Talk:Cairo/Archive 1

Archive 1

Population

Here it says "around 16 million" and in the list of metropolitan areas by population it's 15,600,000. In the article of the week candidate list someone mentions 18+ million, and in some of the different language versions of this article the figure is as high as 20 million. (Also, brief googling gave anything from 12 to 19 million.) I wonder if anyone knows the real (approximate) population of the Cairo metropolitan area... Or should we just settle with a vague "about 16-20 million"? --Jonik 19:43, 5 Jul 2004 (UTC)

I've lived there and yes, the varying estimates one hears range consistantly from 16 to 20 million. Wikipedia should be secure in the uncertainty. An official figure for the population of the Greater Cairo region is 16.075 million. That's in an area of 86,369.3 km. (Egypt Almanac 2003). --[[User:HamYoyo|Bendž

|Ť]] 22:55, Jul 8, 2004 (UTC)

A related question: according to the list of cities by population, Cairo (the city without the metropolitan area) is the most dense large city in the world. Does anyone know more about this and is it relevant to add to the article? It seems like an interesting matter --Mathan 09:00, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

== Gezira/Zamalek == rearranging section, and replying

Are Gezira and Zamalek different names for the same place in Cairo? Gareth Hughes 19:26, 12 Mar 2005 (UTC)

My understanding is that Gezira is the island, while Zamalek is the up-market residential quarter on the northern end of that island. I'm more than willing to be corrected by someone who knows the city better than me, of course. –Hajor 04:57, 14 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for that: I thought that Zamalek didn't cover all of Gezira. I'll see if I can alter the stub on Zamalek to make more sense. Gareth Hughes 10:35, 14 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Gareth is correct. Gezira is the arabic word for island (identical to Jazeera, but in Egyptian colloquial) and Zamalek is the area towards the top.

Is Cairo the largest city in Africa? If it isn't, I can only imagine Kinshasa would be bigger. Does anyone know?

--Gareth Hughes 23:25, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Cairo is the largest city in Africa by general consensus - I will try and dig up a source or two for this when I have the time.

Yet, according to some sources Lagos in Nigeria has usurped Cairo for the title of Africa's most populous city. see: Largest cities in africa —Preceding unsigned comment added by Tonicampbell20 (talk • contribs) 01:42, 11 June 2008 (UTC)

This section definitely needs to be fixed. Footnote 4, which is affixed to the sentence about Cairo being second largest city in Africa, links to http://www.africaguide.com/facts.htm, which states that Cairo is the largest city in Africa. I'm not sure how reputable that source is, but we can't have a footnote source that's in direct contradiction to the sentence it's affixed to. Deleteyourself16 (talk) 21:13, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

Origin of the name "Cairo"

There seems to be some confusion about where the name of this city came from. As this article currently reads, the introductory section states that the city originally was named as "The Subduer" or after the planet Mars, from which the name Qahirat al-Adaa ("the Subduer of Enemies") was derived. However, thumbing thru Paul E. Walker's Exploring an Islamic Empire: Fatamid History and its Sources, he states that the city was originally named al-Qahira al-Mu'izziya or "City of the Victory of al-Mu'izza"; this is the same explanation found at Fatimid.

Should I assume that Walker & the source for the Fatimid article are wrong? Or that the relationship to Mars is wrong? Or is correct to say that there are several competing etymologies for the name of this city, each of which has its own champions? (Since I know no Arabic, I can't research this issue for myself.) -- llywrch 03:35, 5 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Certainly resting topic, but not appropriate for 2 whole paragraphs at the top of the article. Sbwoodside 08:34, 9 November 2005 (UTC)

In German Wikipedia somebody wrote this about the topic: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diskussion:Kairo#.C3.9Cbersetzungsfehler_falsche_Namensbedeutung_-Al_Qahira_-_Kairo There somebody wrote that Kairo means 'the strong' (freely translated). He also said that this fault appears in many books.As source he names: Cairo - City of history, André Raymond, AUC Press, Page 37; Deutsch-Arabisches Wörterbuch (German-Arabic Dictionary) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.209.8.141 (talk) 13:20, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

This etymology section does two things: 1) presents one etymology as the only one (whereas many history books present alternative etymologies that don't agree with this one---if you don't think alternative etymologies are correct, at least mention them and say why this explanation is preferred); and 2) goes on to present some individual's riff on the origin of a lot of unrelated words that have nothing to do with the etymology of the name "Cairo" (al-Qahirah). All the other terms are superfluous and distracting (sieger, siege, qa`id, qa`idah, qa, cola, kharab [?!?!?!]---I strongly doubt that any of these is etymologically or otherwise related to qahirah). All these words share either 1 or 0 of three roots with qahirah. I'm tempted to delete the entire etymology section until someone writes something that a) includes citations for all assertions made and b) only includes things directly relevant to the term at hand. Jbenhill (talk) 20:41, 17 July 2008 (UTC)

Hi all, well the word "al Qahira" means the conqueror (a female conqueror) of enemies naturally, nothing to support the relationship with mars. It was named so by "Al Moez le dine Allah al fetemy" the fourth "Khalifa" of the Fatimy Islamic State in Tunis and the first Fatemy Khalifa of Egypt after he sent a big army under the command of his best Army Commander "Gawhar Al sekelly" (Gawhar the Sicilian) to the "Abbassi" Egypt at the time. The fatemy army took Egypt and in the year 358 Hijri 969 C.E.Gawhar Al Sekelly built a wall around three cities and called it all "Al Qahira" a short name to "Qahirat Al Moez" (Moez's Cairo not the conqueror of the Moez) the three different cities were : "Al Fustat" (an old name translated The Tent) founded by Amr ibn el 'aas) the islamic leader who started the Islamic reign of Egypt 20 Hijri (around 640 C.E.) that was the name of the city we now call old Cairo where the hanging church, the ancient Jewish synagogue and the first founded by "Amr Ibn el 'aas Mosque" also named after him till this day. the second city included in "Qahirat Al Moez" or Moez's Cairo was "Al 'askar" translated (the soldiers). founded by the Abassi Khalifa "Saleh ben Ali Al 'abbassi" 132 Hijri 749 C.E. and finally "Al Qata'ea" a city founded by Ahmad Ibn Tolon 256 Hijri 869 C.E. when the two early mentioned cities were getting too crowded. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Esseily (talk • contribs) 12:53, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

