Talk:Battle of Vasylkiv

This article was nominated for deletion on 21 December 2023. The result of the discussion was merge.

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All sources are in Ukrainian

I am not sure as to how gauging the reliability of sources is done on Wikipedia, but why are all of the sources for this article in Ukrainian when the same information seems to be cited on related pages from English sources? Stephanos100 (talk) 01:48, 26 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe something to do with information warfare? Idk 5.53.249.34 (talk) 14:41, 27 February 2022 (UTC) Jotaro97[reply]

Stephanos100, hence why the word alleged and allegedly are used a lot. Many Ukrainian sources are generally good for general statements, but statements like the plane shootdown are very alleged. Curbon7 (talk) 05:09, 7 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

To clarify, I am not saying one way or another that they are credible sources as I cannot read them. My question (at the time of my asking) was simply why all of the sources of the article at the time were in Ukrainian for an article in English when all of the information in the article seemed to be just as credibly sourced with English citations. I am a language nut and I am not saying that sources cannot be in other languages other than English or that all sources should be in English, but this is the article under the English Wikipedia, so I feel that it is important that the sources are in the same language as that which people who would read the article would speak so that the citations can be properly explored and verified. Stephanos100 (talk) 08:27, 7 March 2022 (UTC)Stephanos100[reply]

We sourced it at the moment when only Ukrainian language sources existed. There's a constant stream of news articles, so it's important we grab (verifiable and reliable) sources as they're posted lest any get lost in the news cycle. Obv these can be replaced with English language sources (and probably should as some Uke sources may give undue weight to non-consequential events or may just be otherwise non-neutral). Overall though, we don't have a language restriction regarding sources; sources can be in whatever language (although preferably Google Translate-able). Curbon7 (talk) 09:13, 7 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

US officials said Ukraine shot down Il-76

Ukraine is not alone in claiming that it shot down 2 il-76s, US officials said so too. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 137.22.255.72 (talk) 03:05, 2 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, this is noted in the article. Curbon7 (talk) 05:09, 7 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Its now over one Week and there is not a single piece of evidence of this Battle or the Wreckage of this two IL76 Planes. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.113.144.67 (talk) 00:14, 5 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

So? Curbon7 (talk) 05:09, 7 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

It's been nearly a month, without any evidence. It's 100% safe to say it's fake IdkIdc12345 (talk) 19:12, 24 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Hence why the article says “allegedly”. HappyWithWhatYouHaveToBeHappyWith (talk) 20:13, 24 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Absolutely incorrect. Its entirely possible for a plane such as that to be shot down and no pieces WITH IDENTIFYING INFORMATION found. Its also 100% safe to say that Ukrainian civilians have bigger fish to fry than searching the woods for plane wreckage. 97.126.65.119 (talk) 21:32, 24 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Just stop trying, it's an obvious attempt to project a 2014 luhansk il-76 shootdown onto Russians, no IL76 has even entered ukrainian airspace. No proofs, nothing except some claims hence it can be for sure written off as a bad fake. DeiDrah23 (talk) 16:44, 6 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I agree. Obviously no Il-76 was shot down, not one or two. Specialists consider that they were two decoy drones to lure and reveal the Ukrainian air defenses. The Ukrainians would not have taken long to show the remains of two 50-meter planes and the alleged hundreds of troops or equipment they were transporting, even less so in a relatively populated area. more than two months have passed and not a single image or report has been seen to show what would be a great victory for the Ukrainian AA defense. It is unfortunate how falsehoods are sometimes perpetuated in WP because of some "reputable sources" and less reputable ones. but remember that "WP is not Truth", but the vast majority of WP readers do not know this. 152.207.201.201 (talk) 02:23, 2 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I've added another source about the lack of any wreckage. Instead the source indicated a fight with sleeper cells.

The article should reflect this better in the lead in my opinion. It really seems like a sleeper cell, maybe with some special forces support, coordinated a missile strike on the air defense command center located there. The cited NY Times article at least points in this direction. Beliar (talk) 13:38, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I agree that it is very unlikely any Il-76 was shot down. Wreckage of an Il-76 would have been found by now. I think it should be removed.Nelsonblaha (talk) 23:07, 27 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

ONGOING battle?

That's only my opninion, but this article should be limited to engagement from 26 february, classified as "Ukrainian Victory" and left as such. Any other developement like bombing is outside of the scope and do not counts as "battle". There is no continuity here. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.193.208.253 (talk) 00:20, 16 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I agree, this was not an ongoing battle. Several users have edited this to make it look like this was a Russian victory or that there was a prolonged occupation here. This is completely at odds with most sources. [1] --Kuzwa (talk) 15:02, 4 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, and it's extremely annoying to constantly fix it. It was just an air assault that failed, nothing to it. 72.229.242.36 (talk) 13:22, 5 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Move discussion in progress

There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Battle of Kherson which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 05:22, 24 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

This battle never happened

There was no evidence of the Il76 shootdowns anywhere. Il76s are huge, the wreckages would've been found by now. The only sources are weak from the first days of the war when a lot of misinfo was flying around and it honestly doesn't even make sense. Russian stragglers were walking around? After surviving a giant plane crash? Ok.

Why is this article still up? Are we just going to wait for Ukrainian officials to say years from now "Yeah well we made this up sorry guys" to take it down? Piloper123 (talk) 19:21, 4 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Merged to Northern Ukraine campaign#Vasylkiv per Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Battle of Vasylkiv

Per AfD discussion, this article has been merged to Northern Ukraine campaign#Vasylkiv and made a redirect to that section. Cinderella157 (talk) 02:55, 29 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]