Talk:Cerro Tuzgle

A few comments following a GOCE copy-edit of January 26-27, 2016

Jo-Jo Eumerus Well done! This one is even better than the last one on the other stratovolcano. Just a few comments:

1) The second sentence in the lead begins:

• It is a prominent back-arc volcanic centre

I'm wondering if it would make sense to link "back-arc" to Back-arc basin.

Also, I'm wondering why you're using British English spelling. It's O.K., but why?

2) In the second paragraph in the sub-section "Regional setting" in the section Cerro Tuzgle#Geology and geography is the following sentence:

• A large low velocity and low seismic attenuation anomaly is found between 20 and 24° latitude.

I'd like to link either "seismic attenuation" or "attenuation" so a non-expert can read more. I found two possible articles:

(1) Attenuation#Earthquake

(2) Anelastic attenuation factor

I wonder if one of these might be good.

3) In the last paragraph in that same section is the phrase "two monogenetic volcanoes". Would it make sense to link "monogenetic volcanoes" to Monogenetic volcanic field, or some other article?

4) The last sentence of the first paragraph of the section Cerro Tuzgle#Local setting is:

• There is tomographic evidence that lithospheric delamination is currently underway beneath Tuzgle.

I'd like to link "delamination" to something but I couldn't find the right article. There is no mention of "delamination" even in the article on the Lithosphere. There is an article on Lamination, but it has nothing to do with the lithosphere or plate tectonics.

5) In the second paragraph of the lead is the following sentence:

• Later, the first lava domes were erupted.

I believe I may have brought this up when I copy-edited the other long article on a South American volcano a few months ago. To a non-expert like myself, the passive voice form of the verb to erupt, "were erupted", sounds strange. I think I know what is meant, that the lava domes were forced up and out of the earth by the force of a volcanic eruption; in other words, the eruption created the lava domes. But most non-experts are used to seeing the verb in active voice: the volcano erupted, or the volcano is erupting. Later, there may be descriptions of what exactly occurred, and you might see things like, "Lava spewed forth and flowed down the sides of the volcano", or "Molten lava and hot gases shot high into the sky", or "The volcano ejected boulders and hot gases". Ordinarily, you would not see "X was erupted [by the volcano/by the eruption]", or "Ys were erupted [by the volcano/by the eruption]". Therefore, I must assume either that this is language used mainly by experts in the field or that it is a translation from Spanish. If it is language used in English by experts in the field, it's O.K. It can stay in the article, but I'm wondering then whether it could be briefly explained the first time it is used (perhaps not in the lead, though), perhaps with a parenthetical phrase such as:

• Later, the first lava domes were erupted, or created in an eruption.

or:

• Later, the first lava domes were erupted (forced out of the ground in an eruption).

That way, an average non-expert reader would know what "were erupted" meant. What do you think? Corinne (talk) 01:36, 27 January 2016 (UTC)

I've added a few links to the lead and changed/removed some contradictory or simply confusing date bits. Vsmith (talk) 15:03, 27 January 2016 (UTC)

• Thanks for the assistance, Vsmith and Corinne! I'll try to work on the questions/issues raised tomorrow, but now "meatspace" work needs to take precedence.Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 15:06, 27 January 2016 (UTC)

6) Why does it say "Susques Department, Jujuy Province, Argentina" in the infobox but "Los Andes Department of Salta Province in Argentina" in the lead? Corinne (talk) 19:36, 27 January 2016 (UTC)

7) In the second paragraph of the section Cerro Tuzgle#Regional setting is the following sentence:

• Several major fault zones run across the Puna in the area, the most important being the Toro lineament to the south of Tuzgle on which several Pleistocene volcanoes – Cordon Puntas Negras, Rincon, Tul Tul-Del Medio-Pocitos, Quevar, and Tastil (from north to south) (as well as the Negra Muerta volcanic complex) – align and which has been subject to left-lateral displacement, as well as a segment named the Chorrillos fault located directly south of Tuzgle.