Etymology section needs sources!! The second paragraph is an extended discussion of NOTHING. What does the "correspondence" between a Latin and Arabic root mean? NOTHING, the languages are unrelated. Source the section, CHECK THE OED, or a respected encyclopedia, or a respected etymologist. I've heard that Cairo means "Mars." Parsed almost any way, it emphatically does not. It appears to mean "the strong," "the conqueror." Anything beyond that, especially without citations, linking it to Mars etc. etc., absolutely does not belong here. 173.20.132.128 (talk) 08:06, 7 April 2009 (UTC)

Why did you delete that the Italian name of "Cairo" is "Il Cairo"? It is the link between the Arabic "al Qahira" and the English "Cairo", since Italian has been the lingua franca of Mediterranean for a long time. Lele giannoni (talk) 19:42, 14 October 2011 (UTC)

Maimonides

Is it fair to say that the Rambam was a "Famous Cairenes". He was born in Cordoba in Al-Andalus and shifted through various places. --Irishpunktom\^talk July 4, 2005 15:19 (UTC)

As An Egyptian I can tell you that the city was called Al-Quahira because -simply- in Arabic language the pharse(verb-quaher) means "conqueror". For she( the city ) beat all the enemys through it's history. Nora

To my knowledge, the name come from the Pharoes era ( Cahi-Raa ) which mean the city of the Sun's God Raa or city of the Sun's God from which the Greek translation Heliopolice ( Helios - police ). The Jews still call Cairo (Cahir) from very old time before Islam. Regards Nour Bassiouni

category:Holy cities

To whom is Cairo a holy city? The article doesn't say anything about this, nor does the list of holy cities. —Charles P. (Mirv) 17:08, 11 July 2005 (UTC)

the following posted on User talk:Mirv by 63.87.74.235 (talk · contribs) and copied here for future reference.

I have read your question about Cairo and as an Egyptian I think I can answer it, Cairo is considered a holy city because it got the rules of the three profits Mousse, Jesus and Mohammed. Mousse was born in Cairo and raised by the pharos, Jesus escaped to Egypt when he was young boy and Mohammed always said he liked Egypt that he didn’t visit but married an Egyptian lady (Maria). Also you will notice in Cairo the presence of thousands of mosques and churches beside the pharonic temples, which can be considered as holy places for ancient Egyptians.

• Ehim! It seems to me that Cairo is the sin-city! However, in that sense, I can't seem to think of a city that cannot be holly! Cairo is no one's holly city, perhaps apart from 63.87.74.235 (talk · contribs). Maysara 16:28, 28 August 2006 (UTC)

Cairo the city and Cairo the Governorate

ar:محافظة القاهرةis Cairo the Governorate ar: القاهرة redirects to ar:قاهرة (the city. --The Brain 15:34, 4 September 2005 (UTC)

Districts of Cairo

Alot of the Districts of Cairo list are actually Districts of Giza. There should be a huge contrast that Giza and Cairo and two different cities.--Ahmed 10:45, 17 December 2005 (UTC)

Giza and Cairo are, from an administrative perspective, two cities but Giza is often bundled when speaking of the "Greater Cairo Area". All in all, there are several other districts in both Cairo and Giza that are not listed. In local terms (e.g. asking for directions) "Giza" refers to the southern stretch of buildings on the West bank of the Nile (south of the Cairo Sheraton).

But it's extremely confusing how the district section is laid out. If you want to include all of Giza districts with Cairo, the box should at least be split to specify. Also, why do so many of the links in the Districts of Cairo just redirect to the Cairo article? It seems like there should be enough information that we should be able to get seperate articles instead of including them in the large article. It's also a waste of time on the user's part and false advertising. Meateatingvegan 17:09, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

Empty sections

I'm commenting out the empty sections. First time I've seen such in a WP article... --LodeRunner 02:05, 18 December 2005 (UTC)

Governorate

Should the redirect of Al Qahirah be turned into a stub about the governorate, like all of the other arab-language areas (i.e. Al Iskandariyah is the article for Alexandria governorate)? --Golbez 08:41, 22 December 2005 (UTC)

Sounds like a good idea. - SimonP 15:22, 22 December 2005 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Article Improvement Drive

Architecture of Africa is currently nominated on Wikipedia:Article Improvement Drive. Come to this page and support it with your vote. Help us improve this article to featured status.--Fenice 08:46, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

Should not have been moved

This article should not have been moved. The city in Egypt is the overwhelmingly most common usage of the term. - SimonP 14:16, 2 March 2006 (UTC)

I agree—compare Paris, London, Moscow, not Paris (France), London (England), Moscow (Russia)—and have moved the page back. —Charles P._(Mirv) 16:14, 2 March 2006 (UTC)

First mosque in Africa

The article claims that the first is in Cairo in 632 AD, but I was under the impression that Negash had the first mosque in Africa (before the Saudi Arabian peninsula was under Islamic control). Can someone provide a citation, please? Yom 22:59, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

• the user Yom is correct that cairo was not the first city to have a mosque in Africa. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Sinanwolfgazo (talk • contribs)

• Hello there -- take a look here and pick your citation. (the date seems to be wrong though, or something!). Best, __Maysara 16:23, 28 August 2006 (UTC)

• yo man I found something that the first mosque was in Ethiopia in the Tigre region plus it had to be because it was the first African country to be conquered by the Muslims around 615 A.D so they probable build a mosque there at list by 620 A.D. that is way before the first mosque in Egypt was built.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&q=%22first+mosque+in+Africa%22+Ethiopia&btnG=Search http://www.everyculture.com/Cr-Ga/Ethiopia.html http://www.scaruffi.com/politics/arabic.html

Meeso correct about likelihood of an Ethiopian mosque as first in Africa, but not as a result of conquest! Some of the first companions of the Prophet were granted refuge by the Ethiopian Christian king Negus to escape persecution by the Quraish. They were guests not conquerors. Ethiopia was never conquered by Muslims.

