Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/1994 College Baseball All-America Team/archive1

The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was promoted by The Rambling Man 17:52, 6 December 2010 [1].

1994 College Baseball All-America Team

Featured list candidates/1994 College Baseball All-America Team/archive1

Nominator(s): TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 18:09, 8 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I am nominating this for featured list because it is of similar caliber to the 1991 and 1992 FLs and the 1993 FLC that seems likely to be promoted. TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 18:09, 8 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

P.S. I am competing in the WP:CUP and hope this nomination can be closed by the end of the month.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 18:36, 8 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Comment—no dab links, no dead external links. Ucucha 23:05, 8 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved comments from The Rambling Man (talk) 16:30, 19 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Comments

Image caption should comply with WP:MOS so "four no-hitters" and prose should be used, so "two-time" rather than "2x".
- Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 22:00, 18 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"team" is mentioned three times in the first sentence.
- Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 21:15, 18 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"A total of 5 players " - five.
- Thanks.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 21:15, 18 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"unanmous" typo.
- Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 21:28, 18 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"The team included four future Major League Baseball All-Stars Garciaparra is a two-time American League batting champion" grammar..
- Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 21:28, 18 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"All-star" or "All-Star"?
- Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 21:37, 18 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"per 9 innings pitched" nine.
- Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 21:34, 18 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"Cruz, who won a Gold Glove in 2003 in the National League, has led the National League in putouts as a rightfielder (2003) and the American League in putouts as a centerfielder (2000), but has also led the American League in errors committed as a rightfielder (2004)" - repeats of National League and American League make this sentence poor.
- I have abbreviated the leagues.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 21:58, 18 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Don't use "x" as a multiplier. Look at recently promoted discographies where they use another character similar to x to make the point.
- Fixed on all four (1991-1994) lists.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 21:44, 18 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Retrieve dates (in fact, all dates in references) should be in the same format.

The Rambling Man (talk) 18:21, 18 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

- Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 21:51, 18 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved comments from Giants2008 (27 and counting) 22:12, 22 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Comments –

No need for two Jay Payton links in Accomplishments.
- O.K.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 23:58, 20 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
In parentheses: "when he led the NL in wins with 22 and winning percentage .846". Don't think the last part works grammatically. How about "and a winning percentage of .846."?
- Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 00:09, 21 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
De-capitalize Home Runs in the sentence following the above.
- Done.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 23:58, 20 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"He accumulated over 1100 hits and 200 home runs." Comma needed for the hit total, I believe. Giants2008 (27 and counting) 23:18, 20 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
- Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 00:01, 21 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Support – For the second comment I made up there, when I saw the fix on the page I didn't think it was the improvement I originally believed, so I tweaked it further (basically the old text plus some parentheses). Sorry about that. Anyway, everything looks fine to me now. Giants2008 (27 and counting) 22:12, 22 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved comments from Courcelles 17:08, 25 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

*Comments

"As of 2010 Jason Varitek, R. A. Dickey, Mike Hampton, and Jay Payton remained active." Sentence fragment, and active where, exactly? (I know you mean MLB, but needs to be clearer).

Fixed, I think.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 17:05, 25 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Adding what you did fixed everything. Courcelles 17:08, 25 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

"~~A total of~~ five players were selected by all three"

Done.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 17:05, 25 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Courcelles 16:55, 25 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Support Courcelles 17:08, 25 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved comments from Good raise 00:00, 9 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose

