User talk:Scalhotrod/Archive 21

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Ping

With all that has been going on I didn't know if you saw the questions I asked here. But since I was hoping to resolve our dispute over what sources were acceptable, I thought I would point it out explicitly. Thenub314 (talk) 16:38, 6 May 2014 (UTC)

Yes, sorry, I missed that. Thank you for the heads up. That's going to take some time to respond and I'll have to get to it when I have more time to respond. --Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (talk) 16:44, 6 May 2014 (UTC)

Understood, I will be patient. Thenub314 (talk) 16:46, 6 May 2014 (UTC)

That's always appreciated... :) --Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (talk) 16:47, 6 May 2014 (UTC)

OK, where were we... --Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (talk) 16:05, 8 May 2014 (UTC)

We were in a disagreement about what sort of sources were acceptable. You said that one criteria was if an author was Notable and had their own WP page. You suggested perhaps other criteria could be used and I was wondering what other criteria were acceptable to you, so I could find choose references on which we both agreed were appropriate instead of just arguing about it each time I added something. Thenub314 (talk) 16:10, 8 May 2014 (UTC)

:) I remember, that was just my way of announcing that I was working on a reply, but thank you for the synopsis... :) --Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (talk) 16:12, 8 May 2014 (UTC)

Assault weapons ban article's name

Re renaming Assault weapons ban as "Assault weapons legislation": WP:V, WP:RS and the majority of the general populace call them assault weapons bans. Please start a discussion on that article's talk page, with sources supporting the change, if you want to consider changing its name. Thanks. Lightbreather (talk) 21:04, 5 May 2014 (UTC)

Do you worry or even consider how much evidence you're piling up against yourself for a case of WP:OWNERSHIP to be made for a myriad of articles? --Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (talk) 21:12, 5 May 2014 (UTC)

Those in glass houses... Thenub314 (talk) 21:24, 5 May 2014 (UTC)

Indeed, but I'm not the one who has authored most of these articles nor am I trying to accomplish anything other than an adherence to policy. --Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (talk) 21:28, 5 May 2014 (UTC)

Ownership? No. WP:STEWARDSHIP? Yes. Also, you might want to review Examples of ownership behavior. ... What I'm seeing in regards to this topic - and have seen for some months - is a push by a number of editors who don't seem to want to acknowledge to Wikipedia readers that there are in-force assault weapons bans, or that there ever was any assault weapons ban except for the federal ban that expired 10 years ago. Lightbreather (talk) 21:45, 5 May 2014 (UTC)

User Sue Rangell was the first that I am aware of to make the statement and I've seen others do so in regard to your recent editing. I happen to share that opinion. I'm not really interested in wasting time putting together the difs and evidence to report it.

As for your observation, that's an entirely different situation. Its one thing to have an opinion or to edit with a purpose, but outright stating a bias or a POV is never a good thing unless you're trying to be sanctioned. It has happened previously, you wouldn't be the first. --Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (talk) 21:57, 5 May 2014 (UTC)

It's quite simple really: If you don't want to be bothered with providing diffs, keep your comments on content and not on character. You might want to read WP:WIAPA. Lightbreather (talk) 22:06, 5 May 2014 (UTC)

You mean like here and your above statement. --Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (talk) 17:33, 8 May 2014 (UTC)

Not sure what you mean by "like here." Another editor started that discussion, about me, on an article talk page. I did reply to that, there. When I wanted to talk about your behavior, I came here, to your talk page. It was between me and you. As for ownership, no-one owns that article, but you have unilaterally moved and renamed it without discussion against WP:MOVE, and despite having an open Requested move process underway, continue to edit as if the process is completed and decided in your preferred way. Lightbreather (talk) 18:12, 8 May 2014 (UTC)

Suggestion about copyright

I am a bit rusty at these things, but I wanted to make a suggestion to you. It looked like you copy and pasted some text in this edit. Technically speaking, that is only acceptable with WP copyright if you provide attribution to the authors by giving at least a link where the author's names can be found. In the edit above there was a link to the main article so all is good. But at WB we recommend put something like "Copying from [[Page name]]" in the edit summary. Just something to think about. Thenub314 (talk) 00:25, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

Ah, good idea, thanks. What does LB think of it? --Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (talk) 00:31, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

No idea. It may not even be standard operating WP procedure. One of the side affects of bouncing around lots of different WM projects is that I occasionally mix up local policies/procedures. I am sure you could ask him though.Thenub314 (talk) 02:22, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

You mean "she", Lightbreather is female. You're better off asking her than me, I consider even collegial communication with her a lucky occurrence and not the norm. --Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (talk) 16:30, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