ElBaradei

ElBaradei is claimed to be a Cairene. I thought I once heard he was born in the Delta (North of Cairo) and the IAEA is Vienna. Anybody?

Education

"Cairo has long been the hub of education and educational services not only for Egypt but also for the whole world." This statement needs a citation, or else it should be changed.

POV!

• Jeez! Look at the culture section! 69.214.139.240 06:50, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

Huge copyvio problem

It looks like everything added by Realman has been copied from various internet sources. And I mean EVERYTHING. I'll try to revert just what he added... but yecch.

• I tried to remove his stuff, but I might have taken out a few legit edits with it... please readd them if I did. Also, many of the images I reverted were uploaded by Realman, who (based on his talk page) already has a bad rap for uploading copyrighted material.

15.2 million?

If the population of the metropolitan area is really 15.2 million, please provide a reputable source, with the year and the name of the agency. Otherwise, I'll just use the 11.2 million figure from List of metropolitan areas by population which is based on U.N. data. Ufwuct 03:11, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

OKay, A little piece of information that again need citation , cairo population at day is diffrent that it's night ,i think it grows about 4 or 5 million more during day ,why's that? , cuz people travel from all the citties and town around cairo to cairo ,either to work or to finish some papers that need the central governmental services that are all located in the country's capital cairo --80.6.123.105 18:35, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Usually, though, the population is given in terms of residents, that is, people who live there. What you're talking about appears to be a different statistic. It could be added to the article (if properly sourced), but it wouldn't be the "population". Plus, while I can envision the size of the central business district or even the entire city proper increasing by a measurable amount by day, I have a hard time seeing how a metropolitan area would increase so much by day because most people probably live and work in the same metro area and probably just travel within it. Let me know if you find a source. Thanks. Ufwuct 04:02, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

I have noticed the confusion about the population of Cairo and the main reason for the mixed results from different sources is probably the following:

There exists three different definitions of what roughly can be called "Cairo with suburbs". First we have the Greater Cairo Metropolitan Region (GCMR) which only includes the three cities of Cairo, Giza and Shubra al Khaymah. These three cities together had 11 562 300 inhabitants (2005) according to CAPMAS [[1]] population estimates. The second definition is slightly wider and is probably the best definition for "Cairo with suburbs". It includes the GCMR area plus some additional villages and districts, and is called Greater Cairo Region (GCR). The 1996 Census result was 11 459 860 inhabitants; my source is however a very old webpage that I've had saved for years on my computer and can't find on the web anymore. The work is titled "Le Caire: Une Métropole en Mouvement" and is written by someone named Galial el Kadi. I tried to make an updated calculation for the population and the result was about 13,3 million inhabitants for the year 2005, based on CAPMAS population estimates for the administrative divisions involved for the definition. The third and widest definition is also called Greater Cairo Region and includes the three governorates of Cairo, Giza and Kalyoubia. The total population of the three governorates is 17 601 939 (2005) according to CAPMAS population estimates. This definition includes some large parts of rural/desert areas (especially within the governorate of Giza) and is to my point of view not a good definition for Cairo with suburbs. But, it's probably the most commonly used definition as it's easier for researchers to find updated population statistics for governorates than for smaller administrative units.

I have tried to find more official sources for the exact definitions, but so far no luck. I remember from back in the late '80:s that I found both the GCMR and (1st) GCR definitions mentioned in some kind of official statistical handbook from Egypt, but it's impossible for me to remember the title now :-(.

Hope this information helped! --Pjred 01:30, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Relevant information?

Two photographers show original pictures and reports about Cairo :

• Fouad Elkhoury : Black and white pictures
• Pascal Meunier Colourful reports (nights of Cairo, the last public baths of Cairo...)

I don't know if the above text belongs anywhere in the article, but it certainly doesn't belong anywhere in the introduction. Ufwuct 03:20, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

The history section is very strange

I was expecting to find the history of Cairo on this page. Instead, the history section appears to be a history of every capital Egypt has ever had, some of it not told very accurately. Why is the history of Memphis on this page? Shouldn't it begin instead with Cairo's founding, perhaps after an only brief mention that Egypt had previous capitals, and a link to separate articles for their histories? But instead of beginning with Cairo's founding, the article at present doesn't even mention it in the history section! (It was founded by the Fatimid dynasty in 969.) --Delirium 02:21, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

I was just wondering about that myself. Not to mention the unencyclopedic tone of "Let us stop here for a while and elaborate on the status of slavery in the Islamic Empire." —Angr 16:54, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

Same here! What's the deal with that? The history part is completely unrelated. Can we shorten it perhaps, "wikify" it?

I agree that the History section of this article should be shortened, to focus on the city of Cairo, instead of Egypt as a whole. Cairo was founded in AD 969. Though a few sentences of context about previous capitals are probably worthwhile, the rest of the earlier information should probably be merged to History of Egypt. --Elonka 17:03, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

I think that it has been improved since 2007.

Ciaro?

Am I the only one who has never heard of a Ciaro? Is Cairo called Ciaro, in English of course? - Anas ^Talk? 12:11, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

I have removed the name and fixed everything. It must've been vandalism. - Anas ^Talk? 17:26, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Population/Area/Density

How can Cairo have a density of over 90,000 people per square mile when a place like Manhattan doesn't even have that density? Does it just have a lot of overcrowding or more than 2-3 people per dwelling? --KCMODevin 02:21, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

A place like Manhattan has a lot more of office and administration buildings covering the area, more parking spaces etc.. And, things like an own room for each kid in the family is probably rare in Cairo - the living space for each person is less than in Manhattan. I wouldn't be surprised (without having specific numbers) if some areas in Cairo is having a population density of more than 3 times its average. --Pjred 06:10, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Sister Cities Just a precision concerning sister cities, Cairo may have a partnership with Paris and Rome, but they are not sister cities since those two are only linked one to the other as sisters cities. Indeed, only Paris deserves Rome, only Rome deserves Paris.