"Although the honorees generally do not compete together as a unit" - Italicized part appears to be redundant. (Won't mind if you keep this.)
- O.K. and fixed for 91-93 as well.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 03:40, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"As of 2010 Jason Varitek, R. A. Dickey, Mike Hampton, and Jay Payton remained active in Major League Baseball." - Maybe I'm wrong, but I'd put a comma after 2010.
- Done.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 03:40, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"As of 2010 Jason Varitek, R. A. Dickey, Mike Hampton, and Jay Payton remained active in Major League Baseball." - Use present tense.
- Done.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 03:40, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"The team included four future Major League Baseball All-Stars." - You may want to mention their names in this sentence. Perhaps along the lines of "With A, B, C, and D, the team included four future..."
- Done.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 03:40, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"Varitek is a three-time All-Star (2003, 2005 & 2008)" - Don't use an ampersand here. See WP:&.
- Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 03:45, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Serial comma usage is inconsistent.
- Fixed, I think.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 04:45, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"Hampton is a two-time All-Star (1999 and 2001), Gold Glove-winner, and five-time Silver Slugger-winner" - The and is a bit premature. The list goes on.
- Thanks.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 03:46, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"(when he led the NL in wins with 22 and winning percentage (.846))" - The inconsistency makes this awkward to read. Put both figures in parentheses or neither.
- Thanks.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 03:49, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"who was a two-time All-Star (2000 and 2004)" - He's not a two-time All-Star anymore then, I take it? Perhaps you mean "who was an All-Star twice (2000 and 2004)".
- Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 03:51, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"was the 2002 Lou Gehrig Memorial Award winner." - The tenses again. He still is the 2002 Lou Gehrig Memorial Award winner, or is he not?
- Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 03:51, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"He led the NL in putouts as a leftfielder in 2003 and in assists as a centerfielder in 2004" - Adding an in there aids the reader's understanding.
- Thanks.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 03:53, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"but has also led the AL in errors committed as a rightfielder" and "but he has also led the NL in errors as a centerfielder in 2000." - Italicized words can be cut.
- Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 04:11, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
The table would probably look better with the hooks and dashes in the ABCA, BA, and CB columns being centered.
- Thanks. I did it for 1991 and then forgot to do it for 92-94. I have fixed them all.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 04:19, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"POY – Player of the Year" - This key is used only once in the table and only in the notes column (where space isn't limited). Just write it out.
- O.K. But it is now inconsistent with the 1991-93 lists.-TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 04:00, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
- I really think this should be changed back for that reason.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 04:00, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"Major League Baseball number one overall draft pick (1994)" - Source?
- Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 04:07, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"2002 Lou Gehrig Memorial Award winner." - Source?
- Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 03:56, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Several commas missing in the notes column.
- Fixed, I think.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 04:45, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Don't end notes with periods unless they are complete sentences.
- O.K.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 04:28, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Opposing for now. May also have a few more comments regarding the accomplishments section. Good raise 01:30, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

These two are resolved as far as I'm concerned. I'm keeping them uncapped for the time being only so that I can reply to them.

~~"Various organizations selected All-American lists of the best players for the 1994 NCAA Division I college baseball season." - The italicized part is redundant. Isn't it?~~ Good raise 01:30, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
- Although All-Americans and best players are somewhat synonymous, many casual readers would not understand this to be the case. I think it is actually helpful expecially, since there are some specialized All-American lists such as Academic All-American or USILA Scholar All-American where All-American does not necessarily mean best player, but may mean something slightly different. This is strictly a best player selection and clarifying that is not wasteful, IMO.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 04:24, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  - Fair enough. I'd like to note though, that I'm about as "casual" a reader as you're going to get. I'm not living in the US and I have virtually no knowledge of baseball. And seeing as both the page title and the first sentence make it clear that this article is about a team, confusing readers seems unlikely to me. Well, you probably know best. Good raise 06:54, 6 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
~~"He has caught a major league record four no-hitters." - I don't get this. Isn't a no-hitter something you throw (as opposed to something you catch)? Please explain or clarify.~~ Good raise 01:30, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
- The catcher calls the pitches.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 03:45, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  - He "calls" them? OK, I give up. As you apparently know what you're writing about and since the sentence isn't essential to understanding the rest of the article, I'll just let this go. Good raise 06:54, 6 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    - In baseball, the catcher (using a system of hand gestures called signs) tells the pitcher what pitches to throw and in what locations. Courcelles 06:57, 6 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Some more:

~~"MVP" - Unnecessary abbreviation. Please expand it.~~ Good raise 06:54, 6 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
- O.K.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 15:06, 6 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
~~José Cruz, Jr. vs Jose Cruz - Pick one.~~ Good raise 06:54, 6 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
- O.K.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 15:08, 6 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
~~Why is MLB (sometimes) used in the table's notes column, when AL and NL are not?~~ Good raise 06:54, 6 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
- Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 01:41, 8 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
~~"but he also led the AL" - Unnecessary he.~~ Good raise 06:54, 6 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
- O.K.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 19:15, 6 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Not revisited comments from Good raise 03:45, 6 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

*I think the accomplishments section would benefit from some sort of introduction, one or two sentences.

