User talk:Tyler j1992

Welcome!

Hello, Tyler j1992, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Unfortunately, one or more of the pages you created, such as Hottest 100 Australian Albums Of All Time, may not conform to some of Wikipedia's guidelines, and may soon be deleted.

There's a page about creating articles you may want to read called Your first article. If you are stuck, and looking for help, please come to the New contributors' help page, where experienced Wikipedians can answer any queries you have! Or, you can just type {{helpme}} on this page, and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Here are a few other good links for newcomers:

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you have any questions, check out Wikipedia:Questions or ask me on my talk page. Again, welcome! — Fly by Night (talk) 02:42, 30 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Proposed deletion of Hottest 100 Australian Albums Of All Time

The article Hottest 100 Australian Albums Of All Time has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

The article is about something that has not happened yet! That fails WP:CBALL and WP:TOOSOON. Even if this top 100 list had been published in full then notability would be a major issue.

While all contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, content or articles may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{proposed deletion/dated}} notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Removing {{proposed deletion/dated}} will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. The speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. — Fly by Night (talk) 02:42, 30 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Nomination of Hottest 100 Australian Albums Of All Time for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Hottest 100 Australian Albums Of All Time is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Hottest 100 Australian Albums Of All Time until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on good quality evidence, and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion template from the top of the article. — Fly by Night (talk) 14:14, 30 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hottest 100 Australian Albums Of All Time

I think I might have a solution. Check the talk page. — Fly by Night (talk) 01:42, 2 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I'm really impressed that you listened to my advice and that you followed common sense. You've proven yourself to be a well meaning editor. If there's anything that I can do to help you with this article, or any other article then click here to leave a message on my user talk page. I'm really impressed by your recent conduct, and I'd be really happy yo help you in the future… seriously! — Fly by Night (talk) 23:34, 2 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Thankyou very much, and thanks a lot for that offer, I may take you up on that in the future if the need arises.

Tyler j1992 (talk) 07:51, 3 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

AN/I Notice

Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you. — Fly by Night (talk) 07:43, 3 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the heads-up on that. I'll keep a close watch on the following proceedings.

Tyler j1992 (talk) 07:52, 3 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Copyright problem: User:Tyler j1992/Sandbox

Hi. Rather than the usual form letter, I just wanted to leave you a personal explanation of the copyright problem in this list. While factual lists are not copyrighted, lists based on personal opinion are. That includes "hottest" and "best" lists of this nature. (A more complete explanation is at the still-unfinished User:Moonriddengirl/Copyright in lists.) We have permission from the network to use some of their lists, but their permission was very specific as to which lists were included. It did not mention this one (understandably, since the permission was given in 2009), and without explicit permission or a general release we can't reproduce this list, I'm afraid.

Since the network was willing to license their content in the past, they may be willing to do so again. See Wikipedia:Requesting copyright permission if you'd like to ask them to do so. --Moonriddengirl ^(talk) 12:42, 3 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Fair enough, I'll send them a request as soon as I can. But I'm just wondering, if the permission was given in 2009, why are the lists made after that year still on Wikipedia? Shouldn't they too have been subjected to a copyright problem? Tyler j1992 (talk) 12:50, 3 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, they are. If you happen to know of any, please tag them or let me know where they are and I will. :) --Moonriddengirl ^(talk) 13:09, 3 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Considering the amount of work I've put in on them, it kills me to do so, haha, but here they are; 2009 (despite it's name, it was revealed in 2010) and 2010 (likewise, 2011).

I'll attempt to get this permission as soon as possible, but what sort of time is there between now and when action is taken upon any uncopyrighted articles? Tyler j1992 (talk) 13:15, 3 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks. :) I'm so sorry to have to be the bearer of bad news here! There's usually a week allowed, but sometimes longer, if permission looks like it might be forthcoming. And if the lists are abbreviated in the meantime, they can always be restored if permission comes later. If you write these people, it may be helpful to remind them that they gave us permission for all of the articles listed Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Triple_J_Hottest_100,_2009 and just to ask them if they can give us open-ended permission for their lists. If they do that, we'll not have to trouble them every time they release a new list. :/ --Moonriddengirl ^(talk) 13:23, 3 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Technically, the 2009 article may be covered (weird, I know; the article looked like this when we received the permission, but it is specifically named), but if they do a general release there won't be any questions of whether its only covered on a technicality. That would be fabulous for future use as well. --Moonriddengirl ^(talk) 13:32, 3 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Alrighty, that is a little odd, but understandable all the same. I'm currently emailing an offical of the radio station in order to request the permission, and judging by their enthusiasm to grant copyright last time, it shouldn't be too much of a problem, fingers crossed! Tyler j1992 (talk) 13:42, 3 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Um, what is the "personal opinion" of a poll where the results are released into the public domain by a freely broadcast radio station? It is the factual counting of votes, just like the results of a football match is the factual counting of scores. There is no creative content or personal opinion here at all. It isn't a "best list" as determined by the radio station program director or any small group of people. Does every person who voted own copyright? Or does a poll organiser automatically hold copyright over the results - AFAIK, most pollsters restrict access to details of opinion poll results, but whatever results they release are widely reported and used by all. Moony, I normally would bow to your view on copyright, but I think you got this one wrong - at least with your message here - personal opinion isn't at all in play. The-Pope (talk) 15:55, 3 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I understand your doubt. :) I wasn't sure about this one myself, which is why I asked our attorney specifically about polls when we had this conversation back in March (see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Classic 100 original (ABC)). She indicated that creative copyright does exist in survey lists of these types because the surveyors set the parameters. She said, with respect to survey lists, that "any use of them should be guided by fair use principles". --Moonriddengirl ^(talk) 16:06, 3 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I'd be careful about using other polls as precedents - they aren't all the same. Whilst I didn't poll in this one, generally there is no list provided, the only parameters are that a) it's an album and b) it's by an Australian artist. Polling that is profitable, as mentioned on the ANI page by Chris, generally is carefully controlled questions with multiple choice answers designed to discover specific facts. This is a broad, open-ended question with no tight parameters. I'm still not seeing any creativity that could be considered copyrightable. But this is just telling me that I should run away from any future copyright issue because few make any sense to logical, rational people. The lawyers can have it to themselves. The-Pope (talk) 16:18, 5 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Copyright Result

Have you had feedback from the copyright holders? — Fly by Night (talk) 04:22, 10 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Still nothing. The ABC website said to allow 4 weeks for a reply, which is a little disheartening, but I left a message with Triple J too. So I guess we can't do anything until they get back to me. Tyler j1992 (talk) 06:12, 10 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

That's right. I've hidden the list using {{collapsetop}} and {{collapsebottom}}. People were adding material to the article and completing the list. They were just ignoring the copyright issues. I'll be keeping an eye on things. It'd be great if you could too. — Fly by Night (talk) 07:08, 10 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Given this change of details, should I update the template that gets used each year? (Okay, I'm usually the one who does this, and the template is in my sandbox.) --JB Adder | Talk 23:13, 18 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]