Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Sega CD/archive1
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- The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.
The article was not promoted by Ian Rose 10:01, 23 January 2014 (UTC) [1].[reply]
Sega CD (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
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- Nominator(s): Red Phoenix build the future...remember the past... 22:49, 16 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Coming right off of the recent promotion of Sega Genesis, here's a related video game topic. The Sega CD was one of two major add-ons for the aforementioned console that had its own independent game library and very much its own place in the history of video games, though unfortunately more as a warning to other manufacturers than anything else. This article went through a GA review a few months ago, though not one without controversy, as the Sega Genesis WP:LAME naming debates spilled over into this article, but since then it's been nice and stable, and I managed to take some significant time today with some more new sources to really flesh out the article and make it thorough, deep, well presented, and reliably sourced, and I believe it meets the FA criteria at this point. As always, I'll be more than glad to handle any issues that come up during this FAC, and will do what it takes to make this happen. Thanks, Red Phoenix build the future...remember the past... 22:49, 16 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Comments
- The development section has very little on the actual development, it seems to be mostly anecdotes, and all from the American division. I expected to read about the design process and business decisions that lead to their choice of hardware - why JVC for instance? When did development begin?
- I've pinged Indrian to help me with this. Tough part here is that Sega of Japan kept a lot of this under wraps during development. Sega of Europe didn't even get off the ground until 1991, so I don't expect there to be any feedback there. Some of the quotes may have to be broken up to help with the flow of this; I'll have to have a look.
- I still have to add a couple of sources when I am back with my books, but I have completely rewritten the development section. There are few sources in English discussing the development of the Sega CD, but I think the new version at least hits a few highlights. While there is no source giving the specific reason for partnering with JVC, I did add some info on the company's experience with CD technology prior to development of the Sega CD, which I think at least provides context for why the company would be involved in such a venture. Indrian (talk) 16:39, 21 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Indrian, it looks fantastic. Wow, I don't think I could have ever found that much. Red Phoenix build the future...remember the past... 20:25, 23 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- I still have to add a couple of sources when I am back with my books, but I have completely rewritten the development section. There are few sources in English discussing the development of the Sega CD, but I think the new version at least hits a few highlights. While there is no source giving the specific reason for partnering with JVC, I did add some info on the company's experience with CD technology prior to development of the Sega CD, which I think at least provides context for why the company would be involved in such a venture. Indrian (talk) 16:39, 21 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- I've pinged Indrian to help me with this. Tough part here is that Sega of Japan kept a lot of this under wraps during development. Sega of Europe didn't even get off the ground until 1991, so I don't expect there to be any feedback there. Some of the quotes may have to be broken up to help with the flow of this; I'll have to have a look.
- Game library - "Sega CD could only put up 32 colors at a time" Zito may have been correctly quoted, but his statement is incorrect and it should be noted. It also contradicts the history section which claims the Sega CD gives the Genesis a larger colour palette.
- I'm not sure how that's incorrect. From my research, the Sega CD does give the Genesis more colors to select from, but it can't put all of them up at once. The palette itself is larger, but it can't utilize more. Do you have evidence that the Sega CD could put up more than 32 colors at once? If so, I'd be glad to correct it.
- I can understand the increase in palette size vs colour output. But given that the Mega Drive can put out 64 colors concurrently, I don't know where the 32 comes from. - hahnchen 03:33, 20 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Done - Ah, well scouted, hahnchen. I've added the 64-color fact in just after that sentence. Red Phoenix build the future...remember the past... 02:55, 21 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- I can understand the increase in palette size vs colour output. But given that the Mega Drive can put out 64 colors concurrently, I don't know where the 32 comes from. - hahnchen 03:33, 20 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- I'm not sure how that's incorrect. From my research, the Sega CD does give the Genesis more colors to select from, but it can't put all of them up at once. The palette itself is larger, but it can't utilize more. Do you have evidence that the Sega CD could put up more than 32 colors at once? If so, I'd be glad to correct it.
- File:SonicCD.PNG - I don't think that's the best example of a gameplay screenshot. Sega finally catches up with Mode 7, but there's very little coverage of that in the article, and those graphics could easily be done on other systems at the time. It's FMV games that define the Mega CD, the reader would be better served with a Night Trap image.
