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Article promoted by Sturmvogel 66 (talk) via MilHistBot (talk) 23:20, 1 February 2019 (UTC) « Return to A-Class review list[reply]

Michael Collins (astronaut)

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Instructions for nominators and reviewers

Nominator(s): Hawkeye7 (talk) and Kees08 (talk)

Michael Collins (astronaut) (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

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In the wake of Neil and Buzz, here is the third astronaut on the Apollo 11 mission, USAF Lieutenant Colonel Michael Collins. He comes from a notable family; his father, uncle, brother and daughter all have articles too. There was some hope of getting it through FAC by the time of the Apollo 11 mission in July 1969, but that is fading now, as time is running short. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 20:57, 20 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Lingzhi

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Comments by AustralianRupert

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Support: G'day, Hawkeye and Kees, thanks for your efforts with this article. I have a few comments/suggestions: AustralianRupert (talk) 04:29, 5 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Wehwalt

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  • "in which he and Command Pilot John Young performed two rendezvous with different spacecraft " I had never thought about the plural of rendezvous. Maybe avoid the issue " ... Young rendezvoused with two different spacecraft"
    checkY My knowledge of foreign languages works against me again. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 20:48, 10 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • "He unsuccessfully applied for the second astronaut group, but was accepted for the third group." I might cut the final word.
     Done Hawkeye7 (discuss) 20:48, 10 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • "In 1980, he took the job as vice president of LTV Aerospace." I might say "" rather than "the".
     Done I would normally use "became", but it is used a couple of times in the paragraph already. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 20:48, 10 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • "He graduated on June 3, 1952, with a Bachelor of Science degree, finishing 185th out of 527 cadets in the class 1952, the same class as fellow astronaut Ed White.[3][11]" you probably want a "of" before the second use of "1952".
    checkY Corrected. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 20:48, 10 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Compared with the first two groups of astronauts, the third group of fourteen astronauts of which Collins was part were younger, with an average age of 31" group would take a singular verb, I suppose, so "were" should be "was" (also later in sentence) Speaking of sentences, this one could use some splitting, possibly even into three parts.
    checkY Corrected. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 20:48, 10 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Of the thirty astronauts selected in the first three groups, only Collins and his third group colleague William Anders were born outside the United States,[30][31] and Collins was the only one with an older brother; all the rest were the eldest or only sons in their families.[32]" Especially the first part, this seems trivial or possibly better in one of our articles as astronauts as a group.
    It will, but someone wrote a whole book on the advantage of being the oldest son in the family. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 20:48, 10 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • The final sentence of the first paragraph of Crew Assignments makes him sound a little petty.
    checkY Tweaked the wording. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 20:48, 10 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Under the system of crew assignment," maybe call it crew rotation, and mention it was done by Slayton?
     Done Hawkeye7 (discuss) 20:48, 10 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • "but stood up through the hatch with a device that resembled a sextant.[53]" you said that he erred with a sextant earlier, was this the same device?
    Good question. Kees08 may know. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 00:21, 11 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    I started to check, but the page numbers in my book (published in 2001) did not seem to match the page numbers in the article. Do they match a different version that you might own? I was hesitant to 'fix' them if the year just needs changed instead of the page number. I will look into this still. Kees08 (Talk) 03:31, 11 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    Reichl? I don't have that book. Adjust the references to match your copy. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 08:49, 11 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    Sorry, I meant Collins book Carrying the Fire. You have the 1994 edition right? The page numbers do not match my 2001 edition. Kees08 (Talk) 16:23, 11 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    No, I have the 2001 edition. The pages match exactly. But the stuff about the sextant is is Reichl. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 21:08, 12 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    checkY I've corrected the reference page number. Let me know if there are any others that don't check out. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 02:41, 13 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    @Wehwalt: I know you already supported, but I found the issue and corrected it. He was using an ultraviolet camera. Thanks for pointing it out. Kees08 (Talk) 01:54, 13 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    @Hawkeye7: Sure, why don't I just ping everyone! I added a citation to On the Shoulders of Giants and I am not sure I did it right..is there a good way to use sfn and have a direct link to the page that is hosted on the internet? Kees08 (Talk) 02:09, 13 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    @Kees08: Yes, {{sfn|Author|date|p=[http://url #]}} buidhe 19:43, 24 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • "The policy became that the CMP would be the next most senior member of the crew, and that they would go on to command later Apollo flights.[62]" I don't know that the rotation was policy, Slayton didn't explain stuff much. The CMPs on Apollos 8, 9 and 10 did go on to command their own missions. Maybe instead of policy, practice? Or maybe just omit as you go through all of this at some length during the description of Collins's training for Apollo 11. It was certainly policy that the CMP was second-highest ranking, though.
     Done This senior astronaut as CMP held for Apollo 8 to 12, with the astronauts of the 1959, 1962 and 1963 classes. Those of the 1966 class specialised as CMP or LMP during their training, which determined their assignments. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 20:48, 10 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • " The astronauts' wives had accompanied them on the trip, and Collins and his wife Pat were compelled by NASA and their friends to travel to Metz where they had been married ten years before. There, they found a third wedding ceremony had been arranged for them (ten years previously they had already had civil and religious ceremonies).[64]" I don't quite understand this. Was this a renewal of vows or the space age equivalent of a shotgun wedding?
    Added that. It is normal to have two ceremonies in France, as that country has strict separation of Church and state. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 20:48, 10 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • " was designated commander of the cancelled Apollo 18 mission." was this ever made formal?
    Yes. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 21:24, 10 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • ".[75][62][76]" just noting not in sequence.
    checkY Mumble mumble. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 21:24, 10 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • "An estimated one million spectators watched the launch of Apollo 11 from the highways and beaches vicinity of the launch site. " You probably need an "in the" before "vicinity".
    checkY Corrected. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 21:24, 10 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • " Launch Complex 39" Why not narrow it to 39A?
    checkY Sure. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 21:24, 10 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • "About 30 minutes later, the transposition, docking, and extraction maneuver was performed: this involved separating Columbia from the spent S-IVB stage, turning around, and docking with Eagle." I would mention this was done by Collins, as I think I asked on the 11 article.
    checkY Added. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 21:24, 10 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • I might mention what Collins was doing when Eagle landed, and when Armstrong stepped upon the Moon.
    checkY Added text from Apollo 11 article. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 21:24, 10 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Though the chance of bringing back pathogens from the lunar surface was considered remote, it was still a possibility. " I might stress that that it wasn't possible, just considered one.
    checkY Added. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 21:24, 10 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • I might say when the quarantine ended. More about Collins as individual on the return to Earth/reception etc. if possible.
    I've greatly expanded the Post-NASA section. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 21:24, 10 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • "and flown to the aircraft carrier USS Hornet,[92] where they spent the Earth-based portion of 21 days of quarantine.[93]" They spent the whole time in quarantine on the Hornet? That is the implication and of course we know they did not.
    checkY Corrected. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 21:24, 10 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • "He worked in that role until April 11, 1971.[103] Carol Laise replaced him in October 1973.[104][105]" Even for government, that's a long time between incumbents. Was Laise simply the next person to have a position called that? And that raises the question, was Collins's job really necessary?
    Yes, his was an important job. The job was vacant for a long time. I thought that was normal in the US. Hundreds of positions have been vacant for two years or more. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 21:24, 10 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • While I find the information about the history of Air and Space interesting, is it really needed in the article on Collins?
    I'll trim it down, and see if I can dig up some more material on its construction. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 21:24, 10 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    checkY Trimmed. Added a bit more about the construction. Somebody should write a book about this. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 03:20, 19 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • You are not consistent in date formatting between MDY and DMY.
  • Support I think it meets the FA criteria which I understand to be very similar to the A class ones. I realize there's one point unanswered but I don't want to hold things up.--Wehwalt (talk) 00:08, 11 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Image review

