User talk:Ron Clausen

Kudos

		The Geography Barnstar
		Thanks so much for creating all those excellent articles on mountains and other landmarks, many with your own photos. Keep up the good work! —innotata 15:27, 20 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Autopatrolled granted

Hi Ron Clausen, I just wanted to let you know that I have added the "autopatrolled" permission to your account, as you have created numerous, valid articles. This feature will have no effect on your editing, and is simply intended to reduce the workload on new page patrollers. For more information on the autopatrolled right, see Wikipedia:Autopatrolled. Feel free to leave me a message if you have any questions. Happy editing! ~~Swarm~~ {talk} 04:35, 26 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Barnstar

		The Tireless Contributor Barnstar
		Thank you for filling in the content gap for mountains in the Cascades and Olympics with your articles and photos. Sounder Bruce 20:52, 21 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Mount Kidd

A good article. I do have one question from stumbling across http://www.spiralroad.com/kidd-station/ What supports or rejects the alternate name origin? DMBanks1 (talk) 15:11, 14 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Stuart is also stated in https://www.tnphoto.ca/whats-in-a-name-mount-kidd/

However http://www.peakfinder.com/peaks/724 states "The following information regarding the naming of the peak was received from John Kidd in correspondence received on 2011-08-04. John's father was Fred Kidd and Stuart Kidd was John's grandfather. Stuart Kidd had a brother named Fred Kidd. John was told by his father that the mountain was named after his uncle, Fred Kidd." (ie. Fred Kidd's Uncle Fred)

This then comes down to whether we place more weighting upon 2011 correspondence than upon "Holmgren, Eric J. and Holmgren, Patricia M. Over 2,000 place names of Alberta. Saskatoon: Western Producer, 1973." Better evidence may exist in Alberta newspaper archives, but I have no means to access it. I faced a similar situation with Monkman Pass (further north in the Canadian Rockies), where there were two equally credible contenders for the title of Caucasian discoverer. The simplest solution was to list all three names. Let us know on your talk page regarding your thoughts on listing both brothers with references to the conflicting sources.DMBanks1 (talk) 22:34, 14 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Both the Peakfinder and Bivouac references, as well as Scrambles in the Canadian Rockies, 3rd edition, 2016, by Alan Kane, page 174, state Fred Kidd.

https://books.google.com/books?id=qGUvDAAAQBAJ&pg=PA174&dq=mount+kidd+fred&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwicv9bjxbXjAhUSHDQIHRMMBakQ6AEIKjAA#v=onepage&q=mount%20kidd%20fred&f=false

Stuart, Fred's brother, may be a possibility, but will need supporting evidence where that conclusion came from in the first link (Holmgren 1973) you provided, and which I don't have access to. Ron Clausen (talk) 22:58, 14 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Unfortunately, the BC interlibrary loan system is down for maintenance. When it is restored I'll check for this title. I assume you don't have a BC or Alberta library card. DMBanks1 (talk) 23:29, 14 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I have requested the expanded third edition (1976). It generally takes about 3 weeks to arrive.DMBanks1 (talk) 14:52, 15 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The following was my email response to http://www.spiralroad.com/kidd-station/

Kidd was on the Grand Trunk Pacific line and Mt. Kidd on the Canadian Pacific line, consequently a name origin link appears spurious. From experience, I am skeptical of the accuracy of place name origins generally. I know for some BC places, I have come across archival newspaper articles from different eras indicating conflicting origins. I assume this is the case for the following:

Text favouring Stuart Kidd:

Boles, Glen W., Laurilla, Roger W., & Putnam, William L. (2006). CANADIAN MOUNTAIN PLACE NAMES The Rockies and Columbia Mountains, Rocky Mountain Books, p.144

“…There were two brothers of this name who ran the general store at the town of Morley. John Alfred Kidd did so from 1902 to 1907, but the summit was named for his brother Stuart (1883–1956), who ran the store for the next four years before moving on to Nordegg. Stuart was elected Chief Tah-Osa of the Stoneys in 1927.”

