Wikipedia:Peer review/Billy (Black Christmas)/archive1

Billy (Black Christmas)

I've listed this article for peer review because… I have just finished some major edits to get the article up for an FA nomination. As such I need a fresh set of eyes that can review this for anything that might hinder that process or anything that the article needs work on.

Thanks, Paleface Jack (talk) 18:34, 4 August 2021 (UTC)

STANDARD NOTE: I have added this PR to the Template:FAC peer review sidebar to get quicker and more responses. When this PR is closed, please remove it from the list. Also, consider adding the sidebar to your userpage to help others discover pre-FAC PRs, and please review other articles in that template. Thanks! Z1720 (talk) 17:14, 16 August 2021 (UTC)

Comments by Z1720

Hi Paleface Jack (talk · contribs), I am sorry that it has taken so long for someone to review this article. My best advice is to start reviewing WP:FACs right now: reviewing helps editors understand the intricacies of the FAC criteria and Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. It also builds goodwill among FAC reviewers and demonstrates that you read and understood the FA criteria before nominating your article. I see that you have reviewed some articles in 2017 and 2019, so I hope you will continue reviewing this year.

If you want more comments on this PR, I recommend advertising it at various Wikiprojects or with editors who have worked on similar articles. You can also get an FA mentor who can help guide you through the FA process. Since this is a PR, it will not be considered canvassing to contact specific editors. Here are some comments about this article, from a non-expert:

• The infobox image doesn't really show the character. Is there a better image?

The article explains that the character is not really shown in detail this image is the most iconic and best except for a silhouette of him. The shot of the eye is more attention grabbing than the shadow.--Paleface Jack (talk) 16:32, 22 October 2021 (UTC)

• "as well as a series of real murders in Montreal during the holiday season." Is there a specific year this happened?
• "and director Clark himself portrays both the villain's shadow and the phone voices. " delete himself
• "portrayer(s)" -> portrayers, since multiple people did play him.
• "In the subsequent years following the original film's release," Delete subsequent
• "in later interviews." Delete later
• "Billy has subsequently been identified by" delete subsequently
• "and has been referenced in several other entertainment media." Delete several.
• "Billy" Delete the quotes, the lede has established that his name is Billy so these aren't needed.
• "with further contributions to the character by Bob Clark and Timothy Bond" is this Timothy Bond? If so, wikilink.
• "the basic storyline tells of a young woman babysitting three children is tormented by a madman who leaves threatening phone calls," -> the basic storyline describes a young woman who, while babysitting three children, is tormented by a madman who leaves threatening phone calls.
• "The legend would also be the basis for various other films including" Delete various
• "Clark and Bond would further develop both the story and the character in subsequent rewrites of Moore's completed first draft," -> Moore completed an initial draft of the film entitled Stop Me. Clark and Bond developed the story and character in rewrites of the script.
• "Moore's completed first draft,[11][10]" refs should be in numerical order
• "Clark himself was adamant that" Delete himself as redundant.
• " so as to toy with the audience's perception" -> to distort the audience's perception
• " Clark also admitted that he intentionally played upon the mystery of the character's identity," Clark intentionally played upon the mystery of the character's identity
• "Clark however, was able to convince the studio to retain the original ending," -> Clark convinced the studio to retain the original ending
• "Billy's enigmatic nature was subsequently abandoned in favor of a more physical presence in Glen Morgan's 2006 remake." -> In Glen Morgan's 2006 remake, Billy's enigmatic nature was abandoned for a greater physical presence.
• "wanted to reveal more about Billy's character and that of Agnes" -> wanted to reveal a greater number of Billy's character traits
• "Morgan thus created an extensive subplot delving into Billy's origins[24] and introducing his younger sister Agnes as the secondary antagonist." -> Morgan created a subplot exploring Billy's origins and introduced his younger sister Agnes as the secondary antagonist.
• "Several of the original film's cast members, including Clark himself have" -> Several of the original film's cast members, including Clark, have
• " Point-of-view shots of the character were done by Clark himself," -> Point-of-view shots of the charcater were performed by Clark,
• "The scene, shot from Billy's point of view, where Billy scales the house and enters the attic was done by Dunk using a custom-made camera rig attached to his shoulder" -> The scene shot from Billy's point of view, where Billy scales the house and enters the attic, was done by Dunk using a custom-made camera rig attached to his shoulder"
• "In the 2002 documentary Black Christmas Revisited which was included in " comma after Revisited
• "recalling the experience as being very "avant-garde"," Delete very
• "As one critic wrote, "Lacking a distinct" Which critic? Name them.
• "Olivier would go on to note that the phone in which Billy utilizes, is not only an extension of the character, but also represents what he called" -> Olivier noted that the phone Billy uses is an extension of the character and represents what he called