---In the article it states that Cairo has an area of 83km^2. However in the info box to the left the area is listed as 453km^2, yet the population density located directly below that is calculated using the 83km^2 figure. Is Cairo 453 or 83 km^2? Large difference. --March 29 2010 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 157.127.155.214 (talk) 23:13, 29 March 2010 (UTC)

Copyvio in History Section was readded

[2]

This was readded not too long after I had initially removed it. Unfortunately some of the section has been rewritten and so the copyvio information is difficult to cleave from the legitimate text. Just letting you guys know. Enok^talk 22:21, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

Housing and water cannals information missing

This article doesn't say anything about unfinished houses that are already occupied. A BIG part of the city is build this way so that they wont have to pay taxes (from what i have heard). There is also no information about the state of water canals in the city - and its really bad. Garbage all all over the place including dead animals thrown into the water by their owners. I think its important since its the first thing that draws tourists attention once they enter the city. --sturm 21:10, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

PYRAMIDS OF CAIRO??

im shocked that not one single discussion is going on around the Pyramids not being in Cairo...

people the Pyramids are in Giza and not Cairo, its like stating the Statue of Liberty in New Jersey rather then New York, the Pyramids part must be removed... Cairo had NOTHING to do with ancient Egypt's History, Cairo's History starts when Arabs Entered Egypt and built their First Capital called Al-Fustat, and cairo was built by the Fatimids...

--Arab League User 01:26, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

I think whoever wrote that meant the Great Cairo Area, which practically covers the area of some part of Giza, but this is very inaccurate. Hobapotter (talk) 18:15, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

Fustat destruction

It is mentioned that Al Fustat was destroyed to prevent its capture from Crusaders, this is historically not true and needs a citation —Preceding unsigned comment added by 41.234.15.216 (talk) 17:25, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

Need article on El-Quba

We need an article on the El-Quba district (in the Cairo neighborhoods template, it redirects to "Cairo"). Badagnani (talk) 01:35, 6 February 2008 (UTC)

This still needs to be done. Badagnani (talk) 20:31, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

External links of little usefulness

I've gone to External_links#Links_normally_to_be_avoided, and found problems with some of the links. Already deleted one [3], and I would your input about these other ones before deleting them:

• Helpful guide for Cairo 4) Promotes a private website, 5) and 15) consists mostly of links to commercial services and includes no encyclopaedic info, 6) appears to be a site designed to get revenue from Google ads, 16) includes some illegible unusable small maps, but there is already a better link to google maps.

• Photos, reports, books about Cairo and arabian countries by Pascal Meunier 1) not an unique resource (since the photos are small and out of context, books only have the info necessary to buy them, etc, etc) 4) intended to promote Mr. Meunier's website 5) non-free resource (photos must be bought) instead of being a free resource like the "cairo travel photos" link 8) uses flash for navigating the photos. Only reason that I can see for keeping it is if Pascal Meunier is a very notable photographer, notable enough to have his own page on wikipedia and also made photos of cairo city that are so notable that we feel they he must be linked to his page from the cairo article.

• Video of the streets of Cairo and view of the Pyramids 1) Doesn't really apport anything to the article. It could be the street of any arab city, except for seeing the pyramids far away at the end of the video. 12) it's obviously a cool video to the person that recorded the video, but random wikipedia visitors will get no information from it (really, watch the video, you just see a lot of cars, houses and some street shop).

The other links either apport interesing photos with big resolution or additional info. --Enric Naval (talk) 14:12, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

Since nobody commented, I'll just go ahead with the deletion --Enric Naval (talk) 08:49, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

Azbakia needs to be added

Information about the Azbakia neighborhood needs to be added. Badagnani (talk) 20:32, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

Sakakini needs to be added

Information about the Sakakini neighborhood needs to be added. Badagnani (talk) 04:18, 25 February 2008 (UTC)

Come on guys...

You were tipped off not once but twice about the copyright infringement in the history section, and kept it there? Era One (talk) 15:07, 31 March 2008 (UTC)

History section

How come the article has no history section? This city has a very rich history.Bless sins (talk) 13:38, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

Orman

Is there a place in Cairo called Orman? Badagnani (talk) 18:02, 2 June 2008 (UTC) yes at Giza Governerate part of greater Cairo, it contain the major Orman gardens and the big zoo of Greater Cairo near the Cairo University in Giza.--Ashashyou (talk) 14:39, 20 August 2008 (UTC)

Cairo Metro

Greater Cairo (Cairo, Giza, Helwan, Shubra Al-Khiema)has many railroad traffic, one of them is the Metro which has now two lines (Helwan-El Marg and Giza Shoubra) a third line is under construction, this metro has some parts of its line passing in crowded areas so it has undergroung way and stations. so the metro is known by the Cairo inhabitants as Metro Al-Anfak= the underground metro. there is other railroad traffic in Cairo but less regular than the "Metro" that are also called metro it passes in heiopolis, Ain Shams, Mataryia, Nasr City , Ramsis, Ghamra and other districts in many lines. However these metro lines have metro or trams (tramway) in it, it is also always on the ground, and is usually slower than the "Metro" and walks beside the other traffic like cars in the street, unlike the "Metro" which has its way separated by a wall and never cut by a traffic.--Ashashyou (talk) 14:39, 20 August 2008 (UTC)

Cairo the city of victory that never sleeps?

Will someone stop the change of that name of the city? it has been changed and reverted more than 3 times.--Ashashyou (talk) 04:43, 21 August 2008 (UTC)

City of the Dead

This is something I remember studying about Cairo at School.

I can't recall any other captial cities having inhabited tombs on the same scale as Cairo if at all. I think it is very interesting and very notable so if anyone knowledgable on the subject would like to add some info I would be greatful.

