Talk:Anti-Sikh sentiment in Canada

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Sikhism

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Rename to 'Anti-Sikh sentiment in Canada'

@Jattlife121 - Hello, should this article be renamed to 'Anti-Sikh sentiment in Canada' to mirror the titles of the currently established articles below?

MaplesyrupSushi (talk) 23:34, 16 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I'm open to it, I wasn't 100% sure as there is Islamophobia in Canada as specific country related article. Jattlife121 (talk) 00:03, 17 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ultimately there needs to be a parent article created in due course called Anti Sikh Sentiment. Jattlife121 (talk) 00:04, 17 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I also agree with "sentiment" but not need to capitalize the "S". thanks. Aszx5000 (talk) 00:34, 17 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Online sentiment and responses

None of the articles mention specifically "anti Sikh" hate comments, but rather address them as "racist". We cannot interpolate that as anti Sikh sentiment if the article does not explicitly mention it, as that would constitute WP:ORIGINALRESEARCH and WP:SYNTH. Further, the screenshots of the comments, which state " "wtf is with the news with these turbin heads" are a primary source, we have to rely on commentary from secondary sources and what they label these comments as- we're not allowed to include them based on our own analysis, opinions or inferences as per WP:ORIGINALRESEARCH and WP:SECONDARY. Southasianhistorian8 (talk) 00:39, 19 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Per this link: Anti Sikh Sentiment Revision with Online Sentiment and Responses

Both articles reference comments related to "Anti-Sikh Sentiment" (this is not an Anti-Sikh Hate Wikipedia Page) specifically as they pertain to the Sikh faith. Anti-Sikh sentiment includes anti-Sikh hate, negative attitudes toward Sikhs, and related expressions.

I don't understand how you can say, we must refer from commentary of secondary sources which is evident per the remarks made and content that these are Sikh Specific. CBC are amongst the most prestigious amongst Canadian News sources.

The articles referenced pertain to comments reflecting "Anti-Sikh Sentiment" specifically related to the Sikh faith, which includes anti-Sikh hate, negative feelings towards Sikhs, and related expressions.

CBC Article on Sikh Parade: It is claimed that the information should be derived from secondary sources; however, the screenshots in question have been verified by CBC (a reliable source according to Wikipedia standards) on Twitter in relation to their article on this matter. The article also includes interviews with members of the Sikh community, further substantiating the context. The use of the word "Hindu" shows the intent to belittle the Sikh individual and demean thus would qualify under "Anti-Sikh Sentiment"
CBC Vancouver Article: This source is also verified and reliable for citation on Wikipedia. CBC Vancouver responded on their official X (formerly Twitter) account, which later formed the basis of a news article. The specific comment referring to a Sikh person as a "turban head" is recognized as anti-Sikh, targeting religious identity rather than race. This situation was also reported by other reputable news outlets.

Jattlife121 (talk) 23:54, 23 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I am happy to provide further supporting articles. Just note you may expect a delay in my response for a day or two. Jattlife121 (talk) 23:55, 23 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It's the same way Sikh individuals were murdered after 9/11 on the assumption they were Muslim because of what they looked like i.e turban and beard. It didn't matter about the religion but solely on appearance.

Same way, these comments were targeted based on the distinct identify of a Sikh. There have been little to no instances on a clean-shaven Sikh man. Jattlife121 (talk) 23:58, 23 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Both articles reference comments related to "Anti-Sikh Sentiment" (this is not an Anti-Sikh Hate Wikipedia Page) specifically as they pertain to the Sikh faith.

None of the articles explicitly say they were subject to anti-Sikh hate, but that they received racist comments online. Do you realize that sometimes people are subject to online hate or discrimination solely because of their race or skin colour, it doesn't necessarily mean the offenders have any specific stance on the person's religion, or are even cognizant of it. A Sikh individual may receive hateful comments based on their race or religion, or both, but unless the source explicitly labels the comments as discrimination pertaining to religion, we cannot include it.

CBC Article on Sikh Parade

Again, this is ridiculous, a troll comment online, practically an inevitability surrounding any event, is hardly noteworthy and barely warrants an article, let alone inclusion in Wikipedia. Again the article does not even explicitly call the comment as "anti Sikh" but rather as racist. So unless you find a legitimate source which mentions it as such, you cant put it in the article.