- What other consoles could do mode 7 at the time besides the Super NES? In addition to its use of Sega CD's enhanced graphical capabilities, Sonic CD is also the best selling game on the Sega CD, as well as the most critically acclaimed. I disagree that the FMV games define the Sega CD. Certainly they define the negative aspects of the Sega CD library, but I do not think they should be the sole focus of the article. Perhaps another tweak is in order. Or if your idea is to show what the Sega CD was capable of, Silpheed is a good example too, because it combined polygons, instead of sprites with FMV backgrounds and CD quality soundtrack while keeping a very high frame rate. I don't think that route is better than the current one though.--SexyKick 02:39, 20 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- The article as it stands does talk a lot about FMV games, though, because almost every source I've reviewed makes a big deal about Sega CD's FMV game content. I'd love to keep both, but I don't think we have enough fair-use justification for both, even as different as they are. I'll look at switching this to one from either Night Trap for its relevance, or Sewer Shark, as it was the pack-in. Red Phoenix build the future...remember the past... 02:48, 20 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Well, there are two sections in the article about that. We could put a Night Trap shot where the article talks about Night Trap, and the three reasons to include a picture of Sonic CD should suffice for fair use justification. We have two game screenshots in Sega Genesis and Super NES as well.--SexyKick 03:08, 20 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- I made the Night Trap comment in light of the weight given to it in the text vs the Mode 7 style elements. - hahnchen 03:33, 20 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- If it helps, I did add a sentence about the Mode 7 style elements, but I do still feel that an FMV image might be better due to the weight of the article, and appropriately so - FMV did have a lot of weight with Sega CD. Red Phoenix build the future...remember the past... 02:55, 21 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- I like the sentence you added. I don't think there's any reason we can't go for two pictures though. Especially when the early paragraph about Night Trap provides a night spot for one there.--SexyKick 03:04, 21 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- If it helps, I did add a sentence about the Mode 7 style elements, but I do still feel that an FMV image might be better due to the weight of the article, and appropriately so - FMV did have a lot of weight with Sega CD. Red Phoenix build the future...remember the past... 02:55, 21 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- I made the Night Trap comment in light of the weight given to it in the text vs the Mode 7 style elements. - hahnchen 03:33, 20 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Well, there are two sections in the article about that. We could put a Night Trap shot where the article talks about Night Trap, and the three reasons to include a picture of Sonic CD should suffice for fair use justification. We have two game screenshots in Sega Genesis and Super NES as well.--SexyKick 03:08, 20 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- The article as it stands does talk a lot about FMV games, though, because almost every source I've reviewed makes a big deal about Sega CD's FMV game content. I'd love to keep both, but I don't think we have enough fair-use justification for both, even as different as they are. I'll look at switching this to one from either Night Trap for its relevance, or Sewer Shark, as it was the pack-in. Red Phoenix build the future...remember the past... 02:48, 20 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- What other consoles could do mode 7 at the time besides the Super NES? In addition to its use of Sega CD's enhanced graphical capabilities, Sonic CD is also the best selling game on the Sega CD, as well as the most critically acclaimed. I disagree that the FMV games define the Sega CD. Certainly they define the negative aspects of the Sega CD library, but I do not think they should be the sole focus of the article. Perhaps another tweak is in order. Or if your idea is to show what the Sega CD was capable of, Silpheed is a good example too, because it combined polygons, instead of sprites with FMV backgrounds and CD quality soundtrack while keeping a very high frame rate. I don't think that route is better than the current one though.--SexyKick 02:39, 20 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Reception - I expected more from the 90s. Only the first sentence of the section refers to comments made around the launch.
- I think I can get RedPhoenix some comments from EGM to use.--SexyKick 02:39, 20 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Anything around launch time itself ('91-'93) would be helpful, SexyKick. I may have to ask for some help from the procurers of the WP:VG/RL as well for some backup here. Red Phoenix build the future...remember the past... 02:48, 20 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Thanks to SexyKick providing me some more info, I found more feedback from EGM to add in, which is time-relevant. As the launch was just before the Internet really took off, though, it seems to be difficult to find sources that are period-appropriate. If you still feel it's insufficient, I'll seek some help from WP:VG/RL. Red Phoenix build the future...remember the past... 20:25, 23 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Anything around launch time itself ('91-'93) would be helpful, SexyKick. I may have to ask for some help from the procurers of the WP:VG/RL as well for some backup here. Red Phoenix build the future...remember the past... 02:48, 20 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- hahnchen 23:53, 19 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Thanks for your comments, hahnchen. It's a rough time for me with retail being my line of work, but I'll do what I can to get this addressed in a timely manner and hopefully earn your support. Red Phoenix build the future...remember the past... 02:48, 20 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- I think I can get RedPhoenix some comments from EGM to use.--SexyKick 02:39, 20 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- The development section has very little on the actual development, it seems to be mostly anecdotes, and all from the American division. I expected to read about the design process and business decisions that lead to their choice of hardware - why JVC for instance? When did development begin?
- Note: This is a WikiCup nomination. The following nominators are WikiCup participants: Red Phoenix. To the nominator: if you do not intend to submit this article at the WikiCup, feel free to remove this notice. UcuchaBot (talk) 00:01, 1 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]
Closing comment -- this review has well and truly stalled so I'll be archiving it shortly. Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 00:29, 23 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]
- Closing note: This candidate has been archived, but there may be a delay in bot processing of the close. Please see WP:FAC/ar, and leave the {{featured article candidates}} template in place on the talk page until the bot goes through. Ian Rose (talk) 00:30, 23 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.