User talk:MurasakiSunshine

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Hello, MurasakiSunshine, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions, especially what you did for Warren Beatty. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

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January 2012

Welcome to Wikipedia. Everyone is welcome to contribute to the encyclopedia, but when you add or change content, as you did to the article Ryuhei Matsuda, please cite a reliable source for your addition. This helps maintain our policy of verifiability. See Wikipedia:Citing sources for how to cite sources, and the welcome page to learn more about contributing to this encyclopedia. Thank you. --DAJF (talk) 04:29, 21 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Everyone knows that his father was partially Korean. His father's maternal family was Kim. Ryuhei's grandmother was Korean. It's even in Yusaku's article that he was partially Korean. So, by default, Ryuhei is also partially Korean. (MurasakiSunshine (talk) 05:06, 21 January 2012 (UTC))[reply]

I added reference from the book 越境者 - 松田優作, a book about Yusaku, Ryuhei's father. It states that Yusaku was born to a Korean mother and Japanese father. This makes Ryuhei and his brother Shota 1/4 Korean. (MurasakiSunshine (talk) 05:17, 21 January 2012 (UTC))[reply]

Proposed deletion of Nahoko Kinoshita

The article Nahoko Kinoshita has been proposed for deletion because, under Wikipedia policy, all newly created biographies of living persons must have at least one reference to a reliable source that directly supports material in the article.

If you created the article, please don't be offended. Instead, consider improving the article. For help on inserting references, see Referencing for beginners, or ask at the help desk. Once you have provided at least one reliable source, you may remove the {{prod blp}} tag. Please do not remove the tag unless the article is sourced. If you cannot provide such a source within ten days, the article may be deleted, but you can request that it be undeleted when you are ready to add one. -- MST☆R ^{(Chat Me!)} 09:37, 25 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I'm trying to add more to the article. I only created it like 2 hours ago. I need some translation help and I posted post asking for help on her page. (MurasakiSunshine (talk) 10:26, 25 January 2012 (UTC))[reply]

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March 2012

Your recent editing history at Carcinoma of the penis shows that you are currently engaged in an edit war. Being involved in an edit war can result in you being blocked from editing—especially if you violate the three-revert rule, which states that an editor must not perform more than three reverts on a single page within a 24-hour period. Undoing another editor's work—whether in whole or in part, whether involving the same or different material each time—counts as a revert. Also keep in mind that while violating the three-revert rule often leads to a block, you can still be blocked for edit warring—even if you don't violate the three-revert rule—should your behavior indicate that you intend to continue reverting repeatedly.

To avoid being blocked, instead of reverting please consider using the article's talk page to work toward making a version that represents consensus among editors. You can post a request for help at a relevant noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases, you may wish to request temporary page protection. Jakew (talk) 16:56, 22 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I am not in an editing war. Circumcision is clearly listed as a factor of prevention. It's redundant information to add lack of circumcision as a risk factor. (MurasakiSunshine (talk) 16:57, 22 March 2012 (UTC))[reply]

To be consistent with that line of reasoning, you'd have to remove human papillomavirus from the list of risk factors, since HPV vaccine is included in the prevention section. And tobacco, hygiene, etc., since they're included in 'prevention', too. But I wouldn't advise that, because risk factors are a separate issue from prevention. There is some overlap between the two, and a certain amount of redundancy is unavoidable. Jakew (talk) 17:08, 22 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The HPV mentioning is somewhat different because it addresses HPV as a risk factor and then the HPV vaccine as a prevention method. And as I said, saying lack of circumcision is a risk factor for penile cancer is like saying lack of mastectomy is a risk factor for breast cancer. Cancer can occur in the foreskin, the blood vessels, the glans penis, etc but we're not saying lack of penectomy is a risk factor for penile cancer. (MurasakiSunshine (talk) 17:13, 22 March 2012 (UTC))[reply]

Similarly, sources address both lack of circumcision as a risk factor and circumcision as a prevention method. Eg., "Options for prevention of penile cancer include (neonatal) circumcision..."[1] "Some of the potential strategies for the prevention of penile cancer could include circumcision..."[2] "Circumcision, prevention for sexual transmission diseases and adequate hygiene were the most important manners for penile cancer prevention."[3]

