Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Tintin in the Land of the Soviets/archive2

The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was not promoted by SandyGeorgia 03:23, 8 April 2011 [1].

Tintin in the Land of the Soviets

Nominator(s): Midnightblueowl (talk) 14:26, 19 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I am nominating this for featured article because it has attained GA status and seems to fit all of the criteria for FA inclusion. It has been a featured article nomination before, and the suggested improvements that were put forward then have since been acted upon. Midnightblueowl (talk) 14:26, 19 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Source review

Be consistent in whether you provide locations for publishers
Always use ndashes for page ranges
Sources originally published in a foreign language (where you're citing the translation) should include information on the original publication, as well as the translator's name
Assouline is in Bibliography but not Footnotes
"rendered socially and politically acceptable in the climate of the Reaganite repopularisation of the 'Cold War' and the final push towards the demise of the Soviet Union" - check accuracy of this quote

I encourage you to work on reducing the number of direct quotes included in the article. I would also suggest you find a third party to copy-edit the article, because I still see multiple grammatical and spelling errors, and instances of awkward or unclear phrasing. Nikkimaria (talk) 16:52, 19 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for these suggestions; I have acted on most of them. I have ensured that all footnotes refer to the locations of the publisher, and that Assouline is in both the bibliography and the footnotes. I have also checked the Theobald quote and can confirm that it is accurate. I have cut down on the number of direct quotations, although could remove more. (Midnightblueowl (talk) 18:32, 20 March 2011 (UTC))[reply]

From what I can tell via GBooks, the wording of that quote is inaccurate - would you mind rechecking? Nikkimaria (talk) 19:16, 20 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"Repolarisation" not "repopularisation". Wow, I completely missed that. I'll correct it in the article. {Midnightblueowl (talk) 01:16, 23 March 2011 (UTC)}[reply]

Right, I have gone through the article and added in ndashes for page ranges. (Midnightblueowl (talk) 18:02, 25 March 2011 (UTC))[reply]

Comment - I'm a big fan of the Tintin books (and anything by Herge), so I may try and look at this from that viewpoint (the article looks very interesting). I have a copy of this book, which I think is one of the 1981 facsimile reprints, and I think I have the 1989 translation as well. One question I have is whether the 1930 originals are rare and worth anything to collectors? You hint at this with "As The Adventures of Tintin became more popular in Western Europe, and some of the rarer books became collectors items, the original printed edition of Tintin in the Land of the Soviets became highly valued." But do any of your sources actually give examples of the values they were trading at, or what they are worth now? The only other initial comment I have is that from looking at the sources you've used, it looks like you've covered all the major Tintin sources, including some very recent ones, but would you be able to confirm this (i.e. did you consult all the major sources on the topic)? Carcharoth (talk) 09:12, 26 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the interest Carcharoth. To answer your question about market prices regarding collectable editions, none of the sources used in this article discuss them, and I am unaware of any that do, although it would not surprise me if some obscure (probably French-language) collectors guide did discuss them. Where one earth I would find such a guide, I'm afraid I have no idea. To answer your second point, there are two books which I do not have access to, and which also offer some information on the subject: Michael Farr's Tintin: 60 Years of Adventure (1989) and Philippe Goddin's Hergé and Tintin Reporters: From "Le Petit Vingtieme" to "Tintin" Magazine (1987). I doubt that either of these works offer any valuable information that the many later sources do not, particularly as Farr has gone on to write several books since the aforementioned one. (Midnightblueowl (talk) 23:54, 27 March 2011 (UTC))[reply]

Comment I was hoping to find some extra info in the fr.wiki but the article is kind of disappointing. Still, the "Dessin et narration" section has interesting bits that could be used to expand some of the current content. I can translate if you want but I just checked and Google Translate does a reasonable job. The problem is that the French article is poorly sourced. Still, I think that, for example, additional commentary on the (crappy) drawing style might be in order, especially given the fact that the drawing was incredibly consistent after Tintin au Congo. Pichpich (talk) 17:24, 29 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Personally, I don't know if we'd be able to simply import unreferenced information from the French language Wikipedia page into here. If such information is published in an English-language source, it can be included here, but currently I am unaware of any such books. (Midnightblueowl (talk) 18:02, 2 April 2011 (UTC))[reply]

Image review

Captions that aren't complete sentences shouldn't end in periods. Captions should meet same standards for prose, MoS, etc as article text
I'm confused by the FUR for File:Tintin_in_the_Land_of_the_Soviets_pane.JPG. The lead says that an English translation was not published until 1989. If that's the case, then how can this 1930 image, scanned from the "original book", be in English? If this iamge is in fact from the 1989 translation, then the FUR needs to be amended, and the case for "historical significance" is quite a bit weaker - it won't be the first panel ever to feature Tintin, but the first in English. Also, you should note on the image description page who holds copyright on this image. Same issues exist to a lesser extent in File:Bolshevik_elections_in_Tintin.JPG. Nikkimaria (talk) 16:04, 4 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I've made the changes necessary on the two images' pages. (Midnightblueowl (talk) 14:26, 5 April 2011 (UTC))[reply]

Oppose - I was reluctant to do this earlier, but no substantial third-party copy-editing has taken place during this FAC, and there are still multiple problems with prose and MoS issues. Here's a sampling:

"The plot revolves around the young Belgian reporter Tintin and his dog Snowy, who travel, via Berlin, to the Soviet Union, to report back on the policies instituted by the Bolshevik government under Joseph Stalin. However, an agent of the Soviet secret service, the OGPU, attempts to prevent him from doing so, consistently setting traps to get rid of him" - first sentence is plural (presumably Tintin and Snowy), whereas second is singular (presumably Tintin)
Wikilink potentially unfamiliar terms such as Tintinologists on first occurrence, but don't link very common terms and don't link the same term more than once, especially not in close proximity (see WP:OVERLINK)
"Tintin is blamed by the Berlin police but escapes to the border of the Soviet Union. Brought before the local Commissar's office..." - as a reader, I'm very confused by this point. He's blamed by the police for the explosion or for being a bourgeoisie? What's a Commissar, and how did he come to be brought before one?
"Several Bolsheviks then come to arrest him during the night, when he manages to scare them off by dressing up as a ghost. Falling into the sewers, he is pursued by Bolsheviks and tries to get out of the Soviet Union, but is eventually caught and arrested. Threatened with torture by two Chinamen, he again escapes by travelling underwater in a diving suit" - again, very confused. I realize that you don't want to overwhelm the article with plot summary, but in that case it might be necessary to remove rather than add detail - for example, is "Chinamen" important here?
"Then sneaking into a secret meeting of a group of Bolsheviks, he learns that all the Soviet grain is being exported for foreign propaganda purposes" - phrasing
MoS edits needed - quotes incorporated as part of a larger sentence should not be capitalized, don't use contractions, etc. Nikkimaria (talk) 03:52, 6 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Thanks for the suggestions, I've gone through and made the necessary changes. (Midnightblueowl (talk) 11:33, 7 April 2011 (UTC))[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.