Wikipedia:Good article reassessment/Green/1

Green

Article (edit | visual edit | history) · Article talk (edit | history) · Watch • Watch article reassessment page • GAN review not found

Result: Delisting. There are still problems with focus and prose and need for additional reliable citations.StoryKai (talk) 22:19, 12 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not convinced that this is a reliable article. Some of the sections have missing citations, and the writing at times comes off as an essay:

"All the colors you see on your computer screen are made by mixing them in different intensities." "Unfortunately for those who wanted or were required to wear green..." "Green laser pointers outputting at 532 nm (563.5 THz) are relatively inexpensive..." "although the price remains relatively prohibitive for widespread public use." "Green animals include, especially, amphibians, reptiles, and some fish, birds and insects."

Just to name a few. 100cellsman (talk) 20:06, 19 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Weak delist. Most of the quoted sentences given by 100cellsman have since been fixed. The only one that remains is the one on laser pointers, which looks encyclopedic enough to me. However, I do see a few different issues:

The § In nature and culture section is just bizarre, being an image gallery with no context.
The § On flags section is a bit of a mess. The gallery is probably too big. The bulleted list repeats a lot of information in the image captions above.
The one source I happened to check (http://www.ukfoodguide.net/e142.htm) was quite dodgy.
Some general concerns regarding "staying focused on the topic without going into unnecessary detail". At certain points, the article seems to veer into the territory of just listing things which happen to be green. Okay, sure, billiards tables are green. Dragons are sometimes green. Roman Catholic clergy wear green on some occasions. One of the belts used to show rank in Judo is green... where does it end? Are these facts essential to me understanding the topic of green-ness? It's worth noting that when the article was listed as a GA in 2007 it was a lot shorter - it's now about 4x longer than it was then.

For these reasons, I'd say the article isn't currently up to GA standards. That said, I think fixing the current issues would not be too difficult, and would mostly entail making a few cuts. Colin M (talk) 22:06, 19 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Comment The in nature and culture is quite strange. Considering the level of green in plants I would have though this would be an important section. There is a decent mention of this under biology though. I am guessing it is mistitled and was probably just an excuse to add lots of pictures. I will remove it for now as I don't think it adds much (there are a lot of pictures of green things anyway). AIRcorn (talk) 20:46, 21 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
- It was undone by SiefkinDR. I tagged it as it basically lacks context. Still obviously a delist per below. AIRcorn (talk) 19:48, 24 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Delist There is a lot of uncited material and the bulleted lists would work better as prose. Agree on lack of focus - why do we need to mention that the Australian Greens won 10% of the vote in 2016? It really needs a decent amount of work to get up to standard. AIRcorn (talk) 20:55, 21 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Comment - this was the version that passed GA, with editor Wrad doing the heavy lifting and nominating IIRC. SiefkinDR has edited this and other colour articles since. I recommend comparing the promoted with the current version. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 09:42, 27 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@100cellsman, Aircorn, and Colin M: this GAR is an opportunity for 3rd, 4th and 5th opinions on some issues. SiefkinDR and I have had some on and off discussions since 2012 about various aspects of this article. In the interests of leaving it in the best condition, looking at the promoted and current versions would be good to see what hybrid version leaves it in the best shape. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 09:57, 27 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I am not so sure that is the best use of reassessment. These tend to stay open too long as it is. Also there is a major issue of participation at this part of the project. I can think of only one other editor who regularly comments here and they haven't for a while. I think expecting a 4th or 5th opinion not coming here via the article itself is probably optimistic.

The promoted version is from 12 years ago and while it is a nice compact article I don't think it is feasible to use it for anything more than a historical reference. It is quite possible for an article to be improved from a Good standard and also fail the Good criteria. "WP:Good articles" and "good articles" are often separate. For example useful information could be added, but not cited - causing it to fail the verification criteria - yet that information might make the article more informative.

Colin has already started a discussion at the talk page and I will head over there next to give my 2 cents worth. That is probably the best place to work on ingrained discussions. Also it looks like a lot of the issues are across all colour articles so it might require a RFC or something a bit bigger than what GAR was designed or is capable of handling. AIRcorn (talk) 20:30, 27 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Agree this is a valid point. I have been a fan of the GA and FA process as acting like a Stable Version of sorts, and something that can be referred back to. In an ideal world, this would be a venue to roll up wikisleeves and fix now, but some articles are more complex and/or part of a more complex issue. And hence if the consensus is the article falls way short, then the most appropriate route is to delist for now. it can always be improved later. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 04:02, 28 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]