Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Gymnastics

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All Around, not All Round

I’ve come across several articles that say all round. The correct term is all around. Afheather (talk) 16:29, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Gymnast pics - Marshall Avener

Hello! I am currently working on the Marshall Avener. He is a fascinating figure and I believe this has the potential to be a good article if a picture can be found.

Just wondered if anyone knew of any potential sources for gymnast photos from this era? Avener competed in the 1972 and 1976 Olympics, along with many other competitions, so I hope something is out there. Thanks in advance for any advice or help. MarchOfTheGreyhounds (talk) 15:49, 29 August 2023 (UTC)

Another RfC on capitalization of all our articles

I thought this was a done deal back in this 2022 RFC but obviously not. A handful of editors did another rfc with no sports projects input at all. And it's being challenged because we just noticed it. This could affect almost every single tennis and Olympic article we have, and goodness know how many other sports. Some may have already been moved it you weren't watching the article. And not just the article titles will be affected but all the player bios that link to the articles. Sure the links would be piped to the right place if thousands of articles moved, but if the wording in a bio still said 2023 Wimbledon Championships – Men's singles or Swimming at the 2020 Summer Olympics – Men's 200 metre backstroke that would likely need to be changed by hand. There is also talk of removing the ndash completely.

Perhaps this is what sports projects want and perhaps not. Either way I certainly don't want projects ill-informed as the last RfC was handled. Express your thoughts at the following rfc. Fyunck(click) (talk) 20:40, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

NCAA in infoboxes

Hello, community! I come as a fairly new member, although have been an editor for quite some time with other projects. I've embarked on updating information regarding US MAG and associated biographies and noticed an inconsistency with "consensus" and what's actually occurring and hope to seek guidance on this topic.

I have started with generally older US MAG athlete profiles (Olympics, mainly, up until the mid-1950's). These biographies generally do not align with NCAA records and championships, but I've now started to encounter some for which that's applicable (e.g. Ray Sorensen, Joe Kotys, Bill Roetzheim, Jack Beckner, etc.). To ensure I aligned with consensus, I thought reviewing popular, recent gymnast pages would lead me to what's commonly accepted. After seeing similar athlete histories on both American female (Jade Carey, Kayla DiCello, Jordan Chiles, Sunisa Lee, Grace McCallum, Madison Kocian, etc.) and male (Brody Malone, Sam Mikulak, Yul Moldauer, Shane Wiskus, etc.) profiles/pages, I set off to complete older biographies in the same manner.

My first speed bump was with William Bonsall. 1948 Olympian and 1948 NCAA team champion. Similar to the profiles above, I added in his NCAA Championship to his infobox with the Penn State logo, which was immediately removed via bot. I sought guidance on infobox from project member @Mypurplelightsaber: via talk page. After doing some digging, it appears there may be consensus within the Project via this and this that NCAA placements shouldn't be included at all?

I say all that to ask: what are we doing here and how do we proceed forward?

tl;dr:

• Some of the most high-profile, American gymnasts with collegiate backgrounds currently have collegiate information/medals/placements in their infoboxes, which seems to be against what's been established by the Project as consensus.

• If in practice we are now putting NCAA placements in infoboxes, do these also include the collegiate logos? Each example I noted above had them, however when I tried to mimic it was immediately removed.

I seek guidance from this group as a new member of this project so I can continue to create accordingly. GauchoDude (talk) 19:39, 28 November 2023 (UTC)

One reason I say to include NCAA Championships is that NCAA gymnasts popularity is rapidly growing (at least in the United States). Many NCAA gymnasts are getting their own wikipedia pages (and I'm talking about those who are only known for their NCAA careers and either were never elite-level gymnasts or were only at the elite level briefly that they really never got an international experience – Katelyn Ohashi, Alex McMurtry, Maile O'Keefe, Haleigh Bryant, Natalie Wojcik, Sierra Brooks, Lexy Ramler, Anastasia Webb for example). They are very accomplished (at least at the NCAA level) and their pages should reflect this. However, I can see how people would think that the elite-level gymnasts (like Jade, Suni, Jordan, etc) shouldn't have these medals because there are much more high-level meets that they can get medals for and the NCAA Champs are not that prestigious in comparison. Mypurplelightsaber (talk) 13:46, 29 November 2023 (UTC)

I tend to agree. With the examples you've provided above, they clearly meet WP:GNG and thus warrant inclusion in Wikipedia. Furthermore, all of these examples are notable because they are gymnasts. As such, their gymnastic accomplishments should be reflected since "...the purpose of an infobox: to summarize (and not supplant) key facts that appear in the article..." per MOS:INFOBOXPURPOSE. GauchoDude (talk) 18:38, 29 November 2023 (UTC)

I've been thinking about this a lot with the Olympics that were just held as well as the NCAA's place in it. Established precedent seems to be not including NCAA information in infoboxes. I previously, having worked heavily on men's NCAA articles, had reservations. I now believe that if someone with NCAA experience has other, more important, notable results (Olympics, Worlds, continental championships, etc.) the NCAA should not be used following the guidance given at MOS:INFOBOXPURPOSE. However if NCAA is primarily where the subject is known from, e.g. the examples provided above by @Mypurplelightsaber:, then utilizing NCAA placements is appropriate. GauchoDude (talk) 13:40, 15 August 2024 (UTC)

Inclusion of "Remaining Placings"?

I've noticed that several articles about Olympic all around competitions include a section called Remaining Placings. I am of the opinion that these are unnecessary since this is covered in the qualifications page and the lists include athletes who didn't compete on all appartuses during qualifications. Before changing the articles, I thought I would get the opinion of the rest of the gymnastics project.

For reference:

Gymnastics at the 2004 Summer Olympics – Women's artistic individual all-around - Wikipedia

Gymnastics at the 2000 Summer Olympics – Women's artistic individual all-around - Wikipedia

Gymnastics at the 2008 Summer Olympics – Women's artistic individual all-around - Wikipedia

~~~ Afheather (talk) 17:03, 17 July 2024 (UTC)

I am fine with these sections being removed. I'm assuming part of the reason why they're there is to show who was 2/3-per-countried out of the final, but this can be achieved by showing qualification results up to the final reserve instead of showing the placement of every single gymnast (e.g. Gymnastics at the 2020 Summer Olympics – Women's artistic individual all-around) Thanks, -Riley1012 (talk) 17:13, 17 July 2024 (UTC)

I could go either way as I don't have a strong opinion. I do tend to lean toward your opinion, though, as the information is already covered in the qualifications section and those participants did not make the individual all-around. Additionally, it looks like for other events (balance beam, uneven bars, etc.) they also don't include "Remaining Placings" so it would be bringing the all around section in line with the others. GauchoDude (talk) 17:34, 17 July 2024 (UTC)