Talk:Bridgewater Township, New Jersey

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Old (and getting older) issues

NOTE: I have now made most of the changes discussed below.

Neutron 14:28, 10 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

"Districts" or "communities" in Bridgewater

I have read this article and have some comments on it, but being brand new to Wikipedia I thought I would see if anyone has an answer to my comments before just going in and changing what someone else has written.

First of all I do not think that Bradley Gardens, Finderne, Martinsville and Green Knoll qualify as "districts," it might be better to call them "sections" or "areas" or "communities." I don't think any of them have officially defined boundaries though I may be wrong about Bradley Gardens. I know that "Green Knoll" is very vaguely defined and if you talk to 10 different people you will hear 10 different versions of where it begins and ends.

So, while these 4 "areas" (and you might add "North Branch" as well since part of it is in Bridgewater; and you might also add "Sunset Lake") do exist, their boundaries are unclear. If you are trying to define them by where the children go to elementary school, this doesn't really work, at least not currently. There is no operating school in Martinsville (Crim is near, but not in Martinsville) and no operating elementary school in Green Knoll (though BRHS is there), plus the boundaries between the "sending areas" are changing every few years.

Which leads me to my main point:

I have never heard anyone refer to "Van Holten" and "Kennedy" as "districts" or "communities" (or whatevers) in Bridgewater except when discussing what schools people go to, and as the article says, the so-called "Kennedy" area is divided between 3 schools and soon to be 4. Usually I hear the so-called "Van Holten" area referred to as the "Country Club Road" area or sometimes "Country Club-Meadow Road" area and as for "Kennedy" most people in Bridgewater call that either the "Milltown Road" area, the "Milltown-Vanderveer" area (which probably would be the most descriptive) or sometimes just "the developments." Admittedly I am not from that area, so any of you who are, do you really call where you live "Kennedy"? After a school located in another municipality where an ever-decreasing proportion of your children attend? And do people in the Country Club-Meadow Road area really refer to where they live as "Van Holten"?

Neutron 5 July 2005 19:24 (UTC)

Changes coming: Unless someone chooses to defend the current text regarding the above issues (and those I will now discuss), sometime over the weekend I am probably going to make a major edit to the whole "districts" subsection to make it more accurate and less opinionated. I will leave the references to "Van Holten" and "Kennedy" but as names that "some people use" or words to that effect. I will mention that most of the sections do not have officially defined boundaries and that there are different opinions as to where the boundaries lie. I also am going to delete the reference to BG's "reputation for being dirty" which is just someone's opinion, and will probably change "lower class" to "less affluent" for BG and Finderne. I probably also will add a reference to "North Branch" being a section, and perhaps also "Thomae Park" and "Sunset Lake" though I am somewhat uncertain on their status as "sections" as opposed to "developments," which would not rate a mention.

Neutron 7 July 2005 16:14 (UTC)

The "districts" may be referring to the fire districts in Bridgewater. If memory serves, they are: Martinsville, Green Knoll, Finderne, North Branch, Bradley Gardens, and Country Hills. While I've not lived in Bridgewater for a couple of years, I did live in the Milltown road area but we never referred to it as anything but "Bridgewater." Sunset Lake is in Martinsville's fire district, but most people I know of didn't consider it part of Martinsville. Hopefully that helps a bit. Aeverett 21:12, 1 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

"affluence rapidly declining"

As a result of a previous edit by someone (whose "name" is just a bunch of numbers), the description of Bridgewater as "affluent" had a parenthetical placed after it "(but with affluence rapidly declining"). I was going to edit this to "mostly affluent" and take out the parenthetical completely, but first, would anyone like to defend that statement? What is the basis for saying the "affluence" of Bridgewater (as a whole) is "rapidly declining." Maybe there are some areas that some other people don't like. It would certainly be fair to say that divisiveness and arrogance in Bridgewater seem to be "rapidly increasing" but my opinion does not belong in a neutral encyclopedia article any more than an unsupported assertion that affluence is "rapidly decreasing."