- How is it now?--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 01:51, 8 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  - What do you mean by "accomplished college baseball players" and in what way are they the most so? Good raise 08:52, 10 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    - I have tweaked this with "highly-regarded".--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 00:30, 11 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
The sentence "As of 2010, Jason Varitek, R. A. Dickey, Mike Hampton, and Jay Payton remain active in Major League Baseball" does not really fit into that paragraph. It also strikes me as odd to start the section with this. Intuitively, I would place ongoing developments at the end of the paragraph or section. Moreover, this doesn't appear to be an accomplishment in any sense of the word. How about removing it?
- I have tried to clarify its purpose.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 01:44, 8 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  - Now I understand the purpose of that sentence, but the paragraph as a whole no longer satisfies "professional standards of writing". I'll try to help with that once I understand what you mean by "accomplished college baseball players". Good raise 08:52, 10 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Is there a particular reason why the first column lists the positions? In a list of people, I'd normally expect the first column to contain their names.
- The very first WP:FL I loooked at in response to your query (2007 NFL Draft) has names in the fourth column. I don't think there is any policy regarding this so I am just using the same format as the other three College Baseball FLs.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 15:12, 6 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  - Hardly a good list to compare this one with (draft picks vs team members). The three columns preceding the "player" column have no equivalent in this list. Not to mention that the NFL list places a player's position after his name. As for the other three college baseball FLs... In the absence of a "policy", you'd repeat somebody else's mistake rather than think for yourself? Well, leave it like this, if you must. Good raise 08:52, 10 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    - I opened up three more lists and 2.5 of them did not have names in the first column. (List of Atlanta Falcons first-round draft picks and Major League Baseball All-Star Game Most Valuable Player Award, plus List of Atlanta Falcons head coaches sort of doesn't either) I don't see any reason to move this around and since the change will affect four lists, I am going to leave it.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 13:43, 10 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"Danny Graves, who is a two-time All-Star (2000 and 2004), is the only Vietnamese-born player in MLB history and is the 2002 Lou Gehrig Memorial Award winner." - Might be better to move his place of birth out from in between his baseball achievements, like so: "Danny Graves, who is a two-time All-Star (2000 and 2004) and won the Lou Gehrig Memorial Award in 2002, is the only Vietnamese-born player in MLB history."
- Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 04:09, 9 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
The abbreviation MLB is not being introduced.
- Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 19:13, 6 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  - Should be introduced on first occurrence. Good raise 00:00, 9 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    - O.K.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 00:47, 11 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Seeing as neither Jason Varitek nor Nomar Garciaparra appear in the lead, it would seem appropriate to mention their membership in the team in the captions. You might be able to avoid redundancy by using {{multiple image}}'s footer parameter to make both images use the same caption.
- I think it goes without saying that the subjects of the main images are members of the team and adding the long team name would make long captions longer.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 03:15, 8 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  - Nothing wrong with having longer captions. As far as I'm concerned, they're too short. Neither of them "establishes the picture's relevance to the article" and they also leave unclear why you've chosen these two to be the only ones with pictures. For example, why is there no picture of Mike Hampton? It's not like you'd have to go far to get one. Good raise 08:52, 10 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    - How is it now?--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 00:45, 11 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]

No longer opposing, not yet supporting. Sorry about the wait. I didn't find much time for editing this week. Good raise 06:54, 6 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Not finding time to edit. Remaining neutral. My apologies. Good raise 03:45, 6 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Support, all issues resolved. Dabomb87 (talk) 15:22, 4 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved issues, Dabomb87 (talk)

Comments from Dabomb87 (talk · contribs)

Some of my comments may apply to multiple lists. Please make changes to those articles as well, when necessary.
"This list only includes players selected to the post-season All-American first-team for each selector." No hyphen in "first-team"; it's not a compound adjective.
- I am never sure about that, but I take your word for it.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 04:15, 24 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"highly-regarded" No hyphen in -ly adverbs, see WP:HYPHEN.
- O.K.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 04:17, 24 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
No mentions of the colleges played for in the prose? Also, Georgia Tech had three All-Americans that year (and not surprisingly made the CWS); is that not worth mentioning (not a rhetorical question, I don't follow baseball so I don't know if it's a regular occurence or not).
- Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 04:31, 24 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"(i.e., 1 – pitcher, 2 – catcher, etc.)" "i.e."-->e.g. (yes, there is a difference!) Dabomb87 (talk) 23:41, 23 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
- I have studied latin and know what these phrases mean. In this case, i.e. seems correct to me because we are explaining the prior statement instead of giving an example.

'Support: -- ♫Greatorangepumpkin♫ T 15:32, 5 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Comment before I promote, could you please have a look at this discussion involving a newly promoted FL and the use of general references. I think we solved the problem, so I'd like you to consider that approach too, primarily to avoid another brouhaha. Cheers. The Rambling Man (talk) 16:51, 5 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
- I honestly don't understand what you are asking me to do.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 20:31, 5 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  - We had a problem with an editor complaining about the use of a general reference instead of inline citation(s) for the whole contents of a table. This list currently exhibits the same issue. I'd like you to familiarise yourself with the previous discussion and act accordingly. The Rambling Man (talk) 21:04, 5 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    - I think you are asking me to add an inline citation, which I just did.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 21:14, 5 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.