Thanks, GQsm ^{Talk | c} 18:28, 19 September 2008 (UTC)

• Cairo has expanded over many centuries many many times, each time the tombs which are at the preiphery are relocated outside the city or new districts as when building Abbasyia and heliopolis and Ain Shams districts. However at certain periods like disaters like the 1992 earthquake some of the people who lost thier homes (and own thier own cemetry) started to live temporirly in thier cemetry. Some of the poor people stayed thier. Also the cemetries in old Cairo contain many tombs of many Shiekhs and Mamluk kings where on thier tomb a Mosque has been built which usually contain a Madrasah and a Khankah (a place for Sufi people to worship and live in, may be like Monasteries) this was near the old city of Cairo so urban extended easily to the tombs.
• Also it is a habit in rural areas in Egypt to have the cemetry of the village just at the end of the village if the cemetry is not relocated to be outside the village, the expansion of the houses would sure reach it and may be surround it.--Ashashyou (talk) 21:52, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

Cairo City vs. Cairo Governorate

Are Cairo City and Cairo Governorate the same thing? If they are, there needs to be made a mention in the opening paragraph the two being coterminous. From the looks of it, there doesn't appear to be an associated municipal government for the urban area. Cairo simply appears to be a physically smaller governorate, and not one with special powers or special organization, either. --Criticalthinker (talk) 07:23, 22 September 2008 (UTC)

• Cairo city is Cairo Govern., sometimes Cairo City mean "Greater Cairo" which include Cairo city, Giza city (of Giza Govern), the newly formed Helwan Govern, the newly formed 6th of October Govern and Parts of Qalyoubia Govern (Shubra el-Khiema, Madinat el-Salam....etc). All those parts are refered to as Cairo because they are connected together by continous urban areas, streets and transportation methods (Buses, Minibuses, Cairo Metro (underground connect Giza city, Cairo city, parts of Qalubyia and Helwan Govern)and the over ground old Metro.

• There is no natural boundries separating the parts of Greater Cairo (Except perhaps the Nile separating Giza from Cairo), so all people living or working on those areas call it "Cairo". It is to be noticed that Cairo university is actually in Giza govern, and since Greater Cairo is a Metropolitan area with a big population there is 2 other Universities in Greater Cairo (Ain Shams Univ in Cairo Govern & Helwan Univ in Helwan Govern.)

• Cairo Govern is the City as there is no rural areas in Cairo. Cairo City contain nearly all the adminstarative buildings of the Government of Egypt. Cairo Govern was so big to be manged as a single Govern so it was separated in early 2008 to two Govern (Cairo & Helwn, same with Giza Govern into Giza & 6th of October Govern)
• It is not easy to figure but it is the truth.--Ashashyou (talk) 18:26, 22 September 2008 (UTC)

If Cairo Governorate and Cairo City are the same thing, some needs corrections to the Cairo Governorate page, which shows a much larger figure for the area of the governorate than what this page shows for the city. Really, someone more knowledgable of the area needs to consolidate these two pages, because at the moment, they appear to be two seperate entiries. --Criticalthinker (talk) 08:34, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

I was born in Cairo and has been livng in it, now for 30 years. I think the article should be on Cairo city which is actually Greater Cairo, not only the governerate. Notice that the official web site of Cairo Govern talk on the City because the whole Govern is one city with many many districs that are actually small cities.[4]. Also the map on official site [5] although not updated (because Helwan and southern areas have been separated to the new Helwan Govern) but it shows all the districts of the govern and they are all part of the city. A city is an urban area with a large population and a particular administrative, legal, or historical status. This applies to Greater Cairo = Cairo governerate (Whole of it is urban area) + Giza City(Urban area of Giza Govern) + Helwan Govern (all of it is urban areas) + 6th of October Govern (all of it is urban areas) + part of the urban part of Qaliobyia Govern (Shubra el-Khiema, Mostorod and New El-Marg districts...etc).--Ashashyou (talk) 12:35, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

I'm not sure you're understanding me. On this page, as well as the page for the governorate, a fact needs to be added that says that the city and governorate are coterminous. That they are one-and-the-same entity. --Criticalthinker (talk) 04:21, 24 September 2008 (UTC)

Propaganda

It seems to me several parts of this article are biased. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.62.108.94 (talk) 02:17, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

453 km2 vs 412 km2

This is exactly what I'm talking about in concerns to my unanswered question about whether Cairo is either a municipality or governorate or both. The opening paragraph gives an area for the municipality of 412 square kilometers. Yet, in the infobox literally inches away it reads that the governorate is 453 square kilometers in size. Really, which is it? --Criticalthinker (talk) 06:38, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

ANYONE? There is also mention of 214 square kilometers. We need an accurate number and to keep things consistent. Ifthe 214 square kilometers is simply a measure of the urban area within the municipality/governorate, that needs to be made clear. But, most importantly, we need to find the exact measurement of the city boundaries. Is is 435 square kilometers or 412 square kilometers? This should be very easy for someone from the area to look up. The area of a city is one of the most basic pieces of information. --Criticalthinker (talk) 02:34, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

This is getting ridiculous. Now the infobox has the figure of 528 km2. Which of these numbers is correct? This seems a very simple piece of information to find for anyone fluent in Arabic. --Criticalthinker (talk) 11:43, 19 May 2016 (UTC)

Density

The problem has been more or less mentioned earlier on but something ought to be done about the figures in the inobox. 450km2, 6,8 million inhabitants, 32 000 000 habs/km2, it clearly doesn't add up. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Superzoulou (talk • contribs) 16:04, 5 May 2010 (UTC)

Area of cairo

how can the area of metro Cairo be 86,369 square kilometers? the area of metro New York City is only 17,405 square kilometers..are you telling me that Cairo is 4 times the size of New York City? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.68.141.65 (talk) 08:17, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Lead paragraph

I do not think that cairo is the largest city in the muslim world, but i DO know it, Cairo is the largest city in the muslim world + in Africa + in Arab nations + in Mediterranea. 41.248.107.18 (talk) 14:09, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

