Talk:Differential object marking

Definition

So far I have written everything in this article (including the verification template), but to be honest I'm not really sure if everything I'm saying here is really true. I may have misunderstood the sources I cite. I have reasons to believe that DOM is actually something different from the definition that I gave here, but I lack the understanding to give the correct meaning. If my expectation is true, I can only hope that some more knowledgeable passer-by will be able to correct this error. Fyrius 20:29, 30 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Something that could be helpful here is the addition of more examples from other languages. I know that there's a link to the Finnish page, but it might be nice to add some additional examples in the heading of definition. Furthermore, it might be nice to add some extra sources in the sentence that begins with "In languages where DOM is active,". User:Mollycole 8:48, 22 December 2016 (UTC)

The article titled object (grammar) mentions German as an example. In German, the objects of some prepositions can be either dative or accusative depending on the meaning. This article says it's about objects of verbs. I suspect it can apply either to verbs or to prepositions. Michael Hardy (talk) 15:16, 22 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Modification

I modified the page extensively, I hope is better now. I also add some links. Miguel (talk) 08:55, 31 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

German

Is the distinction in German between dative and accusative forms of nouns and pronouns an example of this? In German, as in English, a verb can have both direct and indirect objects, but unlike in English, there are some verbs that have only dative objects and not accusative objects (gehören, helfen, begegnen, folgen,...), and as in English, many verbs can have both (except that in English the form doesn't change; only the word order does).

I see that no one's commented on my nearly one-year-old comment on objects of German prepositions above. Michael Hardy (talk) 19:25, 19 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think the German case counts. According to the article, DOM is two different kinds of direct objects, but the objects of gehören, helfen, begegnen, folgen etc. are considered indirect objects. And objects of prepositions aren't direct objects either. +An gr 20:39, 19 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

As per An. If the Spanish distinction btw "a" objects (people) and those lacking it (things) qualifies, is the same true for Russian (where the distinction is included in the noun paradigm)? It looks basically like the same thing, once synthetic, once analytic, doesn't it? Trigaranus (talk) 21:21, 17 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I stumbled onto this page after editing this answer to a question comparing Japanese particles to other languages. These languages also seem to exhibit DOM by having a direct object marker that is used only in certain situations:

Hebrew "את" (at) - Only when the direct object is semantically definite.
Romanian "pe" - Only used when the direct object is 1) a proper noun; the name of a person or animal 2) a common noun referring to a specific person, generally known to both the speaker and listener 3) a common noun acting as a metaphor for a person 4) a common noun in a construction in which the subject and the direct object are the same noun and they precede the predicate.

— Hippietrail (talk) 06:27, 22 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hebrew, Romanian and Spanish (and several others) are indeed mentioned as examples of differential object marking in this: Judith Aissen. 2003. Differential Object Marking: Iconicity vs. Economy. Natural Language and Linguistic Theory 21,435-483. You can see a draft copy at her web page (http://people.ucsc.edu/~aissen/). Mcswell (talk) 00:42, 24 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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Which are the alternative orderings that are not permitted?

The current version of the article includes:

”However, when the object is nonspecific, alternative ordering is not permitted: Sakha”

followed, however, by four phrases with the same word orders as in the examples (before the quoted sentences) with the specific objects, and with no marking of any ungrammatical sentences. How is the reader supposed to know which are the “alternatively ordered” expressions that are not permitted?

And what is the string “: Sakha” intended to mean?Redav (talk) 09:22, 4 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Redav: Thank you for bringing this up, well-spotted. "Sakha" is residual text that has become unnecessary with the subsection header. As for the examples, I have added the missing information from the source. –Austronesier (talk) 11:27, 4 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]