Texts favouring John Alfred (Fred) Kidd:

https://bivouac.com//MtnPg.asp?MtnId=1444

Kane, Alan. (2016). Scrambles in the Canadian Rockies, 3rd edition. Rocky Mountain Books, p. 174

Holmgren, Eric J. & Patricia M. (1976). Over 2000 PLACE NAMES OF ALBERTA Third Edition. Western Producer Prairie Books, p. 148

“Although there is some uncertainty as to the origin of this name, it seems probable that it was after John Alfred Kidd…..”

(Seemingly, the Holmgrens corrected their earlier edition) DMBanks1 (talk) 23:49, 28 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]

There was a lot of uncertainty about the name. Peakware.com and Summitpost.org attribute it to some nebulous "explorer". What many rely on for Alberta name origins was unsure and wrong: https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=mdp.39015070267029&view=1up&seq=75 Alan Kane (Scrambles in the Canadian Rockies} also corrected the name origin in his third edition as he attributed it to Stuart Kidd in earlier editions. Ron Clausen (talk) 00:37, 29 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]

WikiProject Canada 10,000 Challenge award

		The Red Maple Leaf Award
		This maple leaf is awarded to Ron Clausen for writing four articles on the Geography of Alberta during the third year of The 10,000 Challenge of WikiProject Canada. Congratulations, and thank you for your contributions! Reidgreg (talk) 20:02, 26 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I have sent you a note about a page you started

Hello, Ron Clausen

Thank you for creating Mount Merriam.

User:Insertcleverphrasehere, while examining this page as a part of our page curation process, had the following comments:

Nice new article. writing is great and a beautiful choice of image. Thanks for your contributions.

To reply, leave a comment here and prepend it with {{Re|Insertcleverphrasehere}}. And, don't forget to sign your reply with ~~~~ .

(Message delivered via the Page Curation tool, on behalf of the reviewer.)

— Insertcleverphrasehere ^{(or here)}_{(click me!)} 10:00, 3 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

A barnstar for you!

	The Tireless Contributor Barnstar
	Nice new article at Black Cap Mountain (Alaska). Love to see nicely fleshed out new articles come through the new pages feed. Keep up the good work. — Insertcleverphrasehere ^{(or here)}_{(click me!)} 21:04, 3 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Question for you!

Hello,

On the Commons I noticed that you changed the description of File:Candlestick Tower star trails.jpg to "Airport Tower, southeast aspect, and star trails". To me it looks more like "Candlestick Tower" as does File:Candlestick Tower, west aspect, sunset.jpg which you describe as "Candlestick Tower or Airport Tower". Could you clarify for me the names of these two images?

I work mostly on the Commons and I can change the names of any of your files to reflect the names you want them to be.

By the way, Candlestick Tower has wonderful references. I look forward to finding other articles by you! Best, Krok6kola (talk) 17:52, 21 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The file Candlestick Tower star trails could be changed to Airport Tower star trails. When I first uploaded it, I misidentified it (having not yet studied Airport Tower). By comparing it to this file: File:Airport Tower, from east.jpg makes the identification 100% positive as Airport Tower. Secondly, there is a campground at the Airport Tower location that would make the night-time photograph feasible, whereas as a night photograph at Candlestick Tower would not be reasonable.Ron Clausen (talk) 21:27, 21 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, I will follow your directions. Krok6kola (talk) 21:44, 21 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

New article Tower of Set

I am the original author of the Isis Temple article —- which you know is just east of the Tower of Set. At the time I did a lot of Grand Canyon articles of mountains etc. and a lot of rock layers. Maybe you are aware the Geologist type editor Paul H. —- improved my basic articles with his KNOWLEDGE of geology (( which easily reads as a foreign language !! (sometimes) )).

Anyhow, I found that you added the wikilink to the Shinumo Quartzite article which I use on my IPhone to enter Wikipedia. (Actually Redwall article)

I am glad to see this new article // and am looking forward to reading it.

