Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Ahmedabad

Ahmedabad

This is an article about one of the major cities of India. It has undergone a long process of expansion, formatting and copyediting. There was a lengthy peer review in May. 8 experienced users had commented in the peer review and all the issues raised there have been addressed. The article is also a selected article on Portal:India. I request the community's support to make this article a Featured Article. Thanks. - Aksi_great (talk - review me) 14:43, 30 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Support —M in un ^Spiderman 15:04, 30 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Comment This is another example of how the incomplete use of cite web obscures the references. Please use cite news for articles from news sources, and please expand your footnotes to include full bibliographic entries, including the exact publication date in newspapers. Should the online sources become unavailable, a reader should be able to locate the news article. The reader shouldn't have to click on every reference to understand the quality of your references. If you've used a legitimate news source, highlight that. If your cite web is to the official town website, include the name of that site in your reference, please. I'll have another look at the article as soon as the references are clear. I found some instances where inline citations are needed (example, Kankaria lake, located in the neighbourhood of Maninagar, is an artificial lake developed by the Sultan of Delhi, Qutb-ud-din Aybak in 1451.) Sandy 15:06, 30 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It would also be useful to link to also provide a link to these online articles on archival sites. Should the original links go dead, there will be another link to follow. --Oldak Quill 15:58, 30 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I have significantly expanded all the refernces in the article. Please tell me if anything more is required. - Aksi_great (talk - review me) 17:30, 30 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Update very close! Can you look at a few minor points: "Further reading" should use a consistent style. Can you make it last name, first name, and in alphabetical order? Also, are you aware of how to use named refs for references that are used more than once? Jeremy Smith is used at least five times, and should be combined to a named ref. (If you don't know how to do that, let me know, and I can help.) Also, my random reference check from above (Kankaria lake, in the neighbourhood of Maninagar, is an artificial lake developed by the Sultan of Delhi, Qutb-ud-din Aybak in 1451.) has still not been addressed. Can't specific statements such as this one be referenced ? Sandy 14:42, 3 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Reply - I have taken care of all your points. The "Further reading" section has been fixed and arranged in alphabetical order (by last name). The "Jeremy Smith" references have been combined. Reference from the Ministry of Tourism, India has been added for the Kankaria lake comment. Do mention if more references are required for any sentence. - Aksi_great (talk - review me) 16:57, 3 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Support. Sandy 21:23, 3 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Strong Support Rama's arrow 16:31, 30 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Support: Well written and comprehensive in content. AreJay 20:43, 30 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Support; my objections have been resolved satisfactorily. ~~Object.~~ British English vs. American English confusion: examples of "centre" and "center", etc. Lack of citations in several level two sections (only one in "Culture", nothing for the end of the geography section nor the economy section). Inconsistent dash use: I suggest using — exclusively, with no spaces, to separate clauses—like this. Prose problems as well: missing comma in "He, and many followers marched from his ashram to the coastal village of Dandi, to protest against the imposition of tax on salt"; basic grammar in "Madhupura is famous for it's traditional mojri footwear", "Ahmedabad has many institutes which promoting classical music and dance", "the use of bicycles, motorcycles and scooters, are popular", "The Ahmedabad Management Association, also founded by Sarabhai was established", etc. And I agree with the inline comments that the prose is often choppy. Cleanup and a good copyedit would be helpful. --Spangineer^es (háblame) 22:08, 30 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Please check this out. I've fixed most of your objections. If there are fresh or lingering points, please let us know. Rama's arrow 21:03, 31 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It's and Its can be confusing, but the difference is simple: use the contraction (it's) if you're actually contracting something (it is), and use its when you want to express possession (none of the other possessives—his, hers, theirs, mine, yours—have apostrophes either). Currently it's is misused throughout the text. Be wary of using search/replace—"itself" was changed to "it'self", which I don't think was intended, and a few noun plurals were changed as well (limit's, exit's). Also, an apostrophe was added to a link, which probably messed it up.

The prose is better, but could still use work:

Bicycles and motorcycles are the most popular medium of transport with most young people and students" ("most" used to qualify twice; avoid redundancy)
"A popular cultural event in Ahmedabad is the classical music festival organised by the Saptak School of Music on 1 January of every year, where vocalists and instrumentalists from across the world are invited to perform" --> "Musicians from around the world perform each year at the classical music festival held by Ahmedabad's Saptak School of Music". Half as many words and no important information lost.
I count 23 uses of "also" and 10 uses of "as well as". Excessive use of these suggests that the prose doesn't flow well. Reorganize paragraphs and sentences so that these poor connectors aren't needed.