Sorry, but the largest city in the Muslim world by all definitions, city proper, urban, metropolitan, and agglomeration is Jakarta. Elockid (Alternate) ^(Talk) 16:23, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

Coat of arms

It says on the image description page that the image was self-made? Why is an unofficial, made-up COA featured on this page? --Ysangkok (talk) 20:03, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

Population of Cairo Governorate

Where is the 7,786,640 coming from for the population for Cairo Governorate? The 2006 Census placed the population at 6,758,581, and that was before the splitting off of Helwan in 2008, which would have lowered the population, if anything. What is the source for the 7,786,640 number? --Criticalthinker (talk) 04:00, 3 February 2011 (UTC)

I also want to bring up that the reported 2010 estimate for Cairo's population (from Egypt) is a supposed ~9 million according to the Greater Cairo article. So we have a 2006 report of ~6.8 million and a 2010 estimate of ~9 million, and a dispute from Criticalthinker. I would presume population growth has made the numbers go up. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.243.134.33 (talk) 12:22, 11 January 2013 (UTC)

Coptic population

What is the Coptic population of this city? Are there any other significant minority groups? We should have information about this. 98.209.116.7 (talk) 08:30, 12 February 2011 (UTC)

Population?

I was in Cairo recently and conductress and she said that Cairo has 25 milion inhabitants and it is second biggest city on the world. So where is true? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.177.219.136 (talk) 04:27, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

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No mentioning of the serious poverty in Cairo?

Why aren't the poverty and low standards of living in Cairo mentioned in the article? Cairo is a very poor and dense city and only about 10-20% of its citizens have computers, it should be mentioned in the article-- Someone35  19:15, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

Partially true, but there are areas of Cairo that are wealthy (Zamalek, Mohendiseen, Garden City, New Cairo, Heliopolis, ...). There are also obviously areas where people live on subsidized bread and not much else. Something about the widely disparate levels of wealth should be included. But we need sources. nableezy - 19:24, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

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Re-organizing the "main sights" section.

I am suggesting an improvement to the "Main sights" section by combining "Fatimid Mosques" and "Islamic sites in the old city" (see also below), as well as expanding this sub-section to include descriptions and/or links to other notable historical monuments which go unmentioned (e.g. Ibn Tulun Mosque (though I myself added a link to it not long ago), Citadel, etc). I am prepared to do this work myself sometime soon, maybe the next few days, but I thought I should announce it here first in case there are any immediate or future objections/suggestions.

Other notes: Some of the Fatimid mosques listed are not really important in terms of tourism, history, or architecture; the four mosques originally listed (I only recently added a fifth one, the Salih Tala'i mosque, to the list) are specifically the four mosques renovated by the Dawoodi Bohras in recent decades, and seem to have been included from this point of view. I would remove the Juyushi and Lulua mosques at least, and focus on the many other notable medieval monuments unmentioned so far. I also see no particular reason to put the Fatimid-era mosques in a separate sub-section from the other mosques in the city.

After all this, I suggest the title should be changed to something like "Historical sites and landmarks", as opposed to "main sights" which seems a little too centred on tourism, especially as not all the mentioned locations can be considered tourist attractions (e.g. some of the lesser-known religious sites). In the long run, this section could be further elaborated into a section that talks about the city's architecture or "cityscape" in general, maybe following the examples of other city articles (e.g. New York, Istanbul, etc). But the stuff above is what I am suggesting in the short term. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Casual Builder (talk • contribs) 04:34, 1 December 2013 (UTC)

Snow in Cairo

Although it is widely believed to be snow, what fell on the city of Cairo were clearly ice pellets, or sleet at the most. The lowest temperature reached during the precipitation was 5°C. Most reports refer to the Cairo governatorate, which includes mountainous areas which have been hit by heavy snowfalls; the city itself has only seen ice pellets/graupel in the easternmost outskirts and rain elsewhere, like in the airport (which is still to the northeast of the city) http://www.wunderground.com/history/airport/HECA/2013/12/13/DailyHistory.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.49.211.210 (talk) 20:50, 13 December 2013 (UTC)

Archive 1

Orphaned references in Cairo

I check pages listed in Category:Pages with incorrect ref formatting to try to fix reference errors. One of the things I do is look for content for orphaned references in wikilinked articles. I have found content for some of Cairo's orphans, the problem is that I found more than one version. I can't determine which (if any) is correct for this article, so I am asking for a sentient editor to look it over and copy the correct ref content into this article.

Reference named "NOAA":

• From Abu Dhabi: "Climate Normals for Abu Dhabi". National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. Retrieved 2013-02-10.
• From Ahmedabad: "Ahmedabad Climate Normals 1971–1990". National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. Retrieved 18 January 2014.
• From Jeddah: "Climate Normals for Jeddah". National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. Retrieved 1 February 2013.
• From Mexico City: "Tacubaya, Distrito Federal Climate Normals 1961-1990". National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. Retrieved May 14, 2013.
• From Cape Town: "Cape Town/DF Malan Climate Normals 1961–1990". National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. Retrieved 8 April 2013.
• From Carbon dioxide: National Oceanic & Atmospheric Administration (NOAA) – Earth System Research Laboratory (ESRL), Trends in Carbon Dioxide Values given are dry air mole fractions expressed in parts per million (ppm). For an ideal gas mixture this is equivalent to parts per million by volume (ppmv).
• From Tunis: "TUNIS-CARTHAGE Climate Normals 1961-1990". National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. Retrieved November 6, 2012.
• From Algiers: "Climate Normals for Alger (dar el beida)". National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. Retrieved 11 February 2013.
• From Muscat, Oman: "Seeb Climate Normals 1961-1990". National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. Retrieved December 19, 2012.
• From Antananarivo: "Antananarivo Climate Normals 1961–1990". National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. Retrieved 30 November 2013.
• From Lusaka: "LUSAKA INTERNATIONAL AIRPORT Climate Normals 1961-1990". National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. Retrieved November 6, 2012.
• From Juba: "Juba Climate Normals 1961–1990". National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. Retrieved 21 March 2013.
• From Kobe: "Kobe Climate Normals 1961-1990". National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. Retrieved January 6, 2013.
• From Doha: "Doha International Airport Climate Normals 1962-1992". National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. Retrieved January 18, 2012.
• From Johannesburg: "Johannesburg/Jan Smuts Climate Normals 1961–1990". National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. Retrieved 8 April 2013.
• From Seychelles: "SEYCHELLES INTL AP Climate Normals 1971–1990". National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. Retrieved 16 November 2012.
• From Bangkok: "Climate Normals for Bangkok". National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. Retrieved 9 June 2014.
• From Copper: "Fun facts". Horseshoe crab. University of Delaware. Retrieved 13 July 2008.

