Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Nicholas Hoult/archive1

The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was promoted by Ian Rose via FACBot (talk) 11:21, 12 June 2018 [1].

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Nicholas Hoult

Nominator(s): VedantTalk 09:19, 12 May 2018 (UTC)

This article is about the English actor Nicholas Hoult. It passed the GA review by Ssven2 in March. It has been copy edited by the GOCE and received additional pros-related comments from Ceranthor at a Peer Review. Looking forward to the comments.

Note: There is an active discussion at the article's talk page regarding the inclusion of an infobox, but it should not affect the article's quality otherwise and should be eventually resolved with a consensus. VedantTalk 09:19, 12 May 2018 (UTC)

Images are appropriately licensed. Nikkimaria (talk) 17:08, 12 May 2018 (UTC)

Source review - spotchecks not done

• FN20 should include bibliographic details for the original source

I am sorry, I don't understand.

The citation is to a website which republishes an article originally published elsewhere - the citation should include details about where the article was originally published. Nikkimaria (talk) 18:05, 12 May 2018 (UTC)

I am not sure how. Could you guide me? VedantTalk 18:21, 12 May 2018 (UTC)

The easiest way would be to just build a regular citation based on the details of the original source, and then use |via= for the website. Nikkimaria (talk) 18:28, 12 May 2018 (UTC)

I am sorry for troubling you so much, but I am not sure of the original source. VedantTalk 18:34, 12 May 2018 (UTC)

It's here, page 116. Nikkimaria (talk) 19:34, 12 May 2018 (UTC)

Done, thanks for the help Nikkimaria. VedantTalk 10:02, 13 May 2018 (UTC)

• FN47: check publication name?
• What makes the Daily Express a high-quality reliable source?
• Deadline and RogerEbert.com should both be italicized; Tribeca Film Festival should not
• FN98: why include location here, and not in most other citations? Nikkimaria (talk) 17:08, 12 May 2018 (UTC)

Fixed everything/Left comments. Thank you, Nikkimaria. VedantTalk 17:59, 12 May 2018 (UTC)

Comments from Yashthepunisher

• The mentioning of his birthplace in the opening sentence in the lead seems a bit odd to me. Only date of birth will suffice.
• "Hoult received wide recognition for his portrayal of Tony Stonem in the E4 teenage-drama series Skins." Avoid using words like 'portrayal' unless its a real life or author-backed character he's playing.
• "has been his greatest commercial success to date." Greatest or biggest? It should be more neutrally worded.
• One of the image needs an alt text.

I'm not very good with prose so that's it from me. Yashthepunisher (talk) 06:59, 13 May 2018 (UTC)

Thank you so much for taking a look Yash. VedantTalk 10:02, 13 May 2018 (UTC)

• Support great work, all the best. Yashthepunisher (talk) 10:09, 13 May 2018 (UTC)

Comments from Ssven2

• My concerns were resolved during the GAR itself. You have my support for this article's promotion to FAC.  — Ssven2 ^{Looking at you, kid} 14:46, 13 May 2018 (UTC)

Thank you for dropping by, Ssven2. I hope you're better. VedantTalk 17:53, 14 May 2018 (UTC)

Still taking it in. Its been hard.  — Ssven2 ^{Looking at you, kid} 05:56, 15 May 2018 (UTC)

Comments from Kailash

• Why does "Early career (1996–2005)" begin with Nicholas' acting potential? Please comply with WP:SURNAME.

It is to avoid confusion between the two Hoult brothers in the opening couple of sentences.

• 2002 comedy-drama film About a Boy - Please rewrite as 2002 comedy-drama film About a Boy to avoid WP:SEAOFBLUE.

I have removed the link altogether.

• He was eventually cast in the role of Hank McCoy/Beast for the X-Men film series - Hank McCoy redirects to Beast, so you may write "Hank McCoy / Beast".

I think I'll use Hank itself.