Again, not bad, but more work is required. --Spangineer^es (háblame) 21:36, 31 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Again I've addressed your fresh points. Rama's arrow 22:15, 31 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Um, no you haven't. "It's" is still misused throughout, and all I see in that diff is systematic elimination of the words I mention, but not much of the "reorganize paragraph and sentences" nor eliminating redundancy. It isn't realistic to proofread a 40kb article in 25 minutes—the idea of FA status is quality, and that isn't attained by quick fixes. --Spangineer^es (háblame) 13:53, 1 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

No need to get testy. I wasn't attempting quick fixes, but you see, I think that the prose is good. While I've asked for help from other copyeditors, I need you to give me more specific clues as to the problems you want solved. Rama's arrow 16:58, 1 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Didn't mean to come across as testy; just as rather surprised that you considered my objection resolved. --Spangineer^es (háblame) 19:38, 2 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Has this objection been resolved? AreJay 21:23, 6 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, sorry about the delay. --Spangineer^es (háblame) 02:34, 7 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Support. I have also performed a copyedit to address the issues raised by Spangineer - see [1]. However, there are some red links that need to be filled in. Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 20:46, 1 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Comment - Thanks for the cpedit. At the time you made this comment, there were only 2 red links. I have linked Laddu to the respective wiki article. I don't have sufficient knowledge about Gujarati literature and hence am not able to de-red link it. - Aksi_great (talk - review me) 16:01, 2 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Support. After going through the entire article (copyediting on the way), I feel that the prose is good and up to the FAC mark now. -- Sundar ^{\talk \contribs} 11:55, 2 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Update - I have had yet another relook at the prose of the article. I found some cases with unnecessary use of words like "major". I couldn't find any place where the word "its" was misused. I used the test mentioned in this link to test the use of "its". Here are the changes I have made to the article. Do mention if still more work is required to be done. - Aksi_great (talk - review me) 14:44, 2 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I just did a brief copyedit of one section: things like "A popular story about the creation of Ahmedabad is that" can be replaced by "According to tradition", and "this has in turn raised serious challenges regarding the city's infrastructure and power supply" can be replaced by "this has challenged the city's infrastructure and power supply". There's more to be fixed. Check out User:Tony1/How to satisfy Criterion 2a; it's awesome.

There's still tons of hodge-podge information. This is probably worst in the history section, but I haven't checked the other sections. Try naming the topic sentence of this paragraph:

Ahmedabad became the capital of the new state of Gujarat after the bifurcation of the Bombay State on 1 May 1960. A large number of educational and research institutions were founded in the city, making it a major centre of higher education, science and technology. Ahmedabad's economic base was diversified with the establishment of heavy and chemical industries in its vicinity. In February 1974, Ahmedabad occupied the centre stage in national politics with the launch of the Nav Nirman agitation - a protest against a 20% hike in the hostel food fees at the L.D. College of Engineering that snowballed into a mass agitation to remove Chimanbhai Patel, then-chief minister of Gujarat, on charges of corruption.[7] There were two major anti-reservation protests in 1981 and 1985.[8]

First, the city becomes the capital. Then institutions are founded. Then the economic base is diversified (this one is somewhat connected via "major centre of... technology" == "chemical industries", but not really). Then there was the Nav Nirman agitation (hostel food fees? what?). Finally, with no attempt to connect the thoughts, there were two protests. How is all this stuff related, other than it happened in Ahmedabad between 1960 and 1985? A timeline is better suited for that; an encyclopedia article should do more. Was the Nav Nirman agitation related to the anti-reservation protests? Were the protests a result of the increased technology? The increased industry? The fact that it was now the capital? Surely there are books out there that analyze this period in the city's history and make conjectures about this. --Spangineer^es (háblame) 18:37, 2 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I have made changes to the above mentioned paragraph. I feel that I have adressed your point. The paragraph flows better now. I will look for more cases like this. - Aksi_great (talk - review me) 18:57, 3 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Support-Assuming that Spangineer's critiques will be acted on, I must say that I was delighted with the standard of this article. Well written and well organised. Congratulations, and I hope that other India-related articles to follow will equal this one. I've done a light copy-edit. Just a few comments:
It's way overlinked with dictionary items ("sport"?); I've removed a lot of those links.
Usually avoid "as well as".
multiplex? I'm unfamiliar with this term.
lakh sometimes within, sometimes outside parentheses.
"mildly chilly" weather-awkward expression.
"corporators"?
Inconsistent use of Oxford commas; I'd avoid them except where it would be ambiguous (nowhere in this article, I think).
"textile and garment" industries? Garment = clothing?
"artisan corporation"-unclear.
"Far East"-that's from the British perspective; I've changed it.