Neutron 5 July 2005 19:24 (UTC)

Notice: I will make that edit (removing "with affluence rapidly declining") tomorrow unless someone can justify it. Of course I do not know how often anyone reads these things so I do not know when any actual human being will see this.

Neutron 6 July 2005 13:54 (UTC)

Once-new issues

Bridgewater's incorporation date

(Note, I need to move this into old issues as I have now changed the incorporation date. I am planning other changes to the paragraph on history as well and there will probably end up being enough material there to rate its own section. -- Neutron 02:05, 20 July 2005 (UTC))[reply]

When I saw the date of 1899 used for Bridgewater's date of incorporation in this article, it did not seem logical for a number of reasons. I am aware that this is the date appearing on the township's official web site at [1]. In fact, comparing that page to the "history" section of the current Wikipedia article shows that the language in the article was taken directly from the township web site. However, for the reasons I explain in a post on the Bridgewater forum at nj.com, see [2], the 1899 date is highly doubtful even though the township itself thinks that is when it was incorporated. The responding posts on nj.com suggested that I may be correct in my belief that the actual incorporation date is 1798, not 1899.

Subsequent to those posts, I have located two sources that indicate that Bridgewater was indeed incorporated (along with the other 103 original townships in the State of New Jersey) by the Township Law of 1798. One of these sources states that the specific date of incorporation is February 21, 1798. The other publication gives the specific dates when the municipalities that were once part of Bridgewater broke away, further suggesting that Bridgewater must have been incorporated before 1899. (For example, Bridgewater included part of what is now Warren Township until 1806, and included what is now Branchburg until 1845, so it must have existed as of those dates.)

As a result, unless someone can come up with some contrary evidence in the next 2 days, I am going to correct the date of incorporation, and when I get the chance, I am going to rewrite the History section and hopefully add some more historical information. (For example, Bridgewater was the location of a major encampment of George Washington's troops during the Revolutionary War. The fact that the township's own web site ignores this fact seems inexcusable, but I cannot edit that. I can edit this. :)

Neutron 01:27, 18 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Deletion of "elementary"

(Note, this issue has now been resolved through discussion on 68etc's Talk page. I have edited the sentence slightly but have left the word "elementary" out. The grade level of the school is mentioned in the new section I added on "Education," and that information is more precise than just the word "elementary" anyway. -- Neutron 02:09, 20 July 2005 (UTC))[reply]

To user 68.193.103.252: I posted a question about your latest edit on your "Talk" page. When I get around to it, I am going to edit the sentence about the new school anyway, since it actually is going to serve only a portion of the area in question, not the entire area as some might infer from the existing sentence. Plus, the school is opening in September so after it opens the sentence should be updated anyway. But my inclination would be to include the word "elementary" in the description of the school. Is there any reason why not? That is what it is (K-3 for one year, and then K-4.) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Neutron (talk • contribs) 03:32, 18 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Major edits to community descriptions

Today I made a number of changes to the descriptions in "communities." With the encouragement of several other Bridgewater residents (including 68etc. and some people on a non-Wikipedia Bridgewater forum at nj.com), I have deleted all references and comparisons regarding "affluence," "class" (ie upper class, lower-middle class etc.) and racial and ethnic descriptions. For the Finderne section, I did leave in a reference to the area being "diverse" which I do not think anyone can argue with, but it now applies both to diversity of people and diversity of "land use."

Even though some of the descriptions I deleted were, at least arguably, "accurate," I think they do more harm than good. Additionally, most of what I deleted was at least partially opinion, and partially inaccurate. Given the mishmash of accurate, inaccurate and opinion, it seemed best just to get rid of all these types of references. The descriptions are still there but they are "more neutral" now.

Neutron 02:17, 20 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Zip Codes

This is a pretty minor point, but a previous writer put in (as the first thing in the first sentence after the Contents box) that Bridgewater's zip code is 08807. That is indeed the zip code for the Bridgewater post office and the majority of township residents. However, there are three other zip code areas either entirely or partially within Bridgewater: Martinsville has its own post office and zip code; the very northern corner of the township (including Sunset Lake) is the Basking Ridge zip code area; and the Bound Brook zip code area covers extends into Bridgewater, covering the neighborhoods south of 22 (Thomae Park, Shady Lane, etc.) and a few streets north of 22 as well.

