.

Almost certainly, thats his only work that would fit the description, just not its normal title. Aza24 (talk) 01:48, 23 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Gerda Arendt thinks it is that too, so happy to add the link. SusunW (talk) 13:20, 23 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Our Spirituals article refers to a very specific tradition, not sure if that is intended here

Absolutely positive. I'm originally a Southerner and speak fluent Southernese. The source actually says "Negro Spirituals", but I omitted the racial reference.

Sounds good Aza24 (talk) 01:48, 23 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

"She sang with Leonard Bernstein" makes it sound like Bernstein was singing, which I assume is not intended?

Performed? If that's better. Done

Translation for Música en la Pinacoteca?

Good catch, I meant to check on that because google translate gave me nada. I just queried my house manager and she said it translates roughly to Art Gallery. Added.

Judith Sierra and Aurora Woodrow would do well with some label on who they are Aza24 (talk) 08:48, 21 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Well, now I would call them opera singers, perhaps simply Sopranos?[3],[4]

Fine by me

Environmental activism

The line "Increases in pollution in Mexico City which caused health complications soared" is phrased a bit awkwardly, I think

Reworded entire sentence. Better?

Definitely. Aza24 (talk) 01:53, 23 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Things like hydrocarbons and such could really use links

Done

It's not immediately clear that Aguascalientes City is still in Mexico, but I don't have a huge issue with it

I don't think there is another city with that name anywhere, but I've added Mexico to make it clear they didn't leave the country. In truth, I have never heard Aguascalientes called Aguascalientes City, or even Ciudad de Aguascalientes. (I will never understand the propensity on wp to translate things that are not known as translated to English. I mean things like Universidad Nacional Autónoma de México is always that or most often UNAM. The National Autonomous University of Mexico, as our article calls it is definitely not the WP:Common name.)

Must just be a want for natural disambiguation with the state; it's strange to me as well. Aza24 (talk) 01:53, 23 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Can't see any other issues or ones in the Death and legacy section. Aza24 (talk) 08:48, 21 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Sources

Look fine, though I'm not sure why you include the "Mexico" for cities in Mexico but not US for US states/cities. Too picky for a GAN though, I think. Aza24 (talk) 08:48, 21 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Because people have no clue what the names of Mexican cities/states are except Mexico City, which we here all call DF (Distrito Federal) and never Mexico City, and are usually familiar with US cities/states.

I totally understand the rationale, and have no interest in pressing this issue either way, but feel responsible to note that people outside of the US do not generally know most of the US states (other than NY, Texas, California, etc.) from my experience. Aza24 (talk) 02:01, 23 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

My experience has been that people outside of the US know large cities, most of the states, and the small town I grew up in because it was in a song. (People even sang it to me in Budapest, Belize, and Prague.) They don't know where they are located or understand the vast distances. My experience of living in Mexico is completely different, no one we have encountered except a Dutch merchant in Paris who had done volunteer work here, has any clue about Mexican cities. But, I do take your point. SusunW (talk) 13:45, 23 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Aza24 I think I have answered everything but there are queries I need answers for if you will. I genuinely am so happy that you picked up this review, as with your knowledge of opera, it has been very much improved. Thank you so much. 17:31, 22 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Glad I could help. Left a few responses; only a handful of remaining issues I believe. Best – Aza24 (talk) 02:01, 23 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I think I have covered everything but if there are still issues, advise. It was a pleasure working with you to improve the article, which benefited greatly from your expertise. Thank you so much. SusunW (talk) 13:45, 23 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Likewise! Everything looks great; passing now. Aza24 (talk) 02:19, 24 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]