Talk:Christianity in Syria

[Conflicting sources]

The Syrian population as the World Bank is 22.85 million (2013), 1,800,000 of them are Christians, so the percentage should be 7.87% not 10%!

I'm a Syrian who raised as Christian and I don't think there were up to 10% Christians in Syria before civil war!. 7% is more rational

--Moußsa (talk) 11:12, 6 February 2017 (UTC)

Hi Moußsa, you're conflating different numbers, the 22.85 Million population figure is outdated, that figure estimate was taken during the early years of the war (2013). The CIA Factbook says the Syrian population in July 2016 was 17,185,170 and they still put the percentage of Christians at 10%, therefore 10% of 17,185,170 is 1.8 million. But then again, The editor who provided the pre-war number of 1.8 million is incorrectly attributing this to the 2017 CIA estimate, I will try to fix this if I can find the 2013 CIA link. https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/sy.html

However, the numbers cited are still wrong, in that before the war, there were over 2.3 million Christians (when the Syrian population was around 23 million) and the 500 000 figure for today's Christian population figure is dubious at best. The first source is an international Christian one that is grossly exaggerating the decline in numbers in order to get the West to help Syrian Christians and the second news article provides no credible sources. The majority of Christians in Syria live in the West, which is still overwhelmingly in the hands of the government; thus 500 000 goes against the established facts. George Al-Shami (talk) 01:23, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

Moreover the 10% figure before the war, was the established academic consensus; whereas the Syrian clergy put the number of Syrian Christians at 15% and I remember very clearly, the official Syrian tourism website put the number at 12%. You might feel that Syria was only 7% Christian, however that doesn't make it factual; the 55-year-old CIA factbook's detailed information is very precise and reliable; as a matter of fact, the CIA Factbook is commonly used as a source for academic research. George Al-Shami (talk) 01:32, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

[Untitled]

This page is very clearly biased. Whilst some of the comments about discrimination may be true the leading and subjective comments, espcially in the closing paragraph, undermine any authority the article may have. Furthermore it calls the 'facts' (population figures) into question

Agreed! This article should be completely re-written. The last paragraph is of a special bias.

I would like to mention that the statement: "Recently there has been no threat on the decreasing population of Christians, but the percentage of Christians is dropping due to Islam being the main source of legislation." is completely inaccurate. Islam is the second source of legislation and it is only applied on Moslims. Christians have their own courts and things like marriage, divorce and all civil cases are looked at there. The article doesn't mention that a lot of representatives, ministers and local administrators are Christians. The article doesn't mention the special places Christians have. For instances, schools in Christian dominated areas have the weekend on Saturday and Sunday (weekend in Syria is on Friday and Saturday), christian government employee have the right of not coming to work until 12 on Sunday morning so they can have the chance to go to church. Christmas, Easter etc are all official holidays. The article doesn't also mention Christian sects: Roman Catholics, Roman Orthodox, Assyrian catholics, Assyrian Orthodox, Aremnian Catholics, Armenian Orthodox, Maronites, Latins and Protestants. Many provinces are Christian dominated, e.g., Damascus, Swaida, Hasakeh, Tartous and Homs.

Christians dominate?

When you say Christians "dominate" Damascus, Swaida, Hasakeh, Tartous and Homs, what do you mean? Do they form a numerical majority (I do not believe this is the case)?

I understand that there are regions where Christians are preponderant in the population (e.g. around Ma`loula) - perhaps some more detail on this could be given? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 164.143.244.34 (talk) 16:17, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

Consistency with other Syria articles

As well as concerns expressed above, some of this information does not currently match that in the Religion in Syria article or Religion section of the main Syria article and the Islam in Syria articles. Eg. Overall proportion of Christians (10%, 5-10% or 8-10%). Please can we keep these all aligned, and show references. Earthlyreason (talk) 08:37, 2 November 2008 (UTC)

Agree! 20% christians in Syria? Thats a joke... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.135.150.94 (talk) 18:39, 2 April 2009 (UTC)

Largest group

Ok, I know it doesn't really matter that much on an amature self post encyclopedia site but I have ran the numbers myself several times and it really does look like the Greek Orthodox are not the largest group. The Melkites (who are in communion with Rome) by themselves are larger and besides that, the other groups in communion with Rome add to the Catholic number. The recent immigrations into Syria from Iraq have also increased the number of Chaldeans there. In total, there are now over two times as many Catholics, of one group or another, than there are members of the Greek Patriarchate of Antioch.