I guess the first question is, does the township's zip code need to be in an encyclopedia, especially when to be completely accurate there would need to be 4 zip codes? It seems excessively trivial. Any objections to taking it out?

(The area code seems trivial too but at least it is accurate; we'll see how the sentence reads after the zip code comes out.)

Neutron 21:44, 20 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Does size matter?

When I first arrived on the Wikipedia scene, the article stated that Bridgewater was the "single largest municipality" in Somerset County. That implied that it is the largest in area because I know that Hillsborough is larger in area than Bridgewater, and there may be others. So, a few weeks ago, I changed it to "most populous." It turns out I edited out an apparently incorrect or at least unclear statement, and replaced it with a statement that is definitely incorrect. I was looking at population statistics to try to put into the as-yet-unformed "History" section of the Bridgewater article, and when I looked at 2000 I saw that Franklin has more people, about 50,000 as opposed to Bridgewater, about 42,000. So now I have edited it again so that Bridgewater is the county's second most populous municipality, which it is. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Neutron (talk • contribs) 21:51, 20 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

August 11, 2005

Today someone placed on the Bridgewater Township page, in the Education section, a paragraph full of complaints about the school system. The person identifies him/herself as a current student. I am pretty sure this edit should be reverted. I am waiting to see whether I should just do it and ask questions later, or set a specific amount of time for the person to justify it. At this point I think I am going to revert it (probably tomorrow morning) and then if the writer wishes to submit a toned-down version, they can do so. After I do the reversion I will post here again about why, but I think it should be fairly obvious from reading the new paragraph. It certainly is not "neutral" and it contains a level of detail (based entirely on opinion) that is not appropriate for an encyclopedia. Neutron 21:14, 11 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Anon insertion

Many people believe Bridgewater schools are going in the wrong direction and are moving out. This new school is raising a lot of taxes that are waste, because the new school has nothing special or new in it, the school also destroyed precious wildlife habitats, as did all the new developements in Bridgewater, and the school district is losing it's former credit, orignally ranked in the top 10 school districts in New Jersey, it has been going down consistently since 2000. The schools have one of the worst bully-management programs in the entire state of New Jersey, they claim to have a zero tolerance policy, yet every day a kid beats up another kid and gets away with it. The administarators promote jocks to honor roll when they don't even deserve it and make sure that the smart kids get one C so they don't deserve so they don't get honor roll. Many people have been complaining about the changes for the worse to Bridgewater schools and have been moving to nearby towns such as Hillsborough, Readington, Edison, among countless others, to escape what is happening to Bridgewater schools.-By a BRSD student, so I know what goes on.

I've removed this section; it was brought to my attention as possibly POV, and I agree that it is completely inappropriate. It is not, as it would suggest, a critique or criticism, but a full POV attack. If someone would like to clean up and NPOV the language, please feel free to do so, and return it to the article. However, please discuss wholesale reinsertion (i.e., reinsertion without changes) on this page before doing so. -- Essjay · Talk 02:44, August 12, 2005 (UTC)

This could be changed to a NPOV easily. i think that would be best...considering that the author of that statement is correct. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.192.201.227 (talk) 01:30, 14 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Changes of Aug. 30 and 31 by 68.193.103.52

I have reverted edits by this anonymous user, who turned the order of the sections upside down and added this section:

Problems
Bridgewater, like many west Somerset and Hunterdon county towns, is in the middle of an arguably problematic period. Although Bridgewater was never "super rural" like some of it's neighbors, it is not like the township has not seen suburbs before. Recently, however, the township, in many peoples eye, has grown too fast for it's own good. It is currently being heavily developed in places that were once precious wildlife habitats, and already high property tax rates have soared, leaving many residents unhappy.
The township passed a budget for the first time in 4 years this year to provide for a new school, however, the new school apparently does not have many of the new accomodations the district promised it would have, which has many residents very unhappy and it is unlikely the budget will pass again next year.
Overall, the over-developement of the township has diminished the qualities of life that once made Bridgewater an attractive place to live. Traffic has increased, and Bridgewater is already on the far edge of the New York metropolitan area, making commutes harder, deer and coyotes have become huge pest problems, the once very safe township is now home to small gangs, and every year the school district becomes more and more crowded (and less and less credited).
People have taken notice, more and more Bridgewater residents are thinking of moving or have already moved. This has been noted, as the townships original population boom has come to somewhat of a halt (the population increase rates has decreased extreemly according 2004 Census Buerau Data), some people are beggining to think Bridgewater may eventually start losing population, despite this, the township does continue to grow, but the problems grow with it.

This material obviously is non-NPOV, highly opinionated, and filled with rumors and incorrect information. It would be possible to write a section about problems and issues facing Bridgewater in a manner acceptable here, but this is not it. References to population trends, especially ones based on the 2004 estimates, should at least have the numbers included so readers can see the facts and not just one person's opinions about what is happening. Most people in Bridgewater would be happy if the slowing population growth indicated that the township is finally "built out," but this person chooses to see it as a sign that people are generally unhappy and are moving out.

Aside to 68.193.etc.: By my count, this is at least the fourth time you have posted derogatory information about Bridgewater (I did not look all the way back, I see you had some edits even before that but figured four was enough to make my point.) All of those edits have been either wiped out by subsequent editing (most of it by me) or simply reverted. In fact, this is the second time in less than three weeks that you have inserted a tirade against Bridgewater in this article. On August 11 it was about how poor you think the education system is and how everyone is moving out; this was reverted by an administrator. Now it is everything that is wrong with the township in general, and (again) how people are moving out, with (again) some shots at the school system. Since I have now overcome my semi-newbie fear of reverting, I am taking care of it myself this time. Ironically, I agree with a few of the things you say, for example there HAS been overdevelopment, but WRITE about it as an issue, don't just whine about it. If you want to complain, or state a non-NPOV, there is a forum at www.nj.com/forums/bridgewater where anyone can post any opinions they want. Of course there, anyone else can debate your assertions, unlike here. Neutron 02:25, 1 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, that was a bit opinionated (I tried to keep it as NPOV as possible, perhaps I could change it a little), but Bridgewater is going through a lot of problems. Believe me, I live here, and I can't wait till I can go to college and move out. One thing that can not be argued with is the increased amount of people consider leaving the township, also the new Milltown School (or as I call it, the "Ripoff School") was supposed to have new learning tools such as text-books and maps, they got new furniture, but new learning accomidations that are essential to educating the children, I think not, it's true, I have sources.

It is obvious that the township has been overdeveloped, but of course you agree with me on that so I can't fight you. But there is more. the town has become more polluted, which you'd have to be an idiot not to ntoice, and the safety of the township has declined, I read a whole article in Bridgewater-Branchburg-Somerville-Raritan dedicated newspaper "The Reporter" a while back about how small gangs formed in the township, keep in mind that I said small and it's not like the Bloods and the Krips will start having locations in Bridgewater, but it is not as safe.

Oh, and if you haven't ntoiced how much to tax rates have increased because of this fricken ripoff school and all the fricken McMansions destroying the fricken town than you must be an idiot, they increased by god-knows how much.