I apologize if any of the above are effectively identical; I am just a simple computer program, so I can't determine whether minor differences are significant or not. AnomieBOT⚡ 18:34, 26 December 2014 (UTC)

Intro outdated, citation link is missing

It looks like a lot of statistics in the intro to this article are outdated. For example, the intro states, "With a population of 6.76 million[10]" and the citation it links to is a 2006 article/ranking. I added to one statement a qualifier that the economy ranking occurred in 2005. With information and rankings changing so fast, is the Wikipedia convention to qualify statements in text with dates? How do we deal with "outdated" information? Another example of this problem is with one of the citations being a dead link. Citation #14, or "and 43rd globally by Foreign Policy's 2010 Global Cities Index.[14]". The link points to http://foreignpolicy.com/node/373401 which is dead. Skiingxmoose (talk) 09:51, 27 February 2015 (UTC)

Timeline of Cairo

What is missing from the city timeline? Please add relevant content. Thank you. -- M2545 (talk) 10:15, 19 May 2015 (UTC)

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Crime Section

I would think that the statement that Cairo is 'safer than most major cities' would need some kind of statistical foundation or at least a citation. I can't find anything that confirms this but maybe someone else might be able to prove or disprove this. --Vamanospests (talk) 18:36, 31 October 2015 (UTC)

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Area

Where is the area coming from for the "city" in the infobox? It's my understanding that Cairo doesn't have a local government apart from the governorate, and that the area of the governerate is 3,085 km2, not 528 km2. So, where is that latter figure coming from? --Criticalthinker (talk) 08:24, 3 April 2015 (UTC)

I still don't have an answer on this, though, I do think I have a better understanding having done some more research. The 528 number must be a statistical measurement of the urban or contiguous settled area of the governorate. With some further research, however, I've been able to find that there are indeed administrative divisions below the governorate level. Apparently, under governorates are marakiz (in rural areas) and aqsam (in urban areas), which we could simply call sub-governorates. I guess my question then is whether or not there is a municipal/local government covering Cairo proper at the aqsam/district level? On pages for cities the measurement of the "city" population and area is supposed to correspond to a local government. If there is not an associated goverment for the urban city proper of Cairo then the only measurements you can add in the infobox are the population and area figures for the "urban" (a statistical spacial measurements) and "metro/metropolitan" (a statistical definition of multiple and associated governorates). There does not appear to be an associated loca/municipal government for Cairo, just ones at the sub-governorate (smaller than the city proper) and governorate (larger than the city proper) levels. Cairo Governorate appears to be divided into 41 sub-governorates --Criticalthinker (talk) 01:06, 15 December 2016 (UTC)

Poor quality montage

The current montage is of poor quality in my opinion, the images are all distorted. Surely there must be a better alternative? Turnopoems (talk) 15:46, 18 November 2016 (UTC)

Do you mind specifying particular montage of concern as your subject is not easily discernible? Geo ^talk 19:49, 23 April 2017 (UTC)

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Cairo Metropolitan Area

Hi, is it some explanation for Cairo metropolitan area, which is 250 000 km square - what is one quarter of all Egypt area or is it larger than all United Kingdom?--Pimlico27 (talk) 13:25, 16 October 2017 (UTC)

I assume the metropolitan area is uses governorates as its building blocks, in which case it would not be surprising that the land area is so expansive. I'd imagine that at least for Egypt a more accurate measure of a metropolitan area would be an urban agglomeration measurement, which would cut out the hundreds-of-thousands of square miles of empty desert within the governorates. --Criticalthinker (talk) 10:29, 7 December 2017 (UTC)

Historic sights and landmarks section: too many pictures?

This is a stylistic/aesthetic recommendation, so I wasn't sure whether to put on the talk page first. I suggest the historic sights and landmarks section needs a bit of a clean-up visually, as there are a lot of pictures, some of them overlapping in subject, and it has left a large blank space between sub-sections that seems odd/unnecessary. I helped to expand this section years ago and added the gallery element for lack of a better idea back then. People have added more pictures to the section since then, so I feel like the row gallery at the least could be removed now and the other pictures reorganized to let the text flow better without interruption. [Edit: correcting myself here; the large gap between sections may or may not appear depending on the width/resolution of the screen you're using, so this concern is more secondary after all.]

No strong feelings, just an open suggestion. I made an (admittedly significant) edit and it was reverted, with the reasonable point that the section had been stable for a while. I wouldn't mind getting people's thoughts here about the section. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Casual Builder (talk • contribs) 18:41, 5 January 2018 (UTC)

Contradictory population figures

The article says that Cairo's population is 19,500,000, while its area is 606 km2. It also says that the density is 19,376/km2. This is an obvious contradiction, but I don't think it's just a matter of recalculating the density—there should be a clearer definition of what the population refers to, right now each figure presented just seems arbitrary. Can anyone with more knowledge on the subject look into it? —Ynhockey ^(Talk) 06:50, 30 April 2018 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion

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Why was "Cityscape" section subsumed under "economy"?