I'm wondering whether this sentence isn't a little too long and a bit convoluted. The verb ("align") comes after a very long parenthetical phrase (set off by en-dashes), and it's not immediately clear to what the phrase beginning "as well as" is following or is connected to. Corinne (talk) 19:48, 27 January 2016 (UTC)

• I see that Vsmith has already worked on some issues brought up here. The British English is deliberate; I prefer to use that spelling when writing stuff. Linked to the first proposed page for "seismic attenuation" and found Delamination (geology) for the delamination subject. Regarding the departments, apparently the volcano lies within Jujuy, so corrected that. Regarding 5), it's a convention used in the field - not sure what the preferred rewording in plain English is. 7) needs a bit more though on my part.Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 13:03, 28 January 2016 (UTC)
  • OK, @Corinne:. I've just made a minor copyedit to the text to address 6 and 7. Does it look good now?Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 19:52, 3 February 2016 (UTC)

Jo-Jo Eumerus I re-arranged the sentence; hope I got the information right. Can you please check to be sure the references are in the right place? I wasn't sure whether to move a reference to an earlier place in the sentence. Corinne (talk) 04:08, 4 February 2016 (UTC)

I've rearranged one reference to account for the location change of the information.Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 08:52, 4 February 2016 (UTC)

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Cerro Tuzgle/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Sainsf (talk · contribs) 07:12, 26 April 2016 (UTC)

Hi! Will get to this soon. Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 07:12, 26 April 2016 (UTC)

Lead

• I think the details in the first line should be repeated in the main article.
• Any idea on how the volcano gets its name?
• "Crater" may be linked
• Sulfur was formerly mined on the mountain Since when has this stopped?

Regional setting

• (La Negra formation^[6]) This is generally written as (La Negra formation)^[6]
• It would be good to link "faulting" and "Puna". Puna is linked in the next section, but this is the first mention
• 16 and 28° south add "latitude"
• 20 and 24° latitude add "south"
• geochemistry and geographic indicators Should it be "geochemical"?
• travertine deposits (24°10′S 66°40′W) Why are coordinates provided only for this?
• from 4,400 metres (14,400 ft) altitude south to 4,100 metres (13,500 ft) altitude north What is "altitude north/south"?

Local setting

• Ordovican is linked twice and Miocene is a duplink
• An image or two more would go well with the text.
• A low gravity field anomaly is also found in the area This is something interesting. Anything more on this?
• Can we have subsections for better navigation?
• northnortheast-southsouthwest Can be written as "N-NE to S-SW"

@Sainsf: Addressed a number of suggestions. Several notes:

1. Not sure how to integrate the first sentence into the article. Probably something in the "local" section.

It has to be integrated, I leave it to you to decide which place would hold it best.

1. There does not appear to be information on when the mines were abandoned or what the etymology is.
2. Probably better to stick with "geochemistry", it can be used as a nount like that.
3. The travertine deposits are a bit away from the volcano, but I think that we could lose that citation.
4. Not sure what subsections to use. Maybe a "petrology" section for the chemistry-related info?

Alright, do what is possible.

1. Linked the gravity anomaly thing; not as interesting as it sounds, unfortunately!

That's for now.Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 19:33, 30 April 2016 (UTC)

Thanks for the quick response. I have struck or the resolved issues. I'll list the rest of the comments in a few days, a bit busy now. Cheers! Sainsf (talk · contribs) 17:04, 3 May 2016 (UTC)

• Worked somewhat crudely on the remaining two issues.Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 18:59, 3 May 2016 (UTC)

Alright, those done, here are a few more comments from the rest of the article.

• Link rhyodacite (Composition and origin)
• Duplinks: thermobarometry (Composition and origin), ignimbrite, Pleistocene, Holocene (Activity), Miocene (Geothermal area and sulfur)
• a company named Geotermina Andina What sort of a company? Mining?
• are already exploited "already being"?
• Puna should be linked at first mention.
• The climate of the Puna is arid nowadays "nowadays" is implied, and thus redundant
• What are orbital changes?

