Talk:Clock Tower, Hong Kong

Infobox

The Infobox is missing lots of information. Please add information if you can. Also, the native building name is "Tsim Sha Tsui Clock Tower" in Chinese, please translate "Kowloon-Canton Railway Clock Tower" in Chinese.

Thanks to Baycrest for the Chinese name. --Siipikarja ♫ 20:15, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

{{Infobox building
| building_name       = Former Kowloon-Canton Railway Clock Tower
| native_building_name= 尖沙咀鐘樓
| image               = TSTClockTower.jpg
| caption             =
| former_names        =  
| building_type       = Clock tower
| architectural_style = 
| structural_system   = 
| location            = {{Flagicon|Hong Kong}} [[Hong Kong]]
| owner               =
| current_tenants     =
| landlord            =
| coordinates         = {{coord|22|17|37.24|N|114|10|09.71|E|region:HK_type:landmark|display=inline,title}}
| start_date          = 1913
| completion_date     = 1915
| demolition_date     = 
| height              = 45m (147 feet)
| diameter            =
| other_dimensions    = 7m (22 feet) lightning rod
| floor_count         =
| floor_area          = 
| main_contractor     = 
| architect           = 
| structural_engineer = 
| services_engineer   = 
| civil_engineer      = 
| other_designers     = 
| quantity_surveyor   = 
| awards              = [[Declared_monuments_of_Hong_Kong|A declared monument in Hong Kong]]
}}

--Siipikarja 15:34, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the proposal was No consensus, or, more precisely, there's consensus that it doesn't matter so much :-). The current descriptive title seems to be most common, at least for the tourist business; Tsim Sha Tsui Clock Tower also makes sense. Duja► 10:58, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

---

Should the article be renamed to Former Kowloon-Canton Railway Clock Tower as it is the official name. Or should we use Tsim Sha Tsui Clock Tower? See Wikipedia:Naming conventions (architecture).

I would favour Tsim Sha Tsui Clock Tower as not many tourists would know that it was part of the KCR property, all they think of is just a clock tower. Willirennen 18:26, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

---

Isn't just "Clock Tower" the most common English name? Hong Qi Gong (Talk - Contribs) 20:01, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

---

Hmmm... If the article is to be trusted , the clock tower is indeed known as Tsim Sha Tsui Clock Tower for most of the locals. The tourist probably think of it as just a clock tower, as you said. But does that mean that the article should be renamed accordingly? Especially when an official name exists. Few would of course search for an article entitled Former Kowloon-Canton Railway Clock Tower, but then again, who searches for Chinese People's Liberation Army Forces Hong Kong Building ;) I'm in favor of the official name. Redirects to Tsim Sha Tsui Clock Tower | Clock Tower, Hong Kong | Kowloon Clock Tower | etc. --Siipikarja ♫ 20:12, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

It's commonly known as 尖沙咀鐘樓 to the locals, which translates as "Tsim Sha Tsui Clock Tower". But what's the common name in English? That's what I'm wondering. Hong Qi Gong (Talk - Contribs) 20:21, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

Does anyone know what is the current Wikipedia naming convention for buildings? Wikipedia:Naming conventions (architecture) are tagged as historical. Do we want the common or the official name? I would guess that for a host of people this Wikipedia article is their first contact with the Clock Tower. So, how do we want to introduce the building to them? --Siipikarja ♫ 20:40, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

So, there's no opposition to renaming to Former Kowloon-Canton Railway Clock Tower? --Siipikarja ♫ 12:19, 21 September 2007 (UTC)

I am opposed to it, because I think the common name is better, and I don't think the common name is "Former Kowloon-Canton Railway Clock Tower". Hong Qi Gong (Talk - Contribs) 14:53, 21 September 2007 (UTC)

Ok. So it's a no for Former Kowloon-Canton Railway Clock Tower. How about Tsim Sha Tsui Clock Tower then? As you said before, It's commonly known as 尖沙咀鐘樓 to the locals, which translates as "Tsim Sha Tsui Clock Tower". Clock Tower, Hong Kong is IMO too vague. --Siipikarja ♫ 19:55, 21 September 2007 (UTC)

Alright, I'm Ok with "Tsim Sha Tsui Clock Tower". Hong Qi Gong (Talk - Contribs) 20:07, 21 September 2007 (UTC)

Good. Let's wait for a couple of days before moving. Just in case someone else wants to vote in favor or against. --Siipikarja ♫ 20:14, 21 September 2007 (UTC)

After searching on Google (keyword Clock Tower Hong Kong), I found that there are not much English articles name it as Tsim Sha Tsui Clock Tower, but Clock Tower. — HenryLi (Talk) 04:27, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

I would be neutral in this renaming discussion. As Hong Qi Gong said, locals use 尖沙咀鐘樓 (Tsim Sha Tsui Clock Tower) and never use 前九廣鐵路鐘樓 (Former Kowloon-Canton Railway Clock Tower) as common name. I concern more about how it is called for offical purpose. The most common online map in Hong Kong [1] simply uses 鐘樓 and Clock Tower. Offical website of Hong Kong Tourism Board [2] uses 前九廣鐵路鐘樓 and Clock Tower for introducing to the tourists. It seems to me that Clock Tower is enough whatever in formal or informal purpose. Tsim Sha Tsui Clock Tower is the translation from Chinese common name 尖沙咀鐘樓, while Former Kowloon-Canton Railway Clock Tower is the most offical but least common. Baycrest 09:03, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

It seems to me that all the above discussion misses the point. The fundamental question is: What is the most recognised name in English? This may turn out to be the translation of the Chinese name, or it may turn out to be the official name, or it may be neither. Andrewa 15:43, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

From Google search in English, mostly it is referred as Clock Tower only. It is not uncommon that names differs among languages, official and common usage. Say the demolished clock tower on Pedder Street in Central. It was known as The Clock Tower in English and 大鐘樓 in Cantonese at its life time. Some official document nowadays coins a new name to the clock tower as Pedder Street Clock Tower (畢打街鐘樓) but in fact the Cantonese street name was 必打街 when the tower erected. — HenryLi (Talk) 16:28, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

"Clock tower" is by far the most regular name. "Tsim Sha Tsui Clock tower" is also fine, but there is no real gain in this page move. "Former Kowloon-Canton Railway Clock Tower" should just be avoided. Benjwong 06:25, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.