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Boshin War

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Detailed article on the little known subject of the Boshin War (the 1868 Japanese civil war that led to the Meiji restoration), with lots of related links. This article clarifies some of the historical background to the 2003 Hollywood movie "The Last Samurai". Essentially self-nom PHG 15:55, 21 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • The citations are at the bottom of the page under "Notes", and growing. Should you wish any particular statement to be qualified, please advise. Regards. PHG 17:38, 21 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • General growth is fine; I'd like to see, on average, at least one citation in every paragraph, as otherwise it's quite difficult to guess where the material is coming from. (Are there no other major works on the conflict, incidentally? I would have expected that this topic would attract a greater variety of historians; is this not the case?)
  • Essentially done for the citations. Surprisingly very little English material is available on the subject (the French have more, due to the involvement of Jules Brunet). A search for Boshin War on Amazon gives nothing specific on this subject.PHG 19:29, 21 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • "The Cambridge History of Japan Volume 5: The Nineteenth Century" devotes a page to the conflict (page 358, which is in Chapter 5, "The Meiji Restoration," by Marius B. Jansen).
  • Support Terrific article of high importance. Very many details and good pictures. Hello32020 20:05, 21 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support I think this is superb. Rlevse 21:34, 21 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support. The lead is great, the vocab exact, and the significance understandable. The paragraphs are laconic, which initially made me feel alarmed, but said all that they needed to say. The use of piped links is subtle, but to me, a sign of professionalism. Good work. Gracenotes T § 22:42, 21 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support. As per Tadakuni. Joey Joe Joe Junior Shabadoo 04:04, 22 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment Since I didn't see the article go through peer review, most of my comments are the sorts of things that would have been mentioned there.
    • First, there are both US and Commonwealth varieties of English in the article. These should be made uniform, and in accordance with Wikipedia policy, they should be the variety used in the first substantial contributions to the article. Examples of words in one or another variety include "favorable," "burnt," "harbour," "defences."
    • The term kangun is first introduced in the caption of a photo. It would be best to introduce it in the main text or to eliminate it, e.g. in favor of a term in English.
    • The terms "shogunate" and "bakufu" are used interchangeably. Readers will find it easiest to follow the article if one term is used consistently and the other eliminated. Since "shogunate" contains the word "shogun," it's easy for non-specialists to understand (in my opinion).
    • The closing sentence of the lead section reads, "facts which tend to be overlooked in modern history." This is opinion about modern history, not fact about the Boshin War, and I recommend removing it from the article.
    • The same person has two names in the article: Keiki and Yoshinobu. It's easiest for the reader if you select one and use it consistently.
    • Political background
    • Early discontent
    • "Unequal treaties" should be lowercase.
    • Sonno joi is described in parentheses with the abbreviation "lit." I recommend spelling the word "literally" in full.
    • "Barbarians" should be lowercase.
    • Words like "ronin," "samurai," and "daimyo" are English, but I recommend forming plurals without adding "s."
    • Southern coalition
    • Inserting "British" to make "the British bombardment of Kagoshima will remind the reader of the reason for the word "ironically."
    • Satsuma and Chōshū are "southern" here but "western" later (see Aftermath:Pardon, and Westernization after all, "The western fiefs of Satsuma, Chōshū and Tosa...). For clarity, directions like these should be consistent.
Done PHG 11:53, 22 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • Surrender of Edo
    • "Eight" should be lowercase.
    • Resistance of the Northern Coalition
    • Substituting "managed to procure two of the three Gatling guns in Japan as well as 2,000 modern French rifles" is smoother.
    • "Daimyo of Nagaoka" has uppercase "D" but elsewhere "daimyo of X" has lowercase; this should be made consistent.
    • Creation of the Ezo Republic
    • The phrase "handful of faithful French military advisers (notably Jules Brunet)" is a literal repeat; it would be nice to rephrase it.
    • Naval battle of Miyako Bay
    • The "rebels" organized a plan, but which side is the rebels at this time and place?
    • Battle of Hakodate
    • "Although Enomoto had resolved to fight to the end, and had sent his valuables to his adversary for safekeeping ( ... ), the general of the Imperial troops Kuroda Kiyotaka." -- this sentence is incomplete.
    • Aftermath
    • Pardon, and Westernization after all
    • "Arguably" is what Wikipedians call a "weasel word." Consider whether the sentence is true or not, or rephrase the sentence in a way that it's true without "arguably."
    • Later depictions of the war
    • "In modern summaries, the Meiji restoration is often described as a "bloodless revolution" leading to the sudden modernization of Japan." This is opinion about modern summaries, not fact about the Boshin War, and I advocate removing it, along with editing the beginning of the next sentence. "Admittedly" is unnecessary and I recommend deleting it.
  • Took away "Admittedly". However I would tend to think that a discussion of modern accounts of the Boshin War also deserves mention in a comprehensive article on the Boshin War. PHG 11:47, 22 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • "Later Japanese depictions of the war ..." is a statement about (need this be said?) later Japanese depictions, not about the war. Is it necessary in an article on the war?
  • Same as above. I would tend to think that a discussion of later depictions of the Boshin War deserves mention in a comprehensive article on the Boshin War. PHG 11:47, 22 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • Cinematographic adaptations
    • This section is cursory and Western. "The Last Samurai" is worth mentioning, but many additional films treat the subject, which is a recurring topic for television drama as well. This is an excellent opportunity to introduce the English-speaking reader to the body of Japanese work on the subject. One recent example is ja:壬生義士伝, a January 2 ten-hour production starring Ken Watanabe.