CBC Vancouver Article

Ditto. And what does CBC's response on Twitter have to do with anything? Southasianhistorian8 (talk) 04:33, 24 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Covid mask mandate

As I said, I find this entry to be tenuous and disingenuous to label this so strongly as "Anti-Sikh sentiment", which to people, would suggest targeting Sikhs solely based on their religion or religious identity/appearance with a malicious intent. These mask mandates were intended to protect society during a pandemic, not to target Sikhs, and while it did initially cause some Sikhs to lose employment, the mandate was imposed uniformly on all bearded people, regardless of religious affiliation, not just picking and choosing on Sikhs selectively.

We can bring other editors to see if this entry is suitable as well through 3O or RFC. Southasianhistorian8 (talk) 20:34, 20 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I would also say this could be considered a content fork of Face Masks during the Covid 19 pandemic. Southasianhistorian8 (talk) 20:39, 20 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The mandate would have also certainly affected some practising Muslims (some of whom keep a certain type of beard, to whom shaving is proscribed) or maybe even non religious guards who did not wish to shave their beard, in addition to the mandate's lack of malicious intent and religious singling out, so again I find it more suitable to include this in the Face Masks article, rather than here. Southasianhistorian8 (talk) 20:50, 20 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Jattlife121, please read https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Verifiability#Verifiability_does_not_guarantee_inclusion. Please obtain consensus before readding this. Southasianhistorian8 (talk) 20:56, 20 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

So Anti-Sikh sentiment would encompass discrimination, prejudice etc.. Similar to Islamophobia in Canada has addressed similar issues. Whilst I understand it was on bearded people, the religious accommodation from this action was not met under City of Toronto policy as such those Sikh men who lost their job were not accommodated an alternative or even demoted. Mayor of Toronto also discussed this below:

"On Monday, Toronto’s mayor placed blame on third-party companies for failing to accommodate workers when enforcing a city policy.

“I’ve asked city staff to work with all contractors involved to immediately resolve this issue and to be absolutely clear that we respect people’s human rights, including freedom of religion, and we expect all contractors to do the same and to properly accommodate employees,” Toronto’s mayor, John Tory, said in a statement. “No city policy allows contractors to ignore or dismiss their employees’ religious beliefs or to fail to accommodate them.” Source - Guardian. The City of Toronto have also said:

"However, the City of Toronto has now apologised for the controversial policy. In an altered directive, it has said that it will permit “under-mask beard covers”. “Effective Tuesday, the City of Toronto said that it will immediately permit ‘under-mask beard covers’ as a reasonable accommodation option for individuals who maintain facial hair as a tenet of their faith and are required to be present at City sites with protective N95 respirator requirements,” the statement said."

Per the reader - In terms of sources, there is so no shortage on this but the main verifiable and reputable ones have such as The Guardian in the UK, CBC, Globe and Mail etc.. This was also Jattlife121 (talk) 21:17, 20 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Also just to note a law/policy/action etc.. can have discrimination against Sikhs, Muslims, Hindus or whoever simultaneously. It doesn't have to be mutually exclusive. Jattlife121 (talk) 21:19, 20 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I understand that some employers failed to accommodate employees with certain religious beliefs, such as Sikhs, likely out of ignorance or apathy or even zealousness in keeping the public healthy, but to include this on a page titled "Anti Sikh sentiment", to me, seems like an exaggeration, and more suitable for the Face masks article. Again, the employers' actions dont seem to denote active hostility or discrimination against religious people, which is what the title of this article suggests.

But I get that people might have a different view, and I think it would be good to have some other editors weigh in. Southasianhistorian8 (talk) 21:28, 20 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Sounds good, happy to hear what others think. Jattlife121 (talk) 21:29, 20 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks I listed it on 3O. Southasianhistorian8 (talk) 21:34, 20 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

3O Response: I agree that this content should not be added to this article. The sources cited do not describe these events as Anti-Sikh discrimination, and no evidence has been presented here that these were acts of intentional discrimination, rather than overzealous application of a government policy that was neutral on its face. voorts (talk/contributions) 16:03, 21 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Pinging @Jattlife121 and @Southasianhistorian8. voorts (talk/contributions) 16:03, 21 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks @Voorts.

@Jattlife121, as of right now there isn't consensus to add this content, but if you wish to have more editors chime in, you can start a RFC or possibly post on a neutral noticeboard. Southasianhistorian8 (talk) 16:42, 21 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think there's really an appropriate noticeboard for this. If you want more feedback, posting a neutral message at WikiProjects Canada and Sikhism would be appropriate. voorts (talk/contributions) 16:44, 21 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]