User talk:Yumiko86

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This message was delivered automatically by your robot friend, HostBot (talk) 16:17, 29 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Welcome

Hello Yumiko, welcome to Wikipedia! Excellent work on Caste System in India. I hope to see more of your work in future too. Cheers, Kautilya3 (talk) 23:19, 12 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Watch what you say!

You said "trim to what is in the cite". When that was clearly not true. I take that very seriously because you just accused me of doctoring. Let alone the fact that I went into detail about it and that's all you said. The kicker is I paraphrased it word for word. There's no way I included anything else.

You then change it to mean something that's clearly not what the citation says. You remove the part of that's 'some of hard to shed' and removed the list of religions when it was there to serve a purpose. If you really read the citation you'd notice it doesn't say anything about Buddhists. Nether does any of your added citations.

So let's summarize, you accuse me of misrepresenting the citation. Then you go on to misrepresent it and add citations that doesn't even justify the changes.-- Everyone Dies In the End (talk) 20:59, 17 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Having liked Yumiko's edits in general, I thought I would check what this is all about.

Source: Over the centuries the system has been successively (but not always successfully) challenged by Buddhism, Islam, Sikhism, Christianity, and many reformist Hindu movements. Some caste identities are not easily shed, and caste-based differences are still to be found among Indian Sikhs, Muslims, Christians, and Jews.

Your version: Though caste is considered a dominant feature of Hinduism, in Indian context, it has been challenged by Buddhists, Muslims, Sikhs, Christians, and even reformist Hindus. However, the caste system is tough to get rid of and caste-based differences are still practiced in other religions in the Indian subcontinent like Christianity, Islam, Judaism and Sikhism.

Yumiko's version: The caste system has been challenged over time by Buddhists, Muslims, Sikhs, Christians, and many reformist movements in Hinduism. However, aspects of the caste system continue to exist in India in all these religions.

I see Buddhism in all three versions!
One fault in both your versions is that whereas the source talks about challenges from religions, you replaced them with the practitioners. This is actually wrong. The religious authorities have challenged caste, but the practice varies.

You are correct here and I'll change it back. -- Everyone Dies In the End (talk) 01:03, 18 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]

The idea that "caste identities are not easily shed" is the author's commentary. We are free to take or not take it. You seem to think it is important, but you haven't explained why.

I did say it's context that's need, but didn't go into detail. Simple, it shows the cultural nature of the caste. -- Everyone Dies In the End (talk) 01:03, 18 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]

You also seem to think it important to give the list of religions all over again. It is not clear why. (Right, Cohen's second list doesn't include Buddhists. That could be because the neo-Buddhists condemn it. But the traditional Buddhists did follow the caste identities as long as they lasted.)

You are correct here, but you can't shorten something when it includes Jews and removes another. You'll need to find another citation and to avoid confusion it's better to list it. You can't just compact it because you think it's true. You can only relist it and then cite any ones you want to add. This was not done. On a side note, I was going to add a citation about Buddhists as you were typing this. I'm going to do that now.-- Everyone Dies In the End (talk) 01:03, 18 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know why Yumiko said "trim to cite." I will leave it to him to explain.
Finally, is all this bombast necessary? - Kautilya3 (talk) 00:40, 18 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks. Since you recognize the "cultural" nature of caste, I think you understand the issues fine! (I am not being patronizing, but you would be surprised how many people have no clue about it!)

But, if caste is cultural rather than religious then the practitioners of the various religions would be right to ignore what the religious preachers say. So there may have been no effort to "shed" it at all. The commentary about it being "hard to shed" is thus unwarranted. - Kautilya3 (talk) 01:22, 18 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I definitely get what you're trying to say, but I'm not interpreting it as such. Getting others view points would be helpful.-- Everyone Dies In the End (talk) 03:42, 18 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]