Parsecboy (talk) 17:54, 24 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Source review — pass

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  • Is the author-link to George W. Cullum correct? It seems unlikely that a Civil War general would still be around to publish a book in 1960.
    I've been waiting for years for someone to ask that question. Yes, that it him. He wrote the first three volumes of the book, and then they continued publishing updates every decade. He is listed as the author in the sources, bibliographies and library catalogues, so we follow suit, as the idea is to allow readers to locate the books for themselves, and that is how they are filed. Volumes up to volume IX are PD and available online. After that, responsibility was handed over the West Point Alumni Association, and they become very rare. I have a copy of volume X. Up until 1977, each member of a West Point class was listed in order of merit, and had a what is called a Cullum number. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 20:43, 24 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • Formatting of sources is reasonably consistent.
  • All sources look reliable. Use of primary sources is not excessive and well within WP:PRIMARY.
  • The article seems comprehensive and I'm not seeing any major sources that were overlooked. buidhe 19:40, 24 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    Thanks for the review. Much appreciated. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 20:43, 24 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Support Comments by JennyOz

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placeholder, part way through, expect to finish tonight or tomorrow JennyOz (talk) 04:49, 25 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Here's the gnome comments, suggestions:

That's all folks. Another bites the dust, only he didn't. (I recorded a doco on Armstrong recently, yet to finish but found it very interesting that his brother asked him (before they launched) what was the one thing he was most unsure of and Neil said 'how deep is that dust'. JennyOz (talk) 08:57, 28 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Before launch, the astronauts wrote letters to their wives and children to be given to them if they did not return. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 02:19, 29 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Mike is still alive, and looking forward to celbrating the 50th anniversary with Buzz. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 07:04, 29 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@JennyOz: I believe we are ready for you to see if we satisfied all your requests. Thanks for taking the time to thoroughly review! Kees08 (Talk) 07:07, 29 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you Hawkeye and Kees. That was great watching you both so ably dealing with my comments today. Thanks especially for the explanations (and giggles). I've added 2 tiny replies above but neither are a concern so am also signing my support. Great job! JennyOz (talk) 07:58, 29 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
I am convinced Hawkeye never sleeps, so I have to act fast if I want to respond to any comments :). Thanks for the review (and all the others) and replies! Kees08 (Talk) 02:54, 31 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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