Wikipedia:Peer review/Flag of Mexico/archive1

Flag of Mexico

The article was edited a lot by me, and with great thanks to User:Titoxd, we have been able to get this accomplished so far: [1]. Most of the images on the article are in the public domain since either I created them, the Mexican Government created them or they were donated to us by my friend, Juan Manuel Gabino Villascan of FOTW. I know there could be small details I am missing but any help from y'all will be very greatful. Zach ^{(Smack Back)} 04:28, 29 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Needs some copy editing. Was the shield charge adopted for the express purpose to distinguish it from Italy or did it just happen to come out that way. "An eagle sitting on top of a cactus, which is sitting on top of a rock" - this is weird in English. --Pyroclastic 04:47, 29 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- From what I read so far, the coincidence between the Mexican flag and the Italian flag are just that, coincidences. For many years, the Italian flag was charged with the Arms of Savory and the Mexican flag had it's arms in the center. When Italy ditched the arms from it's flag in 1946 or 1947, the Mexican flag still had it's arms on the flag. However, the last time the flag changed took place when Mexico was hosting the 1968 Olympic Games in Mexico City. Zach ^{(Smack Back)} 04:55, 29 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- How's this: "However, the coat of arms still had the same feature: an eagle, that is holding a serpent in his talon, is perched on top of a cactus; the cactus is situated on a rock that rises above a lake." Zach ^{(Smack Back)} 05:01, 29 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]
For me it is just too short. History section could be much longer (you had 4 versions of the flag, right? so you could spend quite some time describing everyone of them in great detail). Renata3 20:19, 29 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- The 4th version of the flag is the current one, but I added the story about it being created for the Olympics. I added more about the other flags. Zach ^{(Smack Back)} 07:47, 30 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Images coming from the Mexican government are terminantly not in the public domain by default. I can show you the relevant piece of legistlation if you want. Be careful on how you tag your images. -- Rune Welsh | ταλκ | Esperanza 17:30, 30 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- I removed the photo from the Chamber of Deputies, but the other photo with the lady doing the civil salute, that was placed in the public domain by the Press Office of the Mexican President and there is an email, in Spanish, stating that. Thank you. Zach ^{(Smack Back)} 20:01, 30 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]
  - I'm aware of that (I have uploaded images from there myself) I was refering to the Chamber of Deputies image only. You're welcome :-D -- Rune Welsh | ταλκ | Esperanza 20:06, 30 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- Now that I read the article I can offer the following input:
  1. The reason why the Arms are located in the white band has little to do (if at all) with the Italian flag. The flag without Arms was an ocean ensign and rarely used in the mainland. The second sentence of the lead should be rephrased to something like "it is different from the Italian flag by having..." or similar. The Arms have always been in the Mexican flag since it adopted the vertical stripes, so there was little possibility for confusion with the Italian flag during the '68 Olympics even if the redesign hadn't taken place.
  2. Bear in mind that the official color definitions of the Italian flag may be different (e.g. they could be using a slightly different tone of green).
  3. It needs some general copyediting to remove idioms and some ackward phrasing.
  4. I'd research this Francisco Eppens Helguera guy and at least get a stub on him. His redesign is notable enough to make him deserve an article.
  5. You should use footnotes when quoting large chunks of text directly (e.g. when quoting the text of the law, you should cite the date of the latest revision).
  6. Sometime in the 90s there was a controversy about political parties using the colors of the flag in their logos (neutrality and all that). As a consequence the PRD switched to its "aztec sun" logo, but PRI stayed the same. That should be in the article.
  7. There is another bandera monumental in the Campo Militar Marte (behind Los Pinos). That's where all visiting Heads of State get their official welcome.
  8. While we are at it would be nice if you could find the "actual" locations of all banderas monumentales, this would make the article look more complete.
  9. Are you sure that's all the info you can find on the history of each flag?
  10. It would be nice if you could provide a description of the flag according to heraldry.
  11. I think you should list the days the flag is flown at full and half mast.
  12. I'm not certain about "During the playing of the national anthem on television, graphics or video of the flag must be shown." For instance, on 1st division soccer matches they don't tend to show the flag while the anthem is played.
  13. Historians tend consider Hidalgo's standard and other standards used during the war of independence precedents to the current national flag. A mention of those in the article wouldn't be out of place.
  14. If you can read Spanish, I'd suggest you to get hold of "La bandera mexicana: breve historia de su formacion y simbolismo" by Enrique Florescano (1998). México, D.F. : Fondo de Cultura Económica. ISBN 9681653300
  15. In addition you could read [2].
- Hope this helps. -- Rune Welsh | ταλκ | Esperanza 19:42, 30 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]
  - Yes, it does, a lot. One comment so far: at Article 41 of the National Symbols law, that the national anthem is played at the opening and closing of radio programming and "in the case of television programing, the national flag will be displayed at the same time." Zach ^{(Smack Back)} 20:28, 30 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]
    - I also put the information about the Italian flag in, as you suggested, but it was taken out by others and I was told not to place it back in. Zach ^{(Smack Back)} 21:20, 30 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]
      - Thanks for the correction, I wasn't sure of that one myself. -- Rune Welsh | ταλκ | Esperanza 22:58, 30 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]
        Your welcome. There is still some information I need to add and I did create the stub article you wanted me to make. The guy who designed the arms is pretty famous for his artwork and it still can be seen at schools like UNAM . I still need to add some citations, but I think I met roughly 1/3rd of what you wished for me to do, which is pretty good in one day. I will try to get the book, though I am es-0 (I am a vexillologist by hobby and trade). Zach ^{(Smack Back)} 23:10, 30 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]
        For the heraldic term, this looked silly to me: "Party per pale Vert and Gules on a pale Argent a "Escudo Nacional Mexicano."" I removed it since this is not official and well...looked silly. Zach ^{(Smack Back)} 02:57, 31 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]
        About the flag flying days, what I have done is created a separate article to list all of the days there. I mainly did that since I do not want to make the article list heavy. I also pointed to the law that people can find the dates at too. I am willing to do the same thing for the giant flags, since I do not want the article to appear list heavy again. Zach ^{(Smack Back)} 11:32, 31 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]