• "felt that rather than a supernatural force, Billy had a "naturalistic basis" rather than a supernatural one," -> felt that Billy had a "naturalistic basis" rather than a supernatural one
• ""it "obfuscate[s] his identity and provide the eerie schizophrenic rantings he has between several of his characters." Quotation marks need to be fixed.
• "Searles went on to note that Billy's dialogue" -> Searles also noted that Billy's dialogue
• "in their presence. [30]" Remove the space between punctuation and the reference.
• "Hannah Shaw-Williams pointed out Clark's" Who is this? What are their credentials?

Notable film journalist.--Paleface Jack (talk) 16:32, 22 October 2021 (UTC)

Her credentials should be added to the article, perhaps as "Film journalist Hannah Shaw-Williams" Z1720 (talk) 16:36, 22 October 2021 (UTC)

• "But leaving Billy's true identity," Replace but with by
• "Morgan's reworking of the character added a more detailed backstory, revealing" -> The remake revealed... The previous sentence already tells the reader that the character was reworked for the 2006 remake.
• "felt that Billy's abuse at the hands of his mother had created a long-suppressed" Delete had
• "They have also noted that" Delete have
• " utilized in countless other slasher films and characters." Delete countless, or replace with many
• ", with financing from crowd-funding website Indiegogo." I don't think this is necessary in this article and can be deleted.
• "Billy was voiced by writer-director, and voice actor Dave McRae" -> Billy was voiced by McRae, as you already introduced this person in the previous sentences.
• What makes "Shiman, Jennifer (August 30, 2013)" a high quality source?

Shiman is an entertainer and entrepreneur. The reason her source is noteworthy is she is referenced in several other works that have been mentioned in major publications including Sony Corporations online news publication and won the 2008 Webby Awards for her work.--Paleface Jack (talk) 16:32, 22 October 2021 (UTC)

• "Packer & Pennington 2014, pp. 38." should just be p.
• "Thrower, Stephen (2007)." ISBN for this ref needs hyphens, since the other refs have hyphens.
• Why are the sources in Further reading not used as references?

Unable to acquire the sources and they just provide minor additional information.--Paleface Jack (talk) 16:32, 22 October 2021 (UTC)

• Do not use fixed pixel size for images.
• All images need alt text per MOS:ALT

Please ping when complete and I will take another look. Z1720 (talk) 18:37, 16 October 2021 (UTC)

@Z1720:Edits have been completed with questions addressed here.--Paleface Jack (talk) 16:45, 22 October 2021 (UTC)

Additional comments:

• " accidentally bludgeons her boyfriend Peter (Keir Dullea) to death," Is this Keir Dullea? If so, please wikilink
• "due to liver disease, and although his father loves him, he is physically and emotionally abused as a child by his mother, Constance (Karin Konoval)." I am not sure that "although his father loves him" is necessary in this sentence.
• "Billy was originally created by Roy Moore," delete originally
• "creating the allusion that Claire's boyfriend Chris was in fact Billy, only to reveal in the film's conclusion as a red herring," -> "creating the allusion that Claire's boyfriend Chris was Billy, and revealing in the film's conclusion that this was a red herring,"
• " As one critic wrote, "Lacking a distinct form or personality, Billy's really anything you want him to be."" name the critic in the article text.
• The Characterization section has lots of "A says B" formatting, especially in paragraphs 2 and 3. WP:RECEPTION has some tips on how to avoid this.

I suggest asking editors who have created articles on fictional works or media to comment on this FAC. I also suggest going to WP:FAM to get a mentor. The advantage of PRs is that it is not considered canvassing to get editors to comment here, since the article cannot be promoted to FAC from a PR. Take advantage of that and try to get other editors to comment here, since this type of article is not my specialty. Z1720 (talk) 16:57, 31 October 2021 (UTC)

• @Paleface Jack: to ensure that they saw these comments. Z1720 (talk) 14:35, 16 November 2021 (UTC)

Closing note: I am closing this PR due to inactivity. Paleface Jack or another editor can open a new PR once the above are addressed. Z1720 (talk) 15:24, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.