User talk:Sadenia

Welcome...

Hello, Sadenia, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like this place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your username and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or place {{helpme}} on your talk page and ask your question there. You may also be interested in seeing our intuitive guide to Wikipedia. Again, welcome! Oneiros (talk) 16:04, 11 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Please read WP:BLP and especially WP:AUTO, if you really are Eddi.--Oneiros (talk) 16:04, 11 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

April 2009

If you have a close connection to some of the people, places or things you have written about on Wikipedia, you may have a conflict of interest. In keeping with Wikipedia's neutral point of view policy, edits where there is a conflict of interest, or where such a conflict might reasonably be inferred from the tone of the edit and the proximity of the editor to the subject, are strongly discouraged. If you have a conflict of interest, you should avoid or exercise great caution when:

editing or creating articles related to you, your organization, or its competitors, as well as projects and products they are involved with;
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avoid breaching relevant policies and guidelines, especially those pertaining to neutral point of view, verifiability of information, and autobiographies.

For information on how to contribute to Wikipedia when you have conflict of interest, please see our frequently asked questions for organizations. For more details about what, exactly, constitutes a conflict of interest, please see our conflict of interest guidelines. Thank you. Beeblebrox (talk) 16:54, 19 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Eddi, thanks for your input to the Eddi Reader article, but please read the introductions on editing mentioned above and check my latest edits to learn ways to improve your edits. Also what would really help the article and the articles on your records would be a free image of you and better (free) images of the covers of your records. And of course a Mirmama article. Thanks.--Oneiros (talk) 23:22, 19 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

May 2009

Welcome to Wikipedia. Although everyone is welcome to contribute constructively to the encyclopedia, adding content without citing a reliable source, as you did to Syd Barrett, is not consistent with our policy of verifiability. Take a look at the welcome page to learn more about contributing to this encyclopedia. If you are familiar with Wikipedia:Citing sources, please take this opportunity to add references to the article. Thank you. --Avant-garde a clue-hexa Chord ² 21:27, 4 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Cumann na mBan

Hi, Sadenia. Thank you for the kind words. I had to smile when you said "I imagine you are a real historian to me the amateur". Compare that to what this fellow said! Anyway, I'm sorry for reverting your edit on Cumann na mBan, but there were a number of problems with it.

Content should not be added to the lead of an article. The lead is intended as the summary of the article. The information about C na mB in Britain, while interesting, distorted the lead by making it appear as though it was a multinational organisation of which Ireland was only a small part, while in fact the opposite is true. Instead, the information on branches in Scotland should have been added to the "Formation" section, and the information on Margaret Skinnider etc. added to the "Role in 1916 Easter Rising" section.
All content that is added needs to be verifiable by reference to reliable sources. In other words, every statement should be followed by a reference. Help:Footnotes shows you how to add refs, but basically what you do is type <ref> after the sentence (after the full stop), then, say, the book's author, title and page number, or the web page's url and title, and then </ref>. So, for some of the content you added, you could cite this book, and that would look like this: <ref>Ann Matthews, [https://books.google.com/books?id=pzYkTYi3JRgC&pg=PA114 Renegades: Irish Republican Women 1900-1922], p. 114</ref>. Here is another possible source, and that would look like this: <ref>[http://www.irishheritagefoundation.org/news/report-of-cumann-na-mban-talk-in-glasgow.aspx Report of Cumann na mBan talk in Glasgow - Irish Heritage Foundation]</ref>. BMH witness statements can be referenced thus: <ref>Bureau of Military History, [http://www.bureauofmilitaryhistory.ie/reels/bmh/BMH.WS0696.pdf Witness Statement 696 (Henry O'Hagan)], p. 7</ref>. Other things you added, such as that "some members did not apply for an Irish Pension or medal", I can't find a source for, and things like that couldn't be added unless you found a reliable source. Unfortunately, as well, trunks that you found in your great-uncle's attic do not count as reliable sources, no matter how important he was. That falls under the no original research policy.
All caps should not be used in any circumstances, even – or especially – in edit summaries. It comes across as shouting, and leaves a bad impression on readers. When I see an edit like yours, I will often fix what needs to be fixed rather than simply reverting. But in your case I reverted, partly because there were big claims in it with no refs, but largely because of the all caps, which left me thinking I was not perhaps dealing with a reliable contributor. Obviously, I was wrong there. If you only take one thing away from my post, I hope it will be that you drop the all caps.

I envy you your treasure trove, and I look forward to reading your publication when it comes out. By the way, there is no hierarchy here, and you don't ever need to apologise to me or anybody else for being bold. Also, if you want, you can reply to me here. I'll be watching this page. Fond regards. Scolaire (talk) 13:03, 12 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I have no Idea what 'sign your posts' or '4 Tides' means so I hope this works. 'Amateur' is accurate for me. haha. I managed to sign up to contribute in 2009 but have not explored how since then.. I will learn.

