Talk:Dahlia Lithwick/Archive 1

Archive 1

Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: rejected by reviewer, closed by Schwede66 talk 16:48, 10 January 2024 (UTC)

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• Comment or view
• Article history

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• ... that Muppet Theory has been used an aid to improving workplace culture? Source: Rabstenek, Sara B. "Kickoff Kit: Tools to Help Teams Work Better Together" NYT Open November 2, 2018
  • Reviewed:
  • Comment: Bork, bork, bork

Created by Sennalen (talk). Self-nominated at 19:20, 1 December 2023 (UTC). Post-promotion hook changes for this nom will be logged at Template talk:Did you know nominations/Muppet Theory; consider watching this nomination, if it is successful, until the hook appears on the Main Page.

• Starting review Valereee (talk) 21:12, 3 December 2023 (UTC)

General: Article is new enough and long enough
New enough: Long enough:

Policy: Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems
Adequate sourcing: Neutral: Free of copyright violations, plagiarism, and close paraphrasing:

Hook: Hook has been verified by provided inline citation
Cited: Interesting:

QPQ: None required.

Overall: Valereee (talk) 21:12, 3 December 2023 (UTC)

• First para of theory needs a source. Valereee (talk) 21:17, 3 December 2023 (UTC)

After submitting someone split the first paragraph with a new section header. I inserted new refs. Sennalen (talk) 23:22, 3 December 2023 (UTC)

• Hook source does not appear to be a RS. Valereee (talk) 21:20, 3 December 2023 (UTC)

NYT Open is hosted on medium.com but under the editorial control of the New York Times, so it is not WP:UGC. Sennalen (talk) 23:22, 3 December 2023 (UTC)

I'm not seeing any evidence of editorial oversight, though...it kind of looks like these are personal projects of NYT employees. The about page for The NYT Open Team says "We’re New York Times employees writing about workplace culture, and how we design and build digital products for journalism." I'm not sure that's good enough for a main page appearance. Valereee (talk) 16:27, 4 December 2023 (UTC)

Agree with Valereee: I checked the article and hook before I read discussion and came to the same conclusion about the given source WP:MEDIUM. Bruxton (talk) 16:15, 10 December 2023 (UTC)

Valereee (talk) 21:25, 3 December 2023 (UTC)

Nominator blocked
Valereee quick note that I've indefinitely blocked Sennalen. Galobtter (talk) 04:41, 10 December 2023 (UTC) Ah, yes, thanks Galobtter. Valereee (talk) 10:10, 10 December 2023 (UTC)

I removed the hook sentence and WP:MEDIUM reference from the article so we will need a new hook. Earwig is down and I have not inspected all parts of the article. I am not sure it is as complete as it can be in parts so I made some edits. More can also be added so I will look at what can be added. One item to consider is that this is the theory has only been in use since 2012 and most of our sources refer back to the 2012 Slate article. Bruxton (talk) 16:15, 10 December 2023 (UTC)

• ALT1: ... that Muppet Theory claims that every living human is either a Chaos Muppet or an Order Muppet? Muppet Theory, a little-known, poorly understood philosophy that holds that every living human can be classified according to one simple metric: Every one of us is either a Chaos Muppet or an Order Muppet.

• ALT2: ... that Slate magazine published an article about Muppet Theory which categorized U.S. Supreme Court justice John Roberts as an Order muppet? (Slate source above) Bruxton (talk) 16:15, 10 December 2023 (UTC)

Appriving both ALT1 and ALT2, although I'd suggest an ALT2a ...Antonin Scalia as a Chaos muppet might be more interesting, I don't think that minor tweak would need a new reviewer. Valereee (talk) 17:11, 10 December 2023 (UTC)

Per Valereee's suggestion:

• ALT3: ... that Slate magazine published an article about Muppet Theory which categorized U.S. Supreme Court justice Antonin Scalia as a Chaos muppet? Bruxton (talk) 18:14, 10 December 2023 (UTC)

just for approval of ALT3, just to be on the safe side. Valereee (talk) 18:36, 10 December 2023 (UTC)

ALT3 short enough, cited, and interesting. Good to go.--Launchballer 01:29, 27 December 2023 (UTC)

• Pulled from prep and rejected as per WT:DYK. Schwede66 16:47, 10 January 2024 (UTC)

Inclusion criteria for the list of muppets

I did not individually cite sources for each muppet, but they are all supported by one or more sources that are used for other statements. I suggest this be the general approach unless any are specifically challenged. There are sources that include others (such as Miss Piggy) but they did not seem especially prominent views or useful in other ways, so I didn't include just to add a muppet to the list. Sennalen (talk) 20:07, 1 December 2023 (UTC)

Related topic

It's not quite on topic and predates Muppet Theory by a year, but maybe someone will find this useful in some other context: A Muppet of a Marxist, or a Very Marxist Muppet? Sennalen (talk) 22:09, 1 December 2023 (UTC)

Das Capital

speaking of Marxism... @Sennalen: It kind of seems like the title should be lowercase, no? I won't open a RM because I don't want to shit up your article but you might want to consider. jp×g🗯️ 20:05, 4 December 2023 (UTC)

I thought about that, but Lithwick wrote it "Muppet Theory". I think that gives it the dignity it is due. Sennalen (talk) 20:10, 4 December 2023 (UTC)

Fair enough. jp×g🗯️ 09:43, 5 December 2023 (UTC)

If so, the article should use uppercase for "Theory" throughout, but it doesn’t. Schwede66 17:54, 10 December 2023 (UTC)