So I am re-adding the problem section, and making it a bit more NPOV (deleting statements such as "decrese population" and such), are you happy now, no town is perfect, after all this is supposed to be nuetral point of view, but your making the place look perfect, that isn't nuetral. Protozoic Waste (note, I made an account today). — Preceding undated comment added 16:00, 4 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Protozoic Waste

Good job on making an account, I like the name. A bit gross if you think about it for too long, but it could be a "band name" wihtout too much trouble. As for your edits, I am sorry, it is still not neutral and has unsubstantiated rumors, most notably the part about the new school. I do think that PARTS of what you have written could be re-edited into a reasonable statement of issues and controversies facing Bridgewater, but as I said before, this isn't it. I appreciate that you have taken out one troublesome part, but you have not solved the problem. As for taxes, yes I have noticed how much they have risen, becuase I own a home and I actually pay them; since it appears that you are still in high school, can you say the same? However, I also know WHY they have risen and it is much more complicated than simply building a school, which has very little to do with the increase. I am not trying to make Bridgewater look perfect. I know, perhaps better than you, just how imperfect it is. I do not mean to show you disrespect because of your age, but I think a bit more experience with life might give you a broader perspective on things. As a final note, we can probably have more reasonable discussions of how to improve this article if you refrain from speculating on the circumstances under which I might be an "idiot." Neutron 17:55, 5 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Changed Census Innacurracies

(This Does Not Have To Do With The Problems Section) I looked up the census bueraus official website, and it said BW was 83 percent white and 11 percent Asian, as opposed to 85 percent white and 10 percent Asian, I changed this, just so you know- Protozoic Waste — Preceding undated comment added 00:11, 10 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

"Twins and triplets"

lxfd64 has added the following sentence to the article:

"According to the National Geographic Society, Bridgewater has an unusually high number of twins and triplets. [3]"

I have read the nationalgeographic.com article and I am not sure that it supports this sentence. What the article says is that New Jersey "has the highest ratio of triplet births in the United States." The article also uses Bridgewater as the main example of this trend, interviewing at least one Bridgewater family and including some photos taken in this family's home and in their street, showing their neighbors with their own twins and triplets. But the sentence written by lxfd64 begs the question, "Unusually" for where? Bridgewater's incidence of twins/triplets is probably not unusual compared to other places in New Jersey, and I suspect in particular, other suburban areas of New Jersey. However, it probably is unusual compared to other similar places in the United States, since it is part of the "unusual" New Jersey-wide trend. Therefore, I think the sentence should be rewritten. Perhaps it would be best to say "Bridgewater has received national attention as an example of New Jersey's unusually high occurrence of twins and triplets." (Plus the links.) However, at this point I have not changed it to give lsfd64 and others a chance to respond. Part of my hesitation also is due to the fact that the natgeo.com article appears to refer to a longer article in print version of the magazine, which does not appear to be available online, at least not without paying. Neutron 01:21, 26 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Hmm, maybe it should say "unusually high number of twins and triplets compared to the rest of the United States" instead? --Ixfd64 07:59, 26 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Interesting, but the article was more about the state itself, the person they talked to just happend to be from Bridgewater. Perhaps if you moved this to the New Jersey artcle.-Protozoic Waste {{Subst:Undated|20:40, 28 October 2005}

There is a large fertility clinic in the vicinity of Bridgewater, which explains the high incidence of multiple births. Also the town has a good or great reputation as a place to raise a family in the New York City metro area. And many of these parents are settling down with upper-middle-class incomes, but I'm aware this news story was in 2005 and I'm not exactly sure this aspect of Bridgewater has changed. 2605:E000:100D:C32F:1435:A112:765F:4D89 (talk) 22:46, 2 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Fair use rationale for Image:Somerset patriots color logo.JPG

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Map of Bridgewater

Hey, what happened to the map of Bridgewater? Neutron 00:52, 6 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Home Alone?

Somebody inserted that a scene from home alone was filmed in Bridgewater, I'm pretty sure this isn't true; it was filmed in Chicago's north shore area. I propose removing it... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.194.37.215 (talk) 23:28, 9 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Article title

Should this article be moved to the simpler Bridgewater, New Jersey, with out the word "township"? It is already a redirect to this article, and there is no other Bridgewater in New Jersey, so "towwnship" isn't needed for diambiguation purposes. And the vast majority of actual use doesn't include the word, either. So why does it persist? Seems to be an unneeded technicality in the title, against the best practices of out article titles policy. oknazevad (talk) 04:42, 15 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

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