That should be it. Sainsf (talk · contribs) 06:10, 4 May 2016 (UTC)

• @Sainsf: I think I got these.Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 19:35, 4 May 2016 (UTC)

Very well, this can now be promoted. Cheers, Sainsf (talk · contribs) 05:53, 5 May 2016 (UTC)

Cerro Tuzgle

Article (edit | visual edit | history) · Article talk (edit | history) · Watch • Watch article reassessment page • Most recent review

Result: Kept, one support and no issues raised for multiple months. CMD (talk) 12:52, 8 March 2021 (UTC)

This article was listed as a good article a little over four years ago, but I've done a major rewrite this last week that has a different structure. Consequently, I'd like to see the article re-reviewed to check whether it still meets the GA criteria. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 19:29, 27 October 2020 (UTC)

• Edits are a substantial improvement imo, I see no reason why the article doesn't meet the GA criteria. (t · c) buidhe 09:02, 29 October 2020 (UTC)

cerro tuzgle

Moved from User talk:Jo-Jo Eumerus

 – Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 06:06, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

hello, Jo-Jo Eumerus! i had two questions regarding this article and the associated blurb.

• is "flank collapse unit" a technical term used by volcanologists? i tried searching for it via google, but the results appear to only include this article, its blurb, or sources that apparently copied from wikipedia. i am admittedly not sure if there are enough context clues in the blurb for most main page readers to confidently determine the meaning of the term. (my current guess is that "flank collapse unit" means "a geological feature formed by a collapse on a volcano outside its center", but that was only after looking through the article, and i am still not sure if i am understanding it correctly.) i think the scarp and the depression mentioned in the first section of the article are the units being referred to, but the article states that the scarp "probably formed through a localized collapse" and the depression "may also be evidence of a collapse", so i am not sure if one of them has been confirmed to be a flank collapse unit.
• in "Subsequently, lava domes were erupted and several lava flows;", is "several lava flows" a clause? if so, i am guessing that "flows" is the verb, but this would mean that "lava" is being treated as a plural noun, which doesn't agree with "flows". alternatively, if "were erupted" is the verb phrase associated with the noun phrase "several lava flows", i think this use of ellipsis is confusing. (similarly, "Jo-Jo Eumerus edits wikipedia and dying" is also likely difficult to parse.) i was thinking of rephrasing this as "Subsequently, lava domes and several lava flows erupted;" (or even "Subsequently, several lava domes and flows erupted;"), but i don't know if this would be accurate.

dying (talk) 18:18, 18 June 2023 (UTC)

Greetings, Dying. I've moved this conversation to the article talk page, since it has more to do with the article than with me. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 06:06, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

No, "flank collapse unit" is the term I use to describe the unit formed by the flank collapse. Maybe calling it "unit formed by the flank collapse" is less misleading? I've rewritten the other part. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 06:09, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Jo-Jo Eumerus, i admittedly think the wording would still be a bit awkward, in either "a confirmed unit formed by the flank collapse and a possible one" or "one confirmed and one possible unit formed by the flank collapse". was there only one flank collapse? also, i think neither the blurb nor the article lead mention a flank collapse before referring to the units, so perhaps using the definite article would be inappropriate.

your response led me to realize that "flank collapse" is a technical term, which appears to be discussed on wikipedia here. is this something that you think would be appropriate to link? i also recently found the stratigraphic unit article. is this what you mean when you use the word "unit"?

i am still unsure if the scarp and the depression are the two features being referred to as the confirmed flank unit and the possible one, but if so, would the following rewrite of the sentence in the blurb referring to them be accurate?

Also associated with Tuzgle are a scarp and a depression, both possibly formed by flank collapses, as well as an ignimbrite sheet.

note that, if "unit" does refer to "stratigraphic unit", i felt that this may not be obvious to many main page readers, even if the term was linked, so i thought that simply stating what the units actually were would make the blurb more clear. also, i did not state that the scarp was confirmed to be the result of a flank collapse, as the article body appears to be less certain, only stating that "it probably formed through a localized collapse". dying (talk) 20:47, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Yes, that rewrite works. I don't think we ought to specify "stratigraphic unit" as the term's a bit fuzzy. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 07:18, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Jo-Jo Eumerus, would you mind updating the blurb for me? it is currently under cascading protection and i am not an administrator. dying (talk) 14:14, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Not doing the edit myself, mainly b/c I am not sure what to put in. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 16:21, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

oh, i'm sorry, Jo-Jo Eumerus. i had suggested simply replacing the sentence

Also associated with this volcano are an ignimbrite sheet, a confirmed flank collapse unit and a possible one.

in the blurb with the following one.