Your second point suffers from two problems. First, sources generally don't list lack of penectomy as a risk factor. They do list lack of circumcision. Second, you appear to misunderstand the relationship between circumcision and penile cancer. Circumcision prevents cancers from occurring in the foreskin, but it also reduces the risk of cancers occurring elsewhere on the penis, as an indirect result of reducing the risk of phimosis, balanitis, HPV, lichen sclerosus, and possibly smegma. Jakew (talk) 17:21, 22 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I understand how circumcision can lower a man's risk for penile cancer. You cannot get cancer in the foreskin if you do not have a foreskin. Squamous cell carcinoma can occur in the foreskin/glans penis and it accounts for more than 9/10 of penile cancers. And yes, circumcision can prevent phimosis usually but it cannot prevent HPV, lichen sclerosus, smegma, or balanitis because these things can occur in circumcised men all the same. HPV can be passed through skin-to-skin contact so it's not wise to assume circumcision offers protection there. No one knows what causes lichen sclerosus, smegma is just dead skin cells (so it will occur in circumcised men, it just can't build up under a foreskin), and balanitis can occur in circumcised men. Phimosis can be prevented by retracting the foreskin on a regular basis and washing under the foreskin. Neither Cancer Research UK or the American Cancer Society recommend circumcision to prevent penile cancer. HPV and hygiene are the major factors in developing penile cancer. (MurasakiSunshine (talk) 17:28, 22 March 2012 (UTC))[reply]

As I've already explained, you're mistaken. Circumcision does substantially reduce the risk of HPV, etc., see "This meta-analysis shows a robust inverse association between MC and genital HPV prevalence in men."[4] or "Also, circumcised men are less likely to get and stay infected with the human papilloma virus (HPV), even after accounting for differences in sexual behavior"[5] It also reduces the risk of lichen sclerosus, smegma, phimosis, and balanitis. See this review for a detailed analysis. Jakew (talk) 18:11, 22 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

This study (1) from the University of Washington found that circumcision had no effect on lowering the risk of HPV. (MurasakiSunshine (talk) 18:22, 22 March 2012 (UTC))[reply]

I'm guessing you meant to link to this paper. Yes, I agree: it didn't find an association. This is what's called a primary source, and primary sources often find differing result — if they were all completely reliable then only one study would ever be needed. Wikipedia relies on secondary sources that synthesise multiple primary sources to produce a high-level overview. The two sources I cited (Albero et al and the ACS) are secondary sources; Albero et al included 21 primary sources in their analysis. Here is another that includes 23 papers.

Now, look, there's very little point in us continuing to debate how circumcision reduces the risk. The fact is that lack of circumcision is widely recognised as a risk factor (as I've shown here), and for that reason it should be included. So could you please restore it? Jakew (talk) 18:45, 22 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know how I feel about telling readers that lack of circumcision may be a cause of penile cancer. It may influence circumcised men who read the article to believe that they have protection against penile cancer, which may cause them to not get treatment for penile cancer until it's too late.

Things I'm considering

Foreskin in itself does not cause HPV. Unsafe sex causes HPV. It doesn't matter how much foreskin you have. If you have unprotected sex with an HPV-infected person, there's a chance you'll get infected.
Foreskin in itself does not cause balanitis. Improper hygiene methods cause it.
Foreskin in itself does not cause smegma.
Foreskin in itself does not cause lichen sclerosus. We don't know what causes it.
The only risk factor that circumcision can prevent would be phimosis (which if not treated, could lead to balanitis and smegma buildup which are risk factors). Phimosis can be prevented by regular proper hygiene.

Unsafe sex and improper hygiene, not lack of circumcision, that creates risk factors for penile cancer. Circumcision can't prevent any of the risk factors that can't be prevented by other nonsurgical methods. If circumcision gave a solid protection against something that could not be prevented by another way, I wouldn't dispute it. Also, a more correct term to use would be "lack of circumcision as an infant" because studies show circumcision as an adult generally doesn't decrease the risk of developing penile cancer. Then it would