• Hoult reprised his role as Hank McCoy in Bryan Singer's X-Men: Days Of Future Past - chose whether you want to say Beast or Hank McCoy.
• It was also a top-grossing production outside the US - say United States.
• It will be a four-part serial that will be broadcast on BBC One in the United Kingdom and will stream internationally on Netflix in 2017 - Delink Netflix, since it is linked in an earlier sentence: "Released on Netflix in April 2017, the film garnered mixed reviews".
• He will also reprise his role as Beast in the 2019 film X-Men: Dark Phoenix - end it as the X-Men film Dark Phoenix, scheduled for a 2019 release, since "X-Men" is not (currently) part of the film's title. Also add a source, since this source talks about the Watership Down adaptation, not the X-Men film. --Kailash29792 (talk) 16:00, 14 May 2018 (UTC)

Thank you for the comments Kailash29792. I've fixed everything, let me know if there is anything else. VedantTalk 17:53, 14 May 2018 (UTC)

Support: My prime comments have been resolved. Although I'd prefer if you wrote "[[Beast (comics)|Hank McCoy / Beast]]" to avoid a redirect and because that's the way most Marvel-related GA/FAs list characters, this shouldn't affect the chances of attaining FA status. Kailash29792 (talk) 03:58, 17 May 2018 (UTC)

Thank you for the review Kailash, it was really helpful. I've fixed the last issue with the link too. Thanks again. VedantTalk 06:49, 17 May 2018 (UTC)

Comments from Ceranthor

Lead

• "One of the highest grossing English actors of 2013, he was included in the Forbes 30 under 30 list." - there must be a smoother way to incorporate this, since the focus on 2013 - five years in the past - comes out of nowhere; maybe better to just leave it out of the lead or better integrate it into the flow
• "Although he initially wanted to study English, Hoult chose to pursue a career in acting and briefly attended the Sylvia Young Theatre School." - Feels like something's missing here; did he drop out or just never attend university?
• "Although dismissive of his character, he garnered praise" - for clarity, maybe better as "Although Hoult was dismissive..."

Early life

• "His paternal[2] great-aunt was Dame Anna Neagle, a stage and film actor active in the 1930s and 1940s." - nitpick, but move the [2] to the end of the sentence?

Career

• "Hoult began attending auditions and at the age of five was cast in the 1996 drama Intimate Relations; his first feature-film role." - should be a comma, not a semicolon at the end
• ""woolly-hatted, oddball son of a suicidal, hippy-ish single mother, [who] he gets bullied horribly at school".[12]" - why the [who] if it doesn't make the quote make grammatical sense?
• "grossing more than $130 million worldwide and being praised by film critics.[11][13]" - receiving praise would be better than "being praised"
• "directors and producers said his performance led them to cast him in their projects.[21]" - such as?

I have removed the whole bit as it was both vague and rather unsubstantiated.

• "It was variously described by media outlets as the first adult role for Hoult, who described Kenny as a "spontaneous" character who is not simply defined by his sexuality.[28][29][30]" - I'd cut the second "who" and just make it "character not simply defined..."
• "An adaptation of Isaac Marion's novel of the same name, the film is presented from point of view of the central character, mostly through narration]." - did you mean to link to something with the bracket at the end here?

I must have, but I can't seem to recall what so I have removed it.

Got down to everything before "Transition to biographical and independent films (2017–present)." Will be sure to finish with a few more comments, but looking great so far. ceranthor 00:36, 22 May 2018 (UTC)

• "The action film Collide was released in the United States in February 2017 to a poor response from audiences and critics" - what role did Hoult play?
• "writing that director Eran Creevy and Hoult would get better offers despite the failure of films like Collide, as opposed to the minority group, who are either ignored or stereotyped.[82] " - should be more clear here... I think you're referring to the women in the film, but it's unclear what you exactly mean by "the minority group" (all women, just women of color, etc.)

Personal life

• "In April 2018, the couple had their first child together.[100] " - any idea the kid's name?

Not really.

• "Hoult lives in a flat in north-west London;[92] he also made an unsuccessful offer to buy a house in the London Borough of Camden in 2012.[92][101]" - I'd cut the "also"

Accolades

• Has he received any other major awards since 2010?

Nothing but nominations for the People and Teen Choices.

