Talk:Action-adventure (disambiguation)
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Requested move 18 June 2020
[edit]- The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
The result of the move request was: no consensus (non-admin closure) ~ Amkgp 💬 17:36, 25 June 2020 (UTC)
Action-adventure (disambiguation) → Action-adventure – Originally, action-adventure was redirecting to action-adventure game with the claim that "action-adventure" by itself refers primarily to video games. Another editor disputed that back in October 2019, and I dispute that today. "Action-adventure" is a general term and a genre that is found in video games and films and other media. Therefore the term should be a disambiguation page that lists the different media articles in which the action-adventure genre has a presence. Erik (talk | contrib) (ping me) 17:35, 18 June 2020 (UTC)
- Pinging involved editors Kailash29792, Czar. Erik (talk | contrib) (ping me) 17:36, 18 June 2020 (UTC)
- Support: No clear primary topic. There are countless works of genre that can be called action-adventure, like the Tarzan and Indiana Jones films. There are even many TV series belonging to this hybrid genre. --Kailash29792 (talk) 17:47, 18 June 2020 (UTC)
- Support per nom.--Ortizesp (talk) 18:11, 18 June 2020 (UTC)
- Oppose. The term is far and away associated with games (i.e., games are the primary topic), especially when the term is hyphenated. Note that the association on ENWP of "action-adventure" with with games is an order of magnitude larger than that of film. Note where the following redirects point: action-adventure game (full article); action adventure fiction (an unsourced sentence); action adventure film (unsourced section). As a genre, the hyphenated term is much more closely associated with games than it is with any other media. Those looking for "action-adventure" are looking for action-adventure game, where they also receive a hatnote to the dab page if they are looking for another meaning. For what it's worth, I'm mainly referring to the hyphenated "action-adventure" and am ambivalent about "action adventure" (no hyphen), which isn't nearly as associated with games. If there no consensus for this move, I would ask that the recently changed action-adventure redirection be reverted as well. (not watching, please
{{ping}}) czar 03:49, 19 June 2020 (UTC)- If you truly believe that "action-adventure" by itself means "action-adventure game" more than anything else, than set up a WP:RM discussion arguing that. Here, I see a general term being hijacked for a specific medium. It's like saying "science fiction" should redirect to "science fiction film" because films could be argued to be the most well-known media under that genre. To get back on topic, even just putting "action-adventure" in Google Scholar shows that the term goes back and forth between video games and films, as seen here. While this is a very rough results count, when adding video games, films, or TV, each addition is about 11K-14K results each. Erik (talk | contrib) (ping me) 11:58, 19 June 2020 (UTC)
- I think that sci-fi example and use of "hijack" is extreme. Google Scholar's readings will reflect the size of the academic literature, which is much larger for non-game media. The question should be what a reader searching for "action-adventure" would expect from WP. Action adventure film is a hybrid genre with a much smaller WP footprint (both in the little we have on the subject and in the much fewer films that identify as such on WP). Action adventure television, fiction, comics, etc. pale in comparison to even that. As a phrase, it's much more commonly associated with games media on WP than any other genre. Anyone searching for the root word is adequately serviced by the existing hatnote. czar 03:01, 22 June 2020 (UTC)
- Czar, you said that "the size of the academic literature" will be "much larger for non-game media", which means that the topic "action-adventure" is a primary topic in having "substantially greater enduring notability and educational value". In essence, you are admitting that the literature is more extensive on the term other than its use for video games. You also want to cite Wikipedia itself to "prove" that the topic is primary, which is a violation of WP:CIRCULAR. To use the "science fiction" example again, if I prove that most articles related to science fiction on Wikipedia are films, does that mean "science fiction" should redirect to "science fiction film"? No. Erik (talk | contrib) (ping me) 12:55, 24 June 2020 (UTC)
- I think that sci-fi example and use of "hijack" is extreme. Google Scholar's readings will reflect the size of the academic literature, which is much larger for non-game media. The question should be what a reader searching for "action-adventure" would expect from WP. Action adventure film is a hybrid genre with a much smaller WP footprint (both in the little we have on the subject and in the much fewer films that identify as such on WP). Action adventure television, fiction, comics, etc. pale in comparison to even that. As a phrase, it's much more commonly associated with games media on WP than any other genre. Anyone searching for the root word is adequately serviced by the existing hatnote. czar 03:01, 22 June 2020 (UTC)
- If you truly believe that "action-adventure" by itself means "action-adventure game" more than anything else, than set up a WP:RM discussion arguing that. Here, I see a general term being hijacked for a specific medium. It's like saying "science fiction" should redirect to "science fiction film" because films could be argued to be the most well-known media under that genre. To get back on topic, even just putting "action-adventure" in Google Scholar shows that the term goes back and forth between video games and films, as seen here. While this is a very rough results count, when adding video games, films, or TV, each addition is about 11K-14K results each. Erik (talk | contrib) (ping me) 11:58, 19 June 2020 (UTC)
- Statistics:
- Category:Action-adventure games (1,366 pages)
- Category:Action-adventure comics (172 pages)
- Category:1910s action adventure films (10 pages)
- Category:1920s action adventure films (24 pages)
- Category:1930s action adventure films (34 pages)
- Category:1940s action adventure films (27 pages)
- Category:1950s action adventure films (32 pages)
- Category:1960s action adventure films (33 pages)
- Category:1970s action adventure films (43 pages)
- Category:1980s action adventure films (61 pages)
- Category:1990s action adventure films (45 pages)
- Category:2000s action adventure films (65 pages)
- Category:2010s action adventure films (130 pages)
- Category:2020s action adventure films (9 pages)
- It's not exactly fun work, but disambiguating game infoboxes can boost your edit count. I seem to recall doing this exercise once before. Hundreds of times. About 100 will need to be done this time:
| genre = [[Action-adventure]]→| genre = [[Action-adventure game|Action-adventure]]— wbm1058 (talk) 03:40, 22 June 2020 (UTC)
- It's not exactly fun work, but disambiguating game infoboxes can boost your edit count. I seem to recall doing this exercise once before. Hundreds of times. About 100 will need to be done this time:
- Support per nom. Mikus (talk) 04:07, 23 June 2020 (UTC)
- Oppose per Czar. "Action-adventure" as a search topic is almost always going to refer to the game genre, thus it falls under WP:PRIMARYTOPIC. ~ Dissident93 (talk) 05:54, 23 June 2020 (UTC)
- Czar admitted that the literature on "action-adventure" is more substantial on media other than video games. They literally cited Wikipedia itself to "prove" that the topic is primary, which violates WP:CIRCULAR. It is like saying that most science fiction-related articles on Wikipedia are film articles, so "science fiction" should redirect to "science fiction film". There is no reason outside Wikipedia for "action-adventure" as a general term be about any specific media. Erik (talk | contrib) (ping me) 12:55, 24 June 2020 (UTC)
- Oppose per page view stats. The concepts in gaming, fiction, and film have long-term significance, and the gaming use has (surprising to me) an order of magnitude more "sought-ness" on Wikipedia (265K vs. 26K for all others combined). Current arrangement serves the readers. -- JHunterJ (talk) 11:38, 25 June 2020 (UTC)
- The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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[edit]Buganda 154.225.51.117 (talk) 18:12, 15 March 2022 (UTC)