I'm wondering if this was a mistake, but I noticed that the former "cityscape" section was merged into the Economy section during what looks otherwise like a clean-up edit in November 2019. Was there a reason for this? It doesn't seem appropriate, given that the former section was about landmarks, museums, and historical heritage (a commonly separate section in many other city articles (e.g. Paris or Istanbul)), not economics or industry.
If there's no major indication to the contrary, I'll assume this may not have been intentional and will split the section off again. Robert Prazeres (talk) 06:50, 10 March 2020 (UTC)

"Cairo edition"

There is no such thing as "the Cairo edition" of the qurʾān, because there are more than a thousand different editions of the qurʾān — most of Ḥafṣ ʿan ʿĀṣim but some important ones of Warš ʿan Nāfiʿ — published in Cairo, and because the King Fuʾād Edition was not printed in Cairo, but in another governorate. And it was not published on July 10th, 1924. On that day the printing of the qurʾānic text was done, but the dedication to the King with that date in it can only have been produced after that date. Afterwards the back matter was printed, then the books had to be bound. So its publication must have been in 1925.2A02:8109:B6C0:C388:85D1:DE9A:885A:531 (talk) 09:14, 16 June 2021 (UTC)

There is clearly a "Cairo edition" of the Qur'an, and it's easy to look it up (e.g. 1, 2, plus whatever is cited on the page). You removed information that was supported with citations and replaced it with information with no citations. This is original research and is not accepted on Wikipedia (see WP:OR). You will need to argue your point by making reference to reliable sources, or explain a problem with the existing material in a way that will elicit consensus from editors here. Thanks, R Prazeres (talk) 23:37, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

There is NO Cairo edition. The first source is completely wrong, because it calls the 1924 edition Azhar something. Since there are about a thousand different editions from Cairo, "the Cairo edition" can not exist.

The author of the second source, N. Sinai, wrote me that he did not know that there are in this century very different editions, esp. in India, Indonesia, Iran and Turkey. If he could he would change many phrases in his article. Yes, G.S.Reynodls wrote what he wrote, but it is all wrong. He is an expert on the religious (Christian-Muslim) content of the qur'an, but ignorant about printed editions. These quotes are from an expert, but from outside his field of expertise.

The sentences you restored on formal grounds (reliable sources) are wrong. Mine are correct. 2A02:8109:B6C0:C388:BD04:31F5:8478:D28B (talk) 15:38, 5 July 2021 (UTC)

Respectfully but frankly, your point doesn't make a lot of sense, since you say there are a "thousand editions" but somehow you think the 1924 edition doesn't exist, despite abundant sources and studies that talk about it... In any case, Wikipedia is based on what reliable published sources say (see WP:RELIABILITY), not on what individual editors believe or what conversations you claim to have had, which is WP:OR as I pointed out above. This section cites plenty of scholarly sources, and there are further sources on other related pages. Even if your perspective were somehow correct and well-justified, Wikipedia is not the place to add it, and there are good reasons why these rules are in place. Thanks, R Prazeres (talk) 16:07, 5 July 2021 (UTC)

Addendum: I should have also added that the reverted edits you're referring to didn't actually challenge the existence of the 1924 edition as you're doing here. Your edits were reverted because you deleted a citation for a preceding statement with quotes, then added a comment with no citation. You can add information if you like, but again it must be verified by citations to reliable sources. R Prazeres (talk) 16:30, 5 July 2021 (UTC)

Sorry, of course, there is a 1924 Gizeh print. It is not a Cairo edition, because it was printed on the other side of the Nile. It is not the Cairo edition, because it is one of many printed in the area.

Yes, I made a mistake. I deleted the citation (G.S.R.) without deleting all of his unproven assertions. But that the 1924 edition was popular or influential all over the Muslim world is wrong -- not just unproven, clearly wrong, because most Muslims are not Egyptians or East Arabs, and they have their own (quite different) editions.

BTW, I am not sure that the chapter on the Gizeh print should be in the article on Cairo.

Addendum: If you go back to the first line of this section, you see that I use the definite article. To deny that there are Cairo editionS would be stupid, but it is illogical that there is THE CE. Martha C. Nussbaum wrote about "the Ayatollah" because she thought there is just ONE, but there are about 5000 in Iran alone. If there were just ONE edition made in Cairo -- or if they were all the same -- one could talk about ... Ignorance, just ignorance, both in the case of Nussbaum (because she is outside her field), and in the case of G.S.R. (because he is here outside his field of expertise).2A02:8109:B6C0:C388:BD04:31F5:8478:D28B (talk) 16:41, 5 July 2021 (UTC)

Even if it was printed in Gizeh, this article is not about the Cairo governorate alone (which is merely an administrative division) and Gizeh is part of the Cairo metropolitan area, so it's perfectly reasonable to have this topic mentioned here. And if reliable sources call it the "Cairo edition" then that's what it should be called here; any other name would have to reflect what sources say. As for the rest of what you said, it is again up to you to demonstrate your claims based on reliable sources, which you have so far refused to do. If you want to pursue this point, my suggestion is that you start a new discussion on the talk page at History of the Quran, as this is where the main information on this topic (including the 1924 edition) is found, and so a discussion there is more likely to be useful than here. If you do so, I recommend you make sure that you explain your arguments as clearly as possible (since they were not clear here) and that you refer to appropriate sources to back up any claims you make (if you don't, then it will probably go nowhere again). If a consensus emerges there about new changes or revisions to the information, it will be much easier to make adjustments here (since the section here is just a shortened version of the section there). Sincerely, R Prazeres (talk) 17:15, 5 July 2021 (UTC)

Dear R.P., I see you are serious. I hope you see, that I am too. Earlier you wrote "There is clearly a "Cairo edition" of the Qur'an, and it's easy to look it up". Yes, if you look it up in English, but when you look it up in Arabic, you find only things other than the King Fuʾād Edition, the 12 line edition, the Egyptian Government edition of 1924. While "KFE" works both in Arabic and in other languages, "The Cairo edition" does not make sense in Arabic: a bad sign for something Arabic. 2A02:8109:B6C0:C388:BD04:31F5:8478:D28B (talk) 17:25, 5 July 2021 (UTC)

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