But of course, I never want you to take my word for it. Please check the numbers yourself. Then, should what I have said prove to be true, it might be polite to update the article with more accurate numbers. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 219.127.251.137 (talk) 01:51, 17 November 2008 (UTC)

VAST persecution of Christians in Syria - new section needed!!!

This article ignores Syria's ongoing persecution of Christians. A simple Google search brings up many references such as the just released Amnesty International report.

The only HINT is the statement that some Syrian Christians do not "proselytize" and do not accept Islamic converts.Lindisfarnelibrary (talk) 09:19, 20 June 2013 (UTC)

Agreed - though not your wording: the persecution is not done by "Syria" but by Islamist groups and individuals operating inside Syria, including large numbers of foreign terrorists. Tiptoethrutheminefield (talk) 21:09, 3 May 2014 (UTC) Blocked sock:Meowy.

Syrian Popes of the Catholic Church

sorry i'm not good in English, but in the section Christianity in Syria#Popes of the Catholic Church contains that Pope St Sergius I, was born in Syria but at List of popes it is different (born in Sicily). please check wich one is true and correct it.--Syrian Eng (talk) 20:21, 3 July 2014 (UTC)

note: at Русский Wikipedia version which is featured article in it, also said that he is Syrian (сириец) --Syrian Eng (talk) 20:43, 3 July 2014 (UTC)

Ok, I looked it up, you're right he was born in Sicily, however he was from Syrian ancestry or "parentage" as the Encyclopedia Britannica puts it. Of course, I inserted the source in the notes section to substantiate it.George Al-Shami (talk) 21:22, 3 July 2014 (UTC)

Persecution

User:Ferakp, Non of that paragraph has anything to do with persecution. What the hell !!!! The notion of Persecuting Christians means that you are doing it based on their religion but non of the mentioned accusations have anything to do with religious persecution.

The first paragraph is about the civil war in Lebanon but this article is about Christianity in the state of Syria not the actions of its government in other countries.

The arrest of those people from Qamishli is politically based and no reliable source would support that they were arrested because they are Christians. The same can be said about Bassel.

Please do not misrepresent sources and misinterpret them to produce such a totally out of scope, out of space section.--Attar-Aram syria (talk) 20:56, 20 December 2016 (UTC)

I concur with Attar-Aram syria's sentiments. I checked the sources used and they point to politically-motivated attacks against Syrians, who happened to be Christian; such as Bassel's tragic murder. After all a sizable majority of Syrian Christians support the Assad regime, it wouldn't make any sense for Assad to attack them based on their religion. Research also shows that religious minorities tend to support authoritarian governments for fear of the tyranny of the majority in a society with free and fair elections; however falsely-guided these fears are, because in a true democracy the rights of all citizens, including religious minorities, are upheld.1 What Nusra and other Pro-Isis Syrians did in Ma'loula would fall under the confines of persecution; kidnapping 12 nuns and deliberately attacking and singling out Christians, their churches, and homes. George Al-Shami (talk) 02:52, 21 December 2016 (UTC)

Relax Attar-Aram syria & George Al-Shami: I wanted to human rights violations of Assad regime against Christians (activists, politicians etc) to one of the articles and it seems this is the best one. The Christians in Syria article redirects me to this article. The persecution title was probably bad as I took it from another article. If I can't add them to this article then I have to request a new article for it. You just deleted all my sources and content, and whether it's politically-motivated or not, Christians don't have self-determination in Syria and their rights are limited. It's a fact and it was sourced. I recommend we request a new article where we can also mention crimes of al-Nusra, opposition forces and ISIS gangs too. Ferakp (talk) 07:18, 21 December 2016 (UTC)

I am waiting both of you to answer or show me another article where I can add these things. Ferakp (talk) 17:02, 25 December 2016 (UTC)

What things? What happened in the lebanese war belong in the article about that war but again, you cant highlight the christian character because nothing that happened had anything to do with christianity. You will be reverted quickly if you will write that Assad father fought in Lebanon because they were Christians without having reliable sources that prove such a huge "stupid" claim. All other things you mentioned belong in the Syrian Civil War article, perhaps human rights section. Again, you need to prove that the mentioned people were targeted because they were christians. Dont forget the atrocities of the YPG BTW.--Attar-Aram syria (talk) 17:21, 25 December 2016 (UTC)

