Talk:Anti-Christian sentiment

Why not Christianophobia as title?

If there is an article with the title "Islamophobia" then why is this article not titled "Christianophobia" rather than the "Anti-Christian sentiment"? Alternatively, Islamophobia should be changed to "Anti-Muslim sentiment".

Also, in the article on Islamophobia the words fear and hate are used often but in the Christianophobia article the "soft" word sentiment is used. Why is there a diminishment of the seriousness of this issue?

Or, is Wikipedia Christianophobic? 104.158.48.195 (talk) 12:20, 10 February 2023 (UTC)

My impression is that Islamophobia is a long established word for not liking Muslims, and worse, while Christianophobia is a neologism that doesn't yet have a settled place in the English language. (My spellchecker doesn't think it's even a real word.) We can't really use such a word as an article heading. As for the content of the respective articles, that's a very different issue. It needs to be tackled based on our standard approach of what reliable sources say. HiLo48 (talk) 23:59, 10 February 2023 (UTC)

Although I don't agree with OP that the current title implies anything about wikipedia, for what it's worth I just looked up "Anti-Christian sentiment" vs "Christophobia" vs "Christianophobia" on Google Books Ngram Viewer and both Christophobia and Christianophobia are far more commonly used in their collection of English language books, specifically within the last 20 years or so. Based on that, I think I would support renaming the article to one of them. - Relinus (talk) 14:17, 5 August 2023 (UTC)

I would agree with this. JustAPoliticsNerd (talk) 19:55, 20 July 2024 (UTC)

Is this a real thing?

Examples given don't indicate that christianity is specifically targeted. The examples given indicate that christians in these areas are persecuted because religious minorities are oppressed in those countries. It is no different from a christian majority country oppressing non-christians, and not at all comparable to Antisemitism, or Islamophobia, which uniquely target specific religions, have a deeply roted history, in christianity, ironically enough, and are intertwined with white supremacy. 46.97.170.32 (talk) 12:42, 28 July 2023 (UTC)

I doubt you have even read the entire article, but yes, it is a real thing. The examples mention even Christian-majority countries that oppressed their own religious groups under new regimes such as France during the Revolution and the Soviet Union and other socialist dictatorships during the Cold War, not to mention other historical examples such as the Christian persecution in the Roman Empire, Christian hating by Muslims in the Middle Ages, and by Ottomans in the 20th century, and so on. - Munmula (talk · contribs) 13:47, 10 September 2023 (UTC)

Those did not specifically target christians. They were targeting religion in general, Christians just happened to be the most affected, but would have been affected even if they were of a different religion. Anti-Christian sentiment would be a valid phenomenon if christians were uniquely targeted, specifically for being christians, and if there were wide-spread stereotypes, tropes and conspicary theories uniquely and specifically associated with christianity, similar to antisemitism. Problem is, there is no such thing (although the insinuation that there is is very popular with people who try to minimize the significance and impact of antisemitism). Your examples of Persecution of christians is completely irrelevant, because as you can see, that is a subject of a separate article. 46.97.170.235 (talk) 10:37, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

Cry about it more, dude. 2601:408:8101:7170:8A1:9174:D78:5928 (talk) 14:56, 4 March 2024 (UTC)

Victim olympics

Christians are subjected to real persecution in countries like North Korea and Egypt. In the West, some may be a bit mean to them but nobody seriously questions their right to freedom of religion. They're the traditional dominant culture after all. Some TV show offending a few people is way too much undue weight. MaxBrowne2 (talk) 12:27, 12 August 2023 (UTC)

@MaxBrowne2: This doesn't need a separate topic, as I already started one and it went compltely unnoticed. I would argue that christians aren't persecuted in North Korea or Egypt either, in the sense that they are not uniquely and specifically targeted. There isn't a single country that persecutes christians that doesn't also persecute ALL religious minorities. It's no different from what christian countries have been doing pre-enlightenment. In my view, the whole concept is made to create an anti-christian counterpart to antisemitism or islamophobia which, unlike "anti-christian sentiment", are real observable phenomena, distinct from general religious intolerance (and stem from christianity, ironically enough). 46.97.170.235 (talk) 12:49, 21 August 2023 (UTC)

EDIT: Incidentally, the picture chosen is an atheist grafity, encouraging people to stop going to church. Atheism's rise in popularity isn't christian persecution. People are just growing up. 46.97.170.235 (talk) 12:54, 21 August 2023 (UTC)

I'm curious why you feel the need to editorialize and slip left-wing nutjob commentary into all your posts. 2600:1702:26E9:6E0F:7071:1D7C:39E4:CFDF (talk) 12:32, 26 August 2023 (UTC)

Literally everyone here disagrees with you. Just because you have your own opinion doesn’t mean you should express it. 2601:408:8101:7170:8A1:9174:D78:5928 (talk) 15:01, 4 March 2024 (UTC)

The article topic is "Anti-Christian sentiment". Wikipedia has another article for Persecution of Christians and while I would agree with you that things which are not actually persecution would have no place on that page, this page can and should include examples of hatred towards Christians which do not necessarily lead to violence against them.

This is similar to how Wikipedia has separate pages for Islamophobia/Persecution of Muslims or Anti-Hindu sentiment/Persecution of Hindus. The sentiment/phobia page is generally geared towards the hatred that may or may not lead to violence, while the persecution page is focused on the actual violence itself. Relinus (talk) 18:46, 23 August 2023 (UTC)

I don't know about Anti-Hindu sentiments all that much, but I do know that Islamophobia is an observable phenomenon specifically targeting muslims, stemming from christianity and closely intertwined with white supremacy, and fascism, whereas so-called "hatred of christians" is almost exclusively either a) criticism of christianity (which is NOT motivated by hatred - in fact, inspiring hatred is one of the many things christianity itself is criticised for) or b) general religious intolerance (which doesn't specifically target christians is a unique and special way). If Persecution of Christians already exists (a debated subject in and of itself) then this article is redundant and needs to be deleted. Also, the graffiti you restored very clearly says "quit the church today", and is obviously meant to encourage non-religious people who are attend church either due to force of habit or peer-pressure, to stop doing it and come out as atheists. The widely accepted consensus among people who aren't Fox News viewers is that Christians, the single largest religious group in existence, are not subject to any sort of persecution, discrimination or hatred, except from non-christian Theorcatic regimes, and to the same degree as all other local religious minorities. This is not Conservapedia. 46.97.170.235 (talk) 11:34, 25 August 2023 (UTC)

Wow, tell everyone you’re Christophobic without saying you’re Christophobic. 2601:408:8101:7170:8A1:9174:D78:5928 (talk) 14:59, 4 March 2024 (UTC)

@46.97.170.235: Cry harder. This isn't your anti-Christian reddit hugbox. See WP:NOTAFORUM.

Bias/undue weight in definition

The words "fear of, hatred of, discrimination, and/or prejudice" should contain dispproval of, which is not "fear" nor "discrimination" nor "prejudice" and doesn't carry the same weight has "hatred".

Currently only words are in the definition that assume "that any opposition to christianity is because of being intimidated ("fear", "prejudice", "hatred", "discrimination"), whereas anti christianity could be disapproval or concern.

Without this this article does not read like it adheres to WP:NPOV. Ybllaw (talk) 10:48, 10 February 2024 (UTC)

@Ybllaw: The article is not about mere "disapproval", any more than Islamophobia is about mere "disapproval". But you already knew that, didn't you?

Cat war

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