The photo on the Redwall Limestone article is dramatic —. BecawZ, the dramatic Redwall Cliffs, and the top, Flat platforms — are such a wonder and so distinctive.

As an aside, the North Kaibab Trail has some photos of the base of the Redwall,,, with dramatic purple trails of the Hermit Formation, Hermit Shale. 😊Michael in Yuma McAnnis59 (talk) 01:34, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Angels Gate

I see you found some amazing Angels Gate photos. When I was adding photos to Categories in WikiCommons, I finally understood what and where Angels Gate is.

And you probably know that it is part of the northeast drainage to Clear Creek. McAnnis59 (talk) 01:43, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Eastern) Grand Canyon articles

Hi Ron Clausen. Ten years ago?? when I started on Grand Canyon rock units, I knew some Geology, but really got into expanding the Then category for Grand Canyon Geology (now under Natural History & Arizona Geology). I am texting to explain my 2020 spring events on my IPhone. I started dialysis after a 5-year vacation off it. —— And I started categorizing in WikiCommons making Canyon categories— which are actually Drainage or Watershed Categories. (Found the speed of the iPhone editing). Some are very short, and are clearly Canyon categories. An example being :Category:Ninetyfour Mile Canyon in WikiCommons. My suggestion is about Clear Creek (Arizona). In WikiCommons under Category:Clear Creek Canyon (Arizona) are the many landforms in the watershed including the Ottoman Amphitheater. In the northeast headwaters is Wotans Throne, the north side of Angels Gate, and nearby THOR TEMPLE off of Honan Point??. (North Rim-(west Walhalla Plateau).

Adjacent the exit of Clear Creek (Arizona) — (southeast) is a STAND-ALONE butte (but adjacent to a butte east) — THE HOWLANDS BUTTE is this 2nd suggestion of landforms for you —- the other being THOR TEMPLE. I commend your busy work on your articles. (Grand Canyon & Others— I recently learned more about the extensive West GC — as rock units are differently expressed —West, Central, & East). I need to figure out how to send you a barnstar (on iPhone) in Wikipedia. !! !! Michael in Yuma Arizona— McAnnis59 (talk) 14:17, 2 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I only learned about Thor Temple this last spring. Most photos were from Bright Angel Point overlook, and viewed eastwards past Deva Temple. McAnnis59 (talk) 14:40, 2 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Will get to Thor and Howlands in time. Will need to find good suitable photos since I won't create page without one.Ron Clausen (talk) 18:22, 2 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I obviously understand. I had to look at the map that it is Clear Creek Category. Because I had never seen the Thor Temple landform. — Again kudos for your great articles McAnnis59 (talk) 22:06, 2 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

What a wonderful photo of The Howlands Butte. kudos — McAnnis59 (talk) 04:55, 7 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Confucius Temple

Please read my edit discussion on Confucius Temple. (Great Article, and wonderful photo you added) !!! McAnnis59 (talk) 14:38, 8 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Also, the Hermit Formation has a dramatic thickness !! McAnnis59 (talk) 14:42, 8 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Of Note-Brady Peak, nice article- An amazing prominence. McAnnis59 (talk) 00:33, 10 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Marble Canyon

Thanks Ron. I left my reply on my page. I was busy with Nankoweap Mesa & Kwagunt. And wanted to do Malgosa Ridge. It turns out the last to make is Awatubi Ridge. Which is a dramatic high angle rock layer of the Butte Fault. I could not identify the ROCK type. And sorry I messed up Tritle vs Brady in WikiCommons. (Now mostly corrected photos) Have to redo Tritle cat page. Thanks again. McAnnis59 (talk) 04:16, 13 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Cope Butte, Grand Canyon

Thanks for your added photo to Cope Butte. It appears that the butte must have been an ancient Monadnock, like IsisTemple and its east neighbor, which ended up on a localized Fault Block. (In later times). Thanks, Enjoy your day McAnnis59 (talk) 13:35, 19 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Update of articles/efforts

Hello Ron Clausen. I thought I would update my comments to you. First I really appreciate your articles. You now are aware — that so many landforms in the Grand Canyon deserve articles.