I would love your help in making all this archive available to Wikipeadia. The resource is immense and should be freely shared. Gt Uncle Seamus Reader was writing a book before he died. It was called THE SECRET REVOLUTIONARY HISTORY OF SCOTLAND I have learned much about SCOT/IRISH connections through the centuries. Mainly it starts in 1700 until his birth in 1898 after which he describes the times he was alive in and the main characters of the Irish (and British) revolutionary period that he became acquainted with. He is a good story teller and I am in Countess Markiavicz's kitchen having that jam sandwich with James Connolly along side my 18 yr old Great uncle. He is fair and observant in his honest recounting. First an foremost a Boy Scout with a love of historical accuracy. If I can be of any use to you I will figure out how to send you some scanned copy. cheers Eddi xxxx (Sadenia is my sunday name)

Sadenia (talk) 13:28, 12 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Unfortunately, there is no way to make your archive "available to Wikipedia". The No original research policy says that only published sources can be used on Wikipedia so, much as I would love to help you, it's against policy. The only thing I can do is, if you tell me stuff, I could see if it's already published somewhere and we could use that. Frustrating, I know, but them's the rules. Scolaire (talk) 15:24, 12 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Is this right?

Is this ME replying.. ? just getting my head around it all...

In regards to the MULTI national aspect of Cmban.... Not to take it from its beginnings or its definate Irish majority. Hut its a bit like saying the suffragettes were an english concern only. I bow to your knowledge about the Heading summery ... totally ok...

Maybe there should be ANOTHER page dedicated and linked to the Multi national aspects of cmban... If I knew how to post you some pics I would send you one I have of the Suffragettes and POSSIBLY members of Cmban Outside the old Duke Street Prison in Glasgow protesting the internment of political prisoners and anti conscription prisoners. I think there was a lot of cross memberships of many of the political groups at that time. In regards to verification... Im still not sure how to do that.. I assume its that 'link' sign, nevertheless, in the Irish Military archives I fished out 47 Scottish women members of Cmban here ... Dundee, Falkirk, Lanark, Uddingston, Glasgow south north east and west.

Of course I have my great aunties silver Cmban brooch... and nothing else on her because she didnt apply for a pension or a medal. But I have the date and times of the events that she worked on behalf of the Cmban, written by my Gt Unc her husband. Margaret Skinnider was not the first Scot to be involved in the Cmban, Sarah O'Kane is a large figure and Julia Foy may or may not have been a member but as a merchant of clothing she supplied the Irish Citizens Army and the Scots/ Irish and Irish Volunteers with overcoats, which she sewed hidden pockets into. Its not just the Scot women who are in danger of being wiped out of the memory of the Story of Irelands independence but the Scot, English and Welsh who helped also.

I went recently to a relatives of Kimmage Garrison affair. I discovered that even in Dublin there was no mention of Kimmage in their official commemorations. Kimmage was were most of the Scots and English involved in action went in 1916.

I think of Samuel Kesslor a European in Thistle Street Glasgow who was the Scot/Irish Volunteers connection to arms from Europe.

I think of Joseph Sokowloski a Jewish man who had a Leather goods workshop in the Gallowgate and Claythorn Street and supplied my Gt Unc with Sam Brown Belts and arms.

I think of Grace Lally of Swizz Cottage London and the Girls /Women who helped those in Frognosh, Wales and Reading near London. maintain links with the Organisations

I am eager to address all of this and Wikipedia seems the Encyclopedia which could elevate their hidden stories.

Emotionally I reckon the UK are frightened to take on board the Republicanism in the UK in 1916. that there was even an E.R.A. (English Republican Army and a Scot one). Also Irelands story may be biased in favour of promoting an Irish only victory for freedom from ancient occupying empire.

I dont know why its hidden, but I reckon the more clarity the better.. Thanks again for helping future children know the whole truth. eddi xxx

OPPS I used caps.. I read your advice after I posted.. sorry.. haha xxx

I understand that until this Gt Uncs writings are published along with his references most of which are published, albeit, some are now out of print, I have managed to find some of the references.

But to be honest I am not confident enough to publish on here yet. After the BBC morning I tried and messed up as you have noticed. I will learn I hope.

eddi xxx

To answer your questions first of all: Yes, when you put something under my post, that is you replying. If you start with a colon (:), that will indent it (move it a bit to the right), which will make the conversation easier to read. If I have indented (like here), you would add two colons (::) to indent your reply a bit more, and so on.

The tilde is the ~ sign. On my keyboard it is Shift+#, which is just above the shift key on the right. If you put four of those together (~~~~) after your post each time it will come out as your "signature" – your username, your talk page and the date.

Okay, to get back to what you're asking me: it's important to see the difference between an organisation being in Ireland and it being about Ireland. The C na mB in Glasgow and Falkirk may have been made up of people who weren't born in Ireland, but they would have been from Irish families, and its object was still Irish independence. Even Germans and Jews who gave assistance to the organisation were aiding the Irish movement, they weren't aiding global revolution or even revolution in Britain. So, talking about the multi-national aspects of C na mB is not really right. It was part of the one Irish nationalist movement. There might have been support for Scottish or English nationalism, but that would have been secondary.