3RR

I doubt it's necessary, but consider this a friendly neighbourhood 3RR notice for Gun politics in the United States. Nomoskedasticity (talk) 20:17, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

Actually Nomoskedasticity, I consider it a taunt or a dare on your behalf. After an editor with a stated bias toward this subject matter reverted the removal of the text for policy based reasons, you then placed this notice on my page. Lightbreather has a history of activity of stacking Users in her favor and bringing in other Users to support her causes. I really hate digging into someones WP history, but you've put yourself into the fray. Have you checked Lightbreathers edit history? Its enlightening in many ways. --Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (talk) 20:58, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

Better yet, please join in the discussion that we are having in the section above, it concerns this specific text... --Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (talk) 21:05, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

I came here to 3RR warn you and found this. "Lightbreather has a history of activity of stacking Users in her favor and bringing in other Users to support her causes." Per WP:WIAPA, "Serious accusations require serious evidence." I'd like you to retract that statement, and I'm asking you again for I've-lost-count-of-how-many times to STOP saying things about me without notifying me so that I may defend myself. Lightbreather (talk) 22:33, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

Also, prior to reviewing today's history on the GPUS article, I'd never heard of Nomoskedasticity before. Lightbreather (talk) 22:35, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

ANI Notice

There is currently a discussion at Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. The thread is Personal attacks. Thank you. —Lightbreather (talk) 23:44, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

Would you consider a self revert?

Look, I am trying hard to work with you and find sources we both agree are reliable. When you took this out, you may not have noticed that one of the people being sourced was Chip Berlet. He has achieved enough recognition to have his own wikipedia page. He was reviewing 4 books, from various political points of view, for a respected academic journal. He stated that all four books agreed on this point that was in the article. The books would be primary sources, he would be a secondary source because he is summarizing them, and he is an expert in the field and would point out if he felt this was a factually incorrect point. This has to tick all the WP:RS boxes. Thenub314 (talk) 19:04, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

Sorry if my edit comes across as over zealous, but that content has numerous problems. First, its mixing issues out of context via the commonality of the 1994 AWB. The paragraph starts with content about a criminal act and the illegal use of firearms by a mentally ill person. Then it leaps over to the militia movement citing two government debacles. How these incidents could be put in the same paragraph confounds me as anything other than what I have come to understand as the tactics of the extremist gun control (gun banning) movement. Its one of the sneakiest forms of WP:SYNTH I've seen.

Does the content have a place in the article, probably, but not in that paragraph. What part of the content would you like to keep? I'm happy to work with you to figure out good placement for it. --Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (talk) 19:16, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

The only opinion I zealously hold is that 0.999...=1. If placement is the issue, then let's address placement. I do not intend to imply anything good or bad about the militia movement, but it really picked up steam at some point, and many people have wondered why. The new legislation about gun control followed by some royal government screw ups where people died (with gun issues being an important factor)... it is almost a no brainer. But it is important, and should be included and sourced. I meant no subtle implication of mental instability. Thenub314 (talk) 05:08, 10 May 2014 (UTC)

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I see your olive branch, and raise you a dove

Lightbreather (talk) has given you a dove! Doves promote WikiLove and hopefully this one has made your day happier. Spread the WikiLove by giving someone else a dove, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past (this fits perfectly) or a good friend. Cheers!

---

Spread the peace of doves by adding {{subst:Peace dove}} to someone's talk page with a friendly message!

Thank you, and yes, a Mother's Day greeting is appropriate. I was not aware of these templates, but your post prompted me to go look for more, so I thank you for that. I am happy to resume peaceful, WP:CIVIL relations. --Lightbreather (talk) 04:22, 12 May 2014 (UTC) Thank you, I look forward to the peace as well... :) --Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (talk) 04:26, 12 May 2014 (UTC)

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Re your edit summary at Talk:Gun control

If you have something to say, use the proper channels - though why anyone would take the post of a semi-literate self-declared 'American historian' seriously I have no idea. Someone's sock more than likely. AndyTheGrump (talk) 17:46, 14 May 2014 (UTC)

I have no idea and its not something I intend to speculate about either. I just thoroughly enjoy your antics... :) I've likened you to a teacher I had in high school many years ago. His name was brother Alfred and he was part of the Brothers of the Holy Cross order here in Northern California. I have never personally encountered a clergy person who was more despised (even by the schools administrators) for his outspoken opinions regarding the school itself and the Catholic church in general. Yet he was also very well respected by a small group of people who took the time to understand the motives behind his antics. I learned over the years that sometimes he did go too far and was forced to apologize or "be retired" from teaching which he begrudgingly did, but it never stopped him. --Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (talk) 18:01, 14 May 2014 (UTC)