Also associated with Tuzgle are a scarp and a depression, both possibly formed by flank collapses, as well as an ignimbrite sheet.

everything else in the blurb would remain the same. my understanding is that you stated that this "rewrite works". is this not the case?

by the way, i think (but am not entirely certain) that edits like this are generally requested at wp:errors. dying (talk) 18:42, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

done, by Schwede66. dying (talk) 19:28, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

climate

In the first paragraph it says

"The region is arid, with less than 100 millimetres (3.9 in) annual precipitation"

but in the second

"Annual precipitation there amounts to 135 millimetres (5.3 in)"

either this is referring to two different parts of the area and 'there' in the second paragraph needs to be more specific or it's a contradiction.

Bob Palin (talk) 12:57, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Good job

Congratulations on your featured article status. It takes a lot of work to reach this level of excellence. Thank you for your hard work. Best Regards, Barbara ✐✉ 13:19, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Requesting protection on this article

Frequent vandals have been coming to this page. A moment ago, the image of the volcano was literally replaced with pornography. Wikentromere (talk) 13:43, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

@Wikentromere now that person is removing and re-adding it rapidly? I'm not sure why, but maybe that makes it harder to stop them. all I know is that I just saw porn on my work computer TimPerkin9 (talk) 13:47, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

This article has been hacked

Someone has uploaded a pornographic video to this article. 2A00:23C7:F789:7B01:14B7:254E:C61D:8D47 (talk) 13:43, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

It hasn’t been hacked. This is Wikipedia. Anyone can edit things. It’s vandalism, let’s not blow things out of proportion here. It should be given edit protection and the account @Spanishabbcyshould be suspended. Wikentromere (talk) 13:45, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Tomayto tomaaato. It’s my shorthand version of saying what you just said. Lol blow things out of proportion is that a volcano reference. 2A00:23C7:F789:7B01:14B7:254E:C61D:8D47 (talk) 13:52, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

“Back arc” - contradiction with other article?

This lead in this article states that “Tuzgle is a prominent volcano of the back arc of the Andes”. However, the linked article on “back arc” states that: “Presently all back-arc basins are submarine features associated with island arcs and subduction zones, with many found in the western Pacific Ocean.” Isn’t that a contradiction? Tuzgle is well-inland, according to the map in the article, so how can it be a “submarine feature”? Mr Serjeant Buzfuz (talk) 18:18, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

I think back-arc is incorrect; the physical definition of a back-arc basin does not require that it is submarine. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 19:09, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Can you fix the other article, then? I don't know enough to be comfortable doing so, but the two articles shouldn't contradict each other. Mr Serjeant Buzfuz (talk) 03:58, 23 June 2023 (UTC)

OK, nevermind, I see the actual problem: Back-arc is a redirect to back-arc basin even though it does not refer solely to these basins. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 07:08, 23 June 2023 (UTC)

Should that link be there, then? I’m a reader with no geology background, and it seems contradictory to me. What’s the difference between a back-arc and a back-arc basin, and shouldn’t that be made clear? Mr Serjeant Buzfuz (talk) 14:18, 23 June 2023 (UTC)

Back-arc generally refers to the region behind a volcanic arc-subduction zone. Sometimes you use it to talk about certain types of volcanoes that occur in back-arcs. Other times you mean a back-arc basin. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 15:14, 23 June 2023 (UTC)

But that is ambiguous, and seems to me to require that the reader has a geological background to understand. For someone without geological information, the wikilink is leading a reader to something that does not apply here. The link takes the reader to a discussion of sub-marine formations. How is that at all relevant to a discussion of a volcano that is well inland? I think that link should be deleted. Mr Serjeant Buzfuz (talk) 18:33, 23 June 2023 (UTC)

Maybe. As it stands, it seems like most of the links to back-arc do not refer to the basin ... because I have linked it on a lot of my articles. I dunno, perhaps the redirect should be sent to WP:RFD; it may qualify under WP:RFD#DELETE §10. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 19:30, 24 June 2023 (UTC)

Back-arc region is the article that back-arc should be linking to; I've changed the redirect to reflect this. Volcanoguy 08:08, 1 July 2023 (UTC)