The more I look at maps ( now seeing more in the West Grand Canyon ), I realize the complexity of the East, Center GC, and West. The Hermit Shale Hermit Formation becomes thicker westward. As you are probably aware. The fault at the west terminus of Grand Canyon, dropped huge layers of rock into the Lake Mead (trough). So much to know about the local region and extended region.

The Old Spanish Trail (now under Lake Mead). Travelled through that Lake Mead trough.

So ... just saying how I appreciate & enjoy your articles. When I found the typo (autofill) in the Grand Scenic Divide, ( I had read the article at least 4 times ). So that typo got completely by me. Cheers (Michael in Yuma)—McAnnis59 (talk) 00:34, 12 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks again for fixing that. As I wrote that article I had a fear that I would make that exact mistake, and sure enough I did.Ron Clausen (talk) 01:13, 12 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

A barnstar for you!

	The Photographer's Barnstar
	Thank you for finding images for so many articles on mountains MONGO (talk) 16:06, 29 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Ron

Hi Ron,

Are you the chap writing up all the desert climbs? I just wanted to say your efforts are excellent and .... accurate!

Thank you. Cameron Burns

Thanks, Cameron. I've written 1,200 articles here, mostly mountains, but also some desert towers in Canyonlands and Colorado National Monument, which your book I referenced for routes. So, thank you for your book, Selected Climbs in the Desert Southwest, and other articles you have authored which I've used for references. Ron Clausen (talk) 01:11, 15 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Peakbagger, List of John, GNIS

Hi Ron. First off I'd like to congratulate you on doing so much work on important mountain peaks. This is not to knock your work, but I've seen from WP:NPP that you're creating multiple articles based on the above three sources. I'm not sure these are a pass for WP:RS and maybe you could help me understand how they do pass WP:RS. My concerns are specifically that:

Peakbagger appears to be a self-published hobby-project by a single guy based primarily on GNIS.
Lists of John also looks a lot like a self-published source, it is not clear where the data on it comes from but a lot apparently comes from GNIS.
GNIS has some problems, and anyway is rarely enough by itself to indicate notability.

It may be that there's some better sources for these peaks that could put articles about them on a better basis. For example, reliably-sourced news stories about ascents or accidents on a particular peak. I see that, for example, Sawtooth Ridge saw a major forest fire in its area in 2007 where firefighters used explosives to clear a line (click on the OCR tab to see the article text). Stuff like this can help the articles look more like they are about real places with history and make them feel more encyclopaedic and less like a database-entry. Of course it may be that I've misunderstood what peakbagger/listofjohn are so please feel free to shoot me down right here if that's the case. FOARP (talk) 10:07, 18 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Mount Washington, Mount Rainier, Pikes Peak, Mount Whitney, Mount Hood are some famous mountains, some with "good" article ratings. They reference peakbagger.com and GNIS. If you can convince me that the thousands of Wikipedia articles created long before mine that are using these three valid, accurate references are wrong, then let me know. Ron Clausen (talk) 21:13, 18 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know, but my guess is if I opened an WP:RSN thread on Peakbagger.com then the feedback wouldn't be positive, regardless of how many articles cite it. Same goes for ListOfJohn. RSN recently found GNIS's feature classes to be unreliable and that's cited in tens of thousands of articles, so the fact that Peakbagger.com is listed in 5,104 articles right now doesn't seem likely to change many minds. WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS is a pretty valid argument as far as whether the fact that something exists in one article means it should be used elsewhere or not. Moreover the thing about RSN (and Wikipedia in general) is that it's not up to people to prove that a source is unreliable, it has to be shown to be reliable by the editor who wants to use it. "Good article" ratings don't necessarily mean that everything in the article is perfect, indeed Wikipedia still has featured articles that are getting deleted/redirected/merged at AFD.

