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Wikipedia:AMA Requests for Assistance/Requests/September 2006/J.R. Hercules

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Wikipedian filing request:

Other Wikipedians this pertains to:

Wikipedia pages this pertains to:


Questions:

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Have you read the AMA FAQ?

  • Answer:Yes

How would you describe the nature of this dispute? (policy violation, content dispute, personal attack, other)

  • Answer:Strange combination of bullying and gross misconstruement of Wiki policy

What methods of Dispute Resolution have you tried so far? If you can, please provide wikilinks so that the Advocate looking over this case can see what you have done.

  • Answer:I questioned a couple of the above users on their talk pages concerning their rationale for their actions on my talk page. No reply, though the user who started this whole thing, Konstable, apparently decided to respond on their behalf by adding a warning on my talk page.

What do you expect to get from Advocacy?

  • Answer:1) I need some help in preventing the above individuals from further bullying me via my own user talk page; 2) I'd like to bring the behavior of the above individuals to the attention of other administrators. I don't know how to do that.

Summary:

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Short version of the story: Somehow, within the span of 10 minutes after I had posted a comment on Konstable's talk page and deleted his comments from my talk page, three separate users singled out my talk page (out of a few hundred thousand talk pages and 1.3 million articles on WP, somehow all three users just happened to hone in on mine), reverted my edits, and aggresively threatened to assess various penalties against me, barely explaining themselves, if at all.

The long version:

The problem began with a conflict between myself and Konstable, a new admin, on the Vladimir_Lenin talk page, concerning a NPOV banner I posted for the article. After Konstable removed the NPOV, and posted some criticisms of me on my talk page, I re-inserted the NPOV banner in the Lenin article. Konstable demanded that I justify my re-insertion, and, when I didn't respond fast enough to his liking, he posted on my talk page a second time. I read his comments, decided to do more research to justify why I inserted the NPOV tag in the Lenin article, and deleted Konstable's comments, as they weren't needed any longer.

Konstable didn't like that I deleted his comments on my talk page He then reverted the edits on my talk page, and posted a third comment , calling me "uncivil", etc. At this point, Konstable is manufacturing a confrontation that is independent of the Lenin article issue. So, taking his advice, I posted exactly the kind of detailed NPOV justification on the Lenin talk page that he requested, deleted (again) his comments on my user talk page, and posted on his own talk page a request that he not edit my talk page. (A few months ago, another user, an administrator, had made the very same request of me on the same issue of editing user talk pages, so there's precedent).

Then, the problems began. A few minutes after I deleted Konstable's comments, Hello32020 reverted my edits using the VP, with this rationale: "Please do not remove legitimate warnings from your talk page..." However, there wasn't a warning on my talk page in the first place. So, I deleted that comment, and posted a comment on Hello32020's talk page.

A few minutes later, my edits on my talk page were again reverted, this time by Chacor, who, despite not even being an administrator, warned me in following way: "Further violations of Wikipedia policy WILL get you blocked." Huh? I deleted that comment, too.

As if on cue, yet another user reverted my edits a few minutes after I had just made those edits, Glen S, an admin. Glen felt it necessary to threaten me, too. And for what, I do not know. I posted a response on his talk page with some questions about just what was going on. The same with Chacor.

Topping it all off, Konstable left yet another comment on my page, along with a formal warning, taking it upon himself to speak on behalf of the other users, calling me "uncivil" again, as well as incorrectly claiming that I "accused" him of something. (Since I didn't include mention of him in my comments on the other users' talk pages, it's strange that he would respond so defensively in that regard.)

Maybe an accusation is in order. I don't know if these guys are friends, members of the same Wiki club, if Konstable recruited other people to place my talk page on "watch" and take action in the event I edited it, or something else, but it's clear that these users are bullying me via my own talk page. So, I'm requesting an Advocate, because it's one user against four (two of whom are admins).

(The following two links to Wiki policy I include as reference. According to the statues of both, the users who are accusing me of uncivil conduct apparently violated several conditions themselves.)

Talk page vandalism Deleting the comments of other users from article Talk pages, or deleting entire sections thereof, is generally considered vandalism. Removing personal attacks is often considered legitimate, and it is considered acceptable to archive an overly long Talk page to a separate file and then remove the text from the main Talk page. The above does not apply to the user's own Talk page, where users generally are permitted to remove and archive comments at their discretion, except in cases of warnings, which they are generally discouraged from removing.

J.R. Hercules 00:45, 18 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Discussion:

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All the relevant discussion took place on AN/I, see this link. -Royalguard11(Talk·Desk) 00:32, 23 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Followup:

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When the case is closed, please take a minute to fill out the following survey:

Did you find the Advocacy process useful?

  • Answer: Yes

Did your Advocate handle your case in an appropriate manner?

  • Answer: Yes

On a scale of 1 to 5, how polite was your Advocate?

  • Answer: 5

On a scale of 1 to 5, how effective do you feel your Advocate was in solving the problem?

  • Answer: 4

On a scale of 1 to 5, how effective do you feel the Advocacy process is altogether?

  • Answer: 4

If there were one thing that you would like to see different in the Advocacy process, what would it be?

  • Answer: I was unsure of how to properly "close" the case -- when the Advocate requests that we do so, or when I, the client, makes that request, or before or after I complete feedback? I would make the step-by-step instructions on the FAQ or this page a bit clearer on the issue of closure.

If you were to deal with this dispute again, what would you do differently, if anything?

  • Answer:

If I had to deal with this type of dispute again, I might direct the parties involved to review the history of this present (now past) dispute, to clarify issues amongst everyone.

AMA Information

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Case Status: closed


Advocate Status:

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