Nice. Tony 13:19, 3 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for your comments and support, Tony. We'd strive harder to make future India-related articles this good. Multiplex is a complex of moview theatres in numbers fewer than what a megaplex typically has. And the word is linked for anyone to check. Also, multiplexes are becoming popular in India and I haven't heard "megaplex" before. "Corporators" are elected members to local administration bodies like municipal corporations and corporations. I leave the other issues for others to handle. -- Sundar ^{\talk \contribs} 13:37, 3 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks a lot for the support. I will strive to get Spangineer's support too by the time this FAC ends. - - Aksi_great (talk - review me) 15:46, 3 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Update - The usage of lakh is now consistent throughout the article. Mildly chilly has been corrected. Textile and garment are separate industries. garment=clothing and textile=cloth. Atrisan corporations was a wrong usage. It should have been mercantile corporations and artisan guilds. I will address the issue about serial commas soon. Thanks. - Aksi_great (talk - review me) 19:18, 3 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Further update - I did not realise that you had embedded more comments in the text. I have edited the article accordingly and also addressed the issue of serial commas - see [2]. Thanks once again. - Aksi_great (talk - review me) 12:41, 4 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Support--Dwaipayan (talk) 13:59, 4 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Support - Lots of hard work and improvements in this one -- Lost ^(talk) 10:31, 5 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Support - a good article, any minor corrections that need doing, let me know on my talk page. --TheM62Manchester 10:33, 5 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: for the sake of consistency, please decide whether or not to put spaces on either side of mdashes, and stick to it the whole way through. Not a big deal though; I've switched to support. --Spangineer^es (háblame) 02:34, 7 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Done. Thanks for all the help. - Aksi_great (talk - review me) 11:31, 7 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Object - landmarks are poorly addressed --GoOdCoNtEnT 07:21, 8 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Can you please elaborate a bit on that object. I don't understand for what you are objecting. One or two examples of which landmarks you are talking about would help me. Thanks. - Aksi_great (talk - review me) 11:43, 8 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Comment:I have looked thoroughly at the article and couldn't find any landmarks to be poorly addressed. As you have not replied to the message I left on your talk page and also to the above comment, I am clueless as to what you want and why you objected. I feel that landmarks have been sufficiently addressed all over the article. Be it important bridges, roads, lakes or gardens. - Aksi_great (talk - review me) 15:51, 11 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I think what he means is that if you have one landmark, maybe it is not clear where in A'bad it is situated. We talk about Bhadra, Maninagar, etc., but maybe its not clear where Shahibaug's Moti Shahi Mahal, or the Ashram Road lies in all this. Rama's arrow 15:57, 11 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

But I don't think it is within the scope of this article to do that. That is why you need to go to the articles themselves. Take Ashram Road for example. If you click on the article you immediately know that the Ashram Road runs parallel to the Sabarmati and that the Sabarmati Ashram and the City Gold multiplex are important landmarks on that road. - Aksi_great (talk - review me) 16:05, 11 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Support – Gujarati literature could do with a stub. =Nichalp «Talk»= 18:40, 11 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Done. How can I ignore a request by you? - Aksi_great (talk - review me) 19:21, 11 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Strong Support Being a major photographic contributor to this article, I have closely observed its evolution to something that exemplifies Wikipedia's finest work. I held off from supporting till all the suggestions made were implemented. But now that the article has been satisfactorily improved according to the comments, I strongly support its FA promotion. Srikeit ^{(Talk | Email)} 19:05, 11 August 2006 (UTC) (cell)[reply]
Support A well written article about one of India's non metro cities. Does deserve to be a featured article. --Ageo020 03:04, 22 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]