Of course I may be totally wrong here, but at least ListOfJohn and Peakbagger don't look like great sources to use because they look to be self-published and simply mirroring GNIS data, and GNIS probably shouldn't be the only source for the actual geographical feature being discussed. It's great to include climate and geological data for the general area the feature is in, but unless it actually refers to the feature in detail maybe more is needed? And I'm sure for many (all?) of these peaks it can be found, but it would be better to have decent sourcing in the article (at least enough to pass WP:GNG) when it's created - that's actually part of what's expected of people with autopatrolled.

Now, there's no real reason you've got to listen to me about this, and if you want to ignore what I'm saying here that's your prerogative, but please accept that my concerns here are genuine and honestly-intended, and come from having spent years now working on poorly-referenced GEO articles. FOARP (talk) 09:26, 19 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I appreciate your concerns, but let's not put blind faith in stuff that has been "published". I have found plenty of stuff in "published" material that is flat out incorrect, and would not use. And stuff can be found in communities such as Summitpost that is excellent and correct (but I don't use). So the balancing act is to be accurate, which means using best data where it's found. GNIS is good for coordinates, but terrible at elevations, so that's where Peakbagger comes in. The Mountain Infobox lists data such as Prominence and Isolation. That kind of data is not in "published" sources, it only comes from sources such as Peakbagger and LOJ. Peakbagger and LOJ are reputable sources that are more accurate than published material, they get their data from GNIS and NGS, it's not something they just pull out of the air. I have been doing the same thing since I started this, so autopatrol was granted for me doing what I'm doing all along. If it was good enough for the grantor, it should be good enough for you. You open a thread about Peakbagger, and I'm sure that it would be positive feedback, try it for your own satisfaction. Ron Clausen (talk) 10:21, 19 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Barnstar

		The Mountainous Barnstar
		If there's anyone who deserves this barnstar, it's you. Thank you for your tireless contributions and the creation of countless very polished articles on mountains. Fritzmann (message me) 19:17, 14 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Fritzmann (message me) 19:17, 14 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for all your hard work

		The Mountainous Barnstar
		I am constantly impressed with your mountain articles. It's a real sign of your dedication to our wildness areas and is content that is really needed here. When I started adding backcountry lakes to wikipedia I didn't think I would find anyone else who was into this sort of thing. Thank you for all that you do and the work you produce. Dr vulpes ^{(💬 • 📝)} 17:30, 15 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks!

Just wanted to say 'thanks!' for creating so many helpful new entries. Keep up the great work! ---Another Believer _(Talk) 21:40, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Pacific Grade Summit

Hi Ron. I'm working on cleaning up unreferenced articles and I saw this one about a mountain summit. I think you might be better qualified than I as to where references might be found for this - any ideas? FOARP (talk) 14:33, 8 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

https://edits.nationalmap.gov/apps/gaz-domestic/public/search/names/97ee1a76-917b-55df-be15-daa330fc08a6/summary

https://peakvisor.com/peak/pacific-grade-summit.html

Ron Clausen (talk) 22:05, 8 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Elevation

Hi Ron, I removed the word 'elevation' from the lead of The Sisters (Nevada), thinking that it was not needed. However, I noticed that other articles about US peaks that you've worked on include the word. Perhaps it is standard usage for articles about US peaks? Please feel free to revert my change if you want to. Regards, Pikemaster (talk) 12:34, 18 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Standard practice, see other articles which were not created by me: Aconcagua, Denali, Mount Whitney, Mount Rainier, etc. Please revert your edit. Ron Clausen (talk) 19:22, 18 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Okay. Reverted. Thanks, Pikemaster (talk) 21:12, 18 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

A small remark about sizing divs

You'll probably notice my edits across the mountains anyway, so might as well say hi and please don't forget to close those gallery sizing <div>s. I don't mean this as a complaint or admonishment, it's just that if unclosed, they also force narrowness on anything below the gallery (like refs), which isn't too great on desktop; and they cause lint errors (which brought me to them). Gamapamani (talk) 04:32, 29 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]