I agree with Attar. I have reverted it per wp:synth. 176.54.71.27 (talk) 17:27, 25 December 2016 (UTC)

• Ferakp, are you here because you are throwing punches at your opponents on the Iraqi Christians page ? Please leave this page away from those dumb fights. Christians in Syria are not persecuted for their religion. For real, find something else to do other than those internet wars. I didnt respond because you had no merits in your arguments. This isnt a supermarket where you can demand things. You cant tell us to give you an article to insert your edits or else you will insert them here. The consensus was against you and there was no point of arguing with you since you are making nonsense edits. The consensus is still against you and your edits have no place.--Attar-Aram syria (talk) 17:37, 25 December 2016 (UTC)

If user Ferakp continues those silly games, i will ask the admins for topic ban for user Ferakp and range block for the antagonist sock ips that belong to a Turkish sockpuppet. 176.54.71.27 (talk) 17:44, 25 December 2016 (UTC)

176.54.71.27, it would be an appropriate action. We have tons of evidence that those users are only here to fight and not here to build an encyclopedia.--Attar-Aram syria (talk) 17:58, 25 December 2016 (UTC)

Both of you, go ahead and report me. I added sourced information, if you don't like it then it's your problem. I will call some admins/users to give opinion. Also, I deleted that Lebanese part after you said it doesn't belong to the article. Ferakp (talk) 19:01, 25 December 2016 (UTC)

You dont get it, right? I can add sourced info about the mating habits of elephants... they wont belong and will be out of scope and will be deleted, just like your edits.--Attar-Aram syria (talk) 19:23, 25 December 2016 (UTC)

@Ferakp:, victim's religion (Christianity, Druze etc) does not prove that he/she persecuted because of his/her religion. Thus, i have reverted them per WP:SYNTH. 176.54.71.27 (talk) 19:31, 25 December 2016 (UTC)

Arriving late to this, but I agree that it is unacceptable to claim "persecution of Christianity" for incidents where those involved just incidentally happened to be Christian. And the content regarding Lebanon was, in addition, off-topic. Tiptoethrutheminefield (talk) 17:42, 2 January 2017 (UTC) Blocked sock:Meowy.

Biased sources

Dear 88.128.80.182 editor,

You used three sources. The AINA is not reliable source, the second one is written by Paul Antonopoulos who is pro-Assad journalist. Despite that, the source talks about militia, not civilians, which you claimed. There are also other sources which are against your sources, such an Aranews article. AA is Turkish state media and it's even less reliable than Almasdar and AINA. What you wrote should be in this article as I added Assad's atrocities too, but you have to rewrite them neutrally. Also, remember to mention that they are "militias". Ferakp (talk) 16:58, 25 December 2016 (UTC)

This one [1] is not sourced and it's baseless claim. Ferakp (talk) 16:59, 25 December 2016 (UTC)

Who said AINA is not reliable. This isnt for you to decide.--Attar-Aram syria (talk) 17:21, 25 December 2016 (UTC)

@Ferakp:, maybe it is slightly out of the topic but that ip belong to Turkish nationalist sockpuppet Lrednuas Senoroc. See: Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Lrednuas Senoroc. Clear WP:Duck case. So i recommend you to report him, instead of vandalize the page. 176.54.71.27 (talk) 17:33, 25 December 2016 (UTC)

@176.54.71.27: I don't care whether it's sockpuppet or not. I have reported them so many times and after a ban, they come again with a new sockpuppet.Ferakp (talk) 19:02, 25 December 2016 (UTC)

@Ferakp:, dealing with socks is not that hard. Anyway, i'll leave that "learned helplessness" to you. 176.54.71.27 (talk) 19:38, 25 December 2016 (UTC)

Neutrality

The use of the terme "Assads forces" is a part of a praticular biased narrative. It makes as little sence as to call the US army "Trumps Forces". So I changed it to The correct "Ths Syrian Arab Army" respectively "The Syrian Governement". It is not the job of Wikipedia to brand any particular political leader a dictator. That is a matter of personal oppinion.

You can change it to something else, however Trump was elected democratically, Assad wasn't. George Al-Shami (talk) 03:02, 6 September 2017 (UTC)