User talk:Seandotng

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16:04, 29 August 2019 (UTC)

Request for Assistance on Noticed Vandalism and Editing Bias

Hello, User:Bri

I'm asking for assistance for you to look into the edits and reverts by User:Seandotng on pages:

1. Kevin Liliana 2. Vanessa Ponce 3. Jolene Marie Rotinsulu 4. Jesica Fitriana

for the following reasons:

1. I have updated information on these pages wholly sourced and referenced (provided articles from legitimate news/media outlets/outfits for each update), but this contributor keeps on reverting these edits to the previous ones that are un-sourced and un-clarified

2. He has erased a paragraph of wholly sourced information on the Kevin Liliana page without valid reason, only stating that "It is not needed for the bio" when it is factual.

3. This is just an observation but I think he is leaning on editing bias, as I have observed that he only edits mostly Indonesian beauty titleholders. I am not going ahead of myself here and I am still not wholly particular with editing biases within Wikipedia, but I think I've read that anyone related to the organization or the person in question (subject of the page/article) should be looked into as they might be biased in editing. Again, I am not concluding that he is, but his actions can only be interpreted as leaning on bias.

4. His reverts are mostly, if not all, invalid, reverting updates/edits that are aptly sourced and referenced and preferring instead the old edits without ANY sources or references.

5. If you are going to look into his profile here on Wikipedia and Wikimedia, [[1]] - he is affiliated with "Mustika Ratu Coorp" that is with the same organization as the Miss Indonesia (Universe) (Puteri Indonesia) Organization. Isn't there a conflict of interest here? This person is directly with the organization that is the agency for these subjects Kevin Liliana, Jolene Marie Rotinsulu, and Jesica Fitriana. Shouldn't we be wary that he is editing said pages, as these might be an avenue for biased editing?

I am still learning my way here on Wikipedia, but I hope to contribute and contribute well. I am trying to edit with only facts, and with factual neutrality. But I will not stand for contributors who are editing only with biases.

Thanks. I hope to hear you soon on this.Migsmigss (talk) 15:20, 7 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Well Glad that you're approaching me here, well as Malaysian, I do understand how to speak and read the sources that you're currently used for this pages article. Because most of the sources that you're using right now is in Bahasa Indonesia. For me im just wanted to make it right and helping to make it right, and i think that you must read it (right source) carefully. Especially changing about their height: 1. for Jolene Marie Rotinsulu page, based on the sources that you're currently using right now is in Bahasa Indonesia, it tells that (red:Jolene Marie) she's 173cm - 175cm tall, not 168 cm like you said before. So i hope you make it right, since I read it based on your sources. But then maybe you're mistaken, the one that has 165/168cm tall is Frederika Alexis Cull. Maybe you're mistaken to read and editing it. Just now I saw that you're make it correct, Jolene Marie with 173-175 cm tall and please change Frederika Alexis Cull with 165-168 cm tall. 2. Kevin Lilliana & Vanessa Ponce, I felt like it doesnt need to tell that much information, especially not connected with the pageant itself (Miss International 2017), guess that you must check the previous winners wikipedia page, but if maybe you want to add some more paragraph, should put it first on talk page or sandbox for disscuss it with another Wikipedia users and editors, so it could be more accurated and right in the future to be published.

Thanks. I hope we can coorporate togetehr as an editor, and nice to know you.Seandotng (talk) 11:37, 7 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the reply, User:Seandotng. And thanks for the clarification. But why did you:

1. Delete one whole paragraph from the Kevin Liliana page which is appropriately sourced and referenced, and using only the invalid reason "not needed in BIO" when it is obviously factual and relevant to the subject and subheading of the page?

2. Why do you revert to old edits that are un-sourced, yet do not accept sourced/referenced edits? The references used are both in Bahasa and in English, so language isn't an excuse here.

3. Edits that are factual, such as their training, Vanessa's record of being the oldest Miss World thus far, Kevin's tutelage with a beauty camp, you chose to delete, though they are factual and are supported by references, yet you include information that need references/sources? If you want to include new information, please provide sources from legitimate news/media outfits.

4. I have read in your Wikimedia upload of a photo/image of Kevin Liliana that you are working for the Mustika Ratu Coorp., which is affiliated and a sponsor of the Puteri Indonesia Organization - isn't this something to look into, since this might be an avenue for editing bias?

5. You have posted in talk pages of editors asking for help about my edits, which are all sourced and referenced, all from legitimate news/media outlets, yet you specifically point out that I'm "Filipino?" Is that part of the subject at hand, and even if I were or I were not, (I am Spanish residing in the United States), isn't it xenophobic of you to include a presumed nationality of an editor even if it is not part of the discussion and has no relevance to the editing activities/issues at hand?