Looks good. ceranthor 01:30, 22 May 2018 (UTC)

I have hopefully fixed everything Ceranthor. Thanks for taking another look. VedantTalk 12:15, 22 May 2018 (UTC)

Support on the prose. ceranthor 00:04, 26 May 2018 (UTC)

Comments from Tim riley

• Some spelling points: "instalment" is twice given as "installment", "tape" (I'm assuming) as "tapel", and "performance" appears as "perfomance" at one point.

sorry for this, my Google keyboard seems to remember and repeat my typos. xD

• Early life
  • "to piano teacher Glenis (née Brown) and British Airways pilot Roger Hoult" – clunky false titles
  • "and was involved in productions of Swan Lake" – involved? Strange word. Do you mean he took part?
  • "Richard E Grant" – bravo for omitting the otiose full stop, but the MoS police won't like it.
• Skins and West End debut (2006–10)
  • "quitting acting … quit school" – unexpected, and not especially welcome Americanism in an article on an English topic.
• Upcoming films (why the Americanism rather than the English "forthcoming", one wonders): Watership Down "will stream internationally on Netflix in 2017" – curious retrospective prediction.
• Trivia – it is appropriate for an encyclopaedia article to record that someone "made an unsuccessful offer to buy a house in the London Borough of Camden in 2012"?; as to the first part of the same sentence, see WP:DATED.

Excellently balanced coverage of the subject's press reviews. I was half-expecting to find only the raves mentioned, and am impressed by the even-handedness of the article. – Tim riley talk 09:33, 24 May 2018 (UTC)

I've hopefully addressed all your comments Tim riley. Thank you for taking the time our for the review and appreciating the article! Let me know if you have any further comments. VedantTalk 11:27, 24 May 2018 (UTC)

No other comments. Tim riley talk 15:42, 24 May 2018 (UTC)

Thanks gor being so thorough Tim, issues like typos require a keen eye! VedantTalk 06:21, 25 May 2018 (UTC)

Comments from Aoba47

• Please use Hoult’s full name on the first mention in the body of the article.

Done

• The image caption in the “Early life” section requires punctuation as it is a full sentence.
• I am a little confused by this sentence (In a January 2013 episode of the twelfth series of The Graham Norton Show, Nicholas revealed that his middle name is Caradoc (pronounced /ka.rɑː'dɔk/), a Welsh name that translates to "The Beloved One”.). It makes me think that he was keeping his middle name a secret for some reason, particularly due to the verbage “revealed”. Also, why is the full context (i.e. his appearance on The Graham Norton Show) necessary to tell the reader the actor’s middle name? It interprets the flow of the paragraph to talk about his childhoold in one sentence, jump ahead to a 2013 context, and then jump back into the past to talk about his parents.

I've done away with most of the sentence, let me know if that's an improvement.

• Reference 3 is not working for me. It leads to the following error screen for me (404 - File or directory not found. The resource you are looking for might have been removed, had its name changed, or is temporarily unavailable.). I would mark it as a dead url so the archived version takes precedence.

Yes, not working for me either. I've changed the parameters.

• I have a question for this sentence (He has three siblings: an elder brother James, who is a United States-based biology student; and two sisters, Rosanna and Clarista, both of whom are television actors.). In the sources provided, I found information on the siblings’ names and they all had acting experience (which is rather generic), but I could not find where the information about their jobs (i.e. biology student and television actors) is supported. I am probably overlooking so could you please point it out in the source for me?

I've added he ref and removed the redundant citation.

• I would rephrase this part (Hoult thought the role was unlike any of his previous roles) to avoid the repetition of the word “role” in such cloxe proximity.
• Was there any notable critical response to Hoult’s role in X-Men: Days of Future Past?

Not really, mostly frivolous information for cast performances and barely anything on him in particular.

• For this part ( Forbes' Scott Mendelson analysed the film's failure and said Hoult did not necessarily have enough "star power”), I would move reference 81 to the end of the sentence rather than have it awkwardly in the middle.
• Shouldn’t the article include information on his role in The Favourite?
• In the “Forthcoming films” subsection, I would include information on the Tolkien biopic and the The True History of the Kelly Gang film.

Added.