You didn't mess up. There were problems with your edit but nothing that couldn't be fixed. Practice makes perfect. Scolaire (talk) 16:41, 12 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

(::)(Sadenia (talk) 17:01, 12 December 2016 (UTC)) By George.. I think I've got it???[reply]

Sadenia (talk) 17:02, 12 December 2016 (UTC) nope?[reply]

Sadenia (talk) 17:03, 12 December 2016 (UTC) I think I got it[reply]

Sadenia (talk) 17:03, 12 December 2016 (UTC) thanks Peter xx[reply]

Sadenia (talk) 17:04, 12 December 2016 (UTC) Im off to delve into the end of year 1922. The poor Scots are sickened with the news from Ireland x[reply]

By George, she's got it! By the way, this might be worth a look, if you can find it at your local library (or on Amazon). Scolaire (talk) 17:21, 12 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Sadenia (talk) 18:26, 12 December 2016 (UTC) P.S. FYI --Not to be pedantic but these revolutionaries who were Irish Sympathizers in Scotland were not, as a rule, from 'Irish Families'. As exampled by my (Protestant-born-of-Scottish-parents-and-grandparents (one English grannie)) Great Uncle Seamus Reader.[reply]

All will become more balanced when these assumptions of cultural allegiance are distinct from:- the drive for fairness, no conscription, equality of class, gender, creed and workers rights.

In this, I take a firm stance now that I have read my Great uncle corroborated words. I think to assume that only a family connection to Ireland was the cause of Irish sympathy, is to do disservice to the intentions everyone had, and the state of the anger at working conditions and human rights during both Boer Wars. The jingoism and slaughter of women and children of the Boer farmers.

I'm now convinced that the fear of coming conscription was the driving force behind, what I now believe was a British revolution. As unbelievable as it may sound I believe there would have been no Easter Rising if there was no threat of conscription.

The drive to create a citizens army and a Fianna as opposed to a territorial force. The desire to connect with cultural heritage which was being slowly but surely eliminated and replace with an Anglisized version in everyday Irish life, (but not so much in Scotland-royalty loved it too much), all seemed to contribute.

I would never have believed I would be talking like this 4 years ago. But its clear to me now assumptions have ruled over general knowledge facts in regards to this period.

I questioned everything Seamus Reader put to me. One question I thought of when he presented his facts, I will put to you. This question opened my mind a little more:-

Why do you believe Lloyd George wished to hold Treaty talks?

The British force was 10 times as great as the Irish volunteers in 1921. Do you really think nothing worried the British War cabinet about the Bloody Friday January hand to hand battle in Georges Square 1919?

This question led me to agree that a British revolution was beginning to erupt and was progressing through the Irish assertion for cultural confidence and further revolutionary ingredients when political pressure was failing. This was also the temperature of Glasgow and Scotland. Low wages and the threat of conscription, brought Scot men and women into revolutionary ingredients.

By 1921 it was deftly stopped by the British cabinet. Also the downright stupidity of the attempted rescue of Frank Carty from Duke Street Prison in the High street Glasgow 1921, by one Coy of Irish Volunteers, that Seamus Reader and Liam Mellows (in Glasgow at that time) tried to stop, resulted in the killing of a Glasgow policeman and the arrest and round ups of revolutionary groups in the City after the Treaty, and worse the destruction of any sympathy many Scots previously felt for the revolutionary movement in Ireland and on the Clyde. Due to killing that policeman I notice the unravelling of the connection between the revolutionaries.

The assumption was they were all 'Irish' adds fog to the confused history.

The whole debate became an Anglo - Irish affair. As Scotland stepped back. Then the Irish civil war which Mick Collins and Cathal Brugha became embroiled in which ignored Scots except for wanting man power and delivery of arms with which to kill all the collegues which the Scots previously worked closely with. A terrible time indeed. Seamus Reader says that 'The politicians should have closed the door and debated it out instead of bringing it to the men and women who now had to choose a side'. I think he typifies the attitude of the revolutionary movements outside of Ireland.

It spread to Glasgow, former freinds couldnt trust eachother, and even Seamus was shot at in Glasgow green. He removed his focus and was heavily involved in the new Scottish defence Force. By 1934 the Scottish Nationalists asked him to ask Dan Breen to help Scotland as Scotland had helped Ireland back in the day. Of course this was impossible and Seamus knew this. But he secured a job in the Dublin Dail as a verification officer and lived out his days, (and the 2nd World War) in Dublin. His father died of shock on hearing of his interment in Reading Jail 1916- His descriptions of which are entertaining and fascinating). He had his 8yr old boy 'young James' and his Glasgow Cmban wife Una. So after the 'being shot at' episode, they all went 'on-the-run' in 1934 to Dublin and lived happily ever after there. He ended his days teaching the boys and girls in Ringsend to be Sea-Scouts. Dying in his sleep in October 1969, Una died suddenly in 1966.

As I told you before their son James and his wife Molly died in 2011 and 2014 respectively.

I have a thing about generalisations. This story has opened my eyes. All I knew about Ireland before was that Michael Collins movie.

xx haha