Please clarify. Thanks.Migsmigss (talk) 15:49, 7 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Hallo Migsmigss (talk For that Kevin Lilliana Picture, Im work as a photographer and all of my pictures and photoworks are mine, but I'm upload it for free, no rights, so everyone could have an access for re-publication my works. P.S. I'm not work on Mustika Ratu Coorp., Im just taking that picture for their brand for FREE, and I'm the one who wanted to upload it, so there's no one who's pushing me to upload it online (red: wikipedia). Hope you understand. Well, Thank You for making the editing clear and correct, I'm just checking about their right height, you're already mention it right: Frederika with 165 cm, Jolene with 173 cm and Vanesa Ponce with 170 cm. And for Kevin Lilliana it's okay if you want to undo the edit. I'm totally okay after checking your sources. Thanks. Any other Question, I hope we're clear and cool now. Have a good day. Thanks.Seandotng (talk)

Thanks for the reply, Seandotng. In the future, when you edit or make edit reverts, please make sure you are doing so with facts, and with sources or references. We cannot allow edits or reverts that are invalid and with invalid reasons. Only factual, sourced, and referenced edits are valid and acceptable. Please strive to go against editing bias or vandalism. Again, always use legitimate sources and references, so that we won't have any problems with edits.

Also, I don't care whether you're Indonesian or any other nationality. What I care about is professionalism, factual editing, and contributing to the contents without any bias, vandalism, or malice.

Also, please do not delete WHOLE PARAGRAPHS that are rightfully and aptly sourced and referenced without any valid reason. The reason you provided "Not needed in Bio" is invalid, as the paragraph is clearly substantial to the overall contents of the subject/page.

Thank you. All the best to you and to Indonesia. Migsmigss (talk) 16:04, 7 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

By the way, for your information I'm Malaysian, not Indonesian. And ya Its nice to know you I think we have the same field on editing Wikipedia Page, it's nice to know that. Have a great day ahead and hoping that we can work together someday on editing the pages here. Your advices really means a lot to me. Thanks.Seandotng (talk)

Oh, i found some fact that Frederika Alexis Cull are 20 years old, not 19 years old. based on this post by official verified account (https://www.instagram.com/p/B3N7HbWFRc1/) and (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEyrDT5CA5o). Shows that her birthday is on 5 october 1999 and she's not teenager anymore. Thanks.Seandotng (talk)

Thanks for the reply and for taking note of what we've disccused. Your nationality isn't relevant in this discussion, so I don't have any comment. Looking forward to seeing your edits, too. Terimah kasih.Migsmigss (talk) 16:13, 7 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Good. Now you can use that as reference for your edits. Thanks. As long as there are legitimate references, everything is good. Terimah kasih.Migsmigss (talk) 16:14, 7 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Seandotng. Oh, those are YouTube and Instagram sources. Please find a news article. Instagram and YouTube videos are not primary or reliable sources. Terimah kasih. Migsmigss (talk) 16:15, 7 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Oh okay, i will find another sources then, i will let you know if i found one already, hehe. thanks. Seandotng (talk)

Seandotng I've archived our discussion on my Talk page since we're discussing here and have covered much more here on your Talk page, so I'd appreciate it if you don't archive this. After all, we're still to hear from Bri on vandalism and editing bias. Please let me know your thoughts. Or would you like to discuss somewhere else? Maybe make a neutral talk page, is that possible? Terimah kasih. Migsmigss (talk) 16:44, 7 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Migsmigss make a neutral talk page? like what? i think this talk page is set in public so everyone could see it and its not save for privacy of discussion actually. Or would you like to discuss somewhere else? alright, cannn! haha maybe do you have any idea so I can reach your contact? Thanks before. Seandotng (talk)

All right, then, Seandotng. So we'll just keep this here, as a discussion. Thanks. And have a great time contributing. Remember, our greatest weapon is sources and references. All the best. Terimah kasih.Migsmigss (talk) 17:22, 7 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Just dropping in here as I was pinged/notified on my talkpage. It looks like you are discussing, which is very good. If there are continuing content issues I'd urge you to discuss them on the relevant article's talkpage. If you need to use them, the community has worked out some good ways to resolve situations. ☆ Bri (talk) 00:57, 8 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the reply, Bri. And yes, looks like we've resolved most of the things enumerated. Thanks for dropping by and replying. Appreciate it.Migsmigss (talk) 01:09, 8 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

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