Wonderful work with this article. Ironically enough, I have only seen this actor in the film Collide. I actually enjoyed that movie; it is a very generic action movie, but it is fun and worth a watch just for Ben Kingsley’s performance lol. Once my comments are addressed, I will support this. I hope this helps, and have a great rest of your week! Aoba47 (talk) 20:29, 30 May 2018 (UTC)

I've hopefully addressed all your comments Aoba47. I've seen a lot of his work but Collide isn't among the films thai I have seen. Will watch it eventually. xD Thanks for taking out time and reviewing the article. Let me know if there's anything else. Cheers, VedantTalk 11:59, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

• Thank you for addressing everything, and I support this based on prose. You have done a wonderful job with this article. It definitely inspires me to possibly work on this type of article in the future. Aoba47 (talk) 17:03, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

Thank you for the review and your kind words Aoba47. I appreciate it. VedantTalk 06:09, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

Comments and support from Gerda

Thank you for the article! Will read and comment, and guess it will be not much, with all the fixes I see above ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:18, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

Lead

• "Hoult's continued associations with big-budget productions have yielded varying results." - that's not clear to me. The following, that one film was a flop, another a success, had probably nothing to do with his performance, no?

Yes Gerda, but it explains the shift to the independent cinema and how even in the artcile it says that he did not have the "star power" to pull off a film on his shoulders. I think it just put things in perspective.

I wasn't clear enough, sorry, - my problem is the "have yielded varying results" bit, - I added the other only to find it.

I still think it's a strange wording, but if I#m the only one - who am I?

Early life

• I am surprised to see him go to nursery after ballet with the ENB, - is that the chronology?
• wl Church of England? Church of England's?
• "part of ... choir" - how about "member"?

Early career

• "that starred the former's brother" - perhaps better repeat the name?
• I'd say "age three" in the first sentence.
• Now we have the Church linked, - please move up.
• I wonder how he got to Hollywood?

There's​ nothing available on this bit except for how he continued to audition for roles as a kid.

Skins

• "a mixed response from critics" or "mixed responses from critics"?
• "It was variously described by media outlets as the first adult role for Hoult" - not happy with "it" at the beginning, which leaves open what "it" may be.
• General remark: if a critic says nothing more specific than "beautiful performance", - is it worth a quote? (There are others, similarly too general.)

Transition

• "he was intrigued by the film's script and Salinger's life, of which he had little knowledge" sounds like a contradiction

Finally: I wonder how many of these details will remain when - as we hope - he does more substantial things in the next 20 years ;) - As said before: I'd prefer a few long substantial critic's quotes to 2-word-snippets that say almost nothing. Thank you! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:52, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

Hey Gerda, I am real busy in RL (shifting places), but I'll try and get to the rest of your comments ASAP. Thanks for being so patient. VedantTalk 03:48, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

I've hopefully fixed everything Gerda. I've added reviews to his performances in some of his earlier roles, but have left out film where his performance was barely reviewed in the first place i.e. most action/supporting roles. Let me know if you have any further comments, thanks. VedantTalk 06:15, 6 June 2018 (UTC)

Thank you, I'll look, but may be tomorrow. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:16, 6 June 2018 (UTC)

I like to see that you are still polishing. How is this: you ping me when you think you are done, and I look again? What do you think of more precise edit summaries, to let us know which issue(s) gets resolved in which edit? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:51, 7 June 2018 (UTC)

I think I have addressed everything Gerda. VedantTalk 16:19, 7 June 2018 (UTC)

I am in the middle (or rather at the beginning) of expanding a person who recently died, will look when I'm done. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:22, 7 June 2018 (UTC)

Looked now, support. You could still think about "yielding results" ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:28, 11 June 2018 (UTC)

Made the necessary tweak Gerda. Thanks for your thorough review, I appreciate it. VedantTalk 06:38, 12 June 2018 (UTC)

Query

@FAC coordinators: Hey guys, I was hoping to add the article to my Wikicup submissions and was wondering if you guys could take a look and let me know if anything else needs to done here (Gerda is yet to take another look). Thanks. VedantTalk 18:29, 11 June 2018 (UTC)

I'm unsure about Ian but I'm out of time today for going through nominations. I will likely revisit the list mid-week. --Laser brain (talk) 18:58, 11 June 2018 (UTC)

• Closing note: This candidate has been promoted, but there may be a delay in bot processing of the close. Please see WP:FAC/ar, and leave the {{featured article candidates}} template in place on the talk page until the bot goes through. Ian Rose (talk) 11:21, 12 June 2018 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.