  • Object. I'd like to support this, but I can't just yet. The prose is a little rough and flabby. The parenthetical statements in the very first paragraph need to be cleaned up, and some verbiage could be trimmed. The phrase "In a final chapter to the war, the Commander-in-Chief of the Shogun's Navy Enomoto Takeaki" is used twice verbatim within a few paragraphs, suggesting that much more copy-editing needs to be done. Also, once Yoshinobu surrendered and the resistence declared a republic, can they still be called a "Shogunate rebels?" I'd like to try my hand at the copy, if you'd not mind. Other, random issues: When, where, and how was Yoshinobu captured? What was the role of the foreign powers? (I know that the Europeans withheld a warship from the Imperial faction for a while, until the government gave assurances, which they reneged on, that it wouldn't be used in the conflict. See: Keene's Emperor of Japan.) Could we get an English term for "Kangun," and paralleling "Shogunate" in the infobox, how about something like "Imperial faction/court?" Meiji and those surrounding him surely had things to say or rescripts to issue. "Later depictions of the war" could probably be combined with "Cinematographic adaptations," retaining the former's title. Also, I'm worried about the images: perhaps it's just my browser, but some of the text seems obscured by one or two. The second image of Enomoto could probably be cut without loss, and the very last image's caption seems a little big. Lastly, perhaps you could use Template:nihongo for all the kanji? --Monocrat 19:54, 24 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Thanks for your comments and edits. I think most of your points have been addressed by now (I am not sure how to deal with the Nihongo Template though). The warship you mention is the Kotetsu, which was released after the Meiji government was established in October 1868. I added elements on the diplomatic position of foreign powers throughout the conflict. Regards. PHG 05:01, 25 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • I've made a bunch more edits for content, but the prose still needs a lot of work. There are some untranslated kanji, such as 公議政体派. Could you give me romaji, and I can fiddle with the template? I'll leave more comments on the talk page.--Monocrat 06:35, 25 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Support Full disclosure: I've worked a lot on this over the past few days. There are a few minor things, like missing page citations, that I would like to see. An extra set of eyes copy-editing would be a good idea, too. But I think the article is ready to be featured. I might add one or two more things here and there when I get a chance, but they're small. One note, though: I would exercise caution in adding more images or changing the settings of existing ones.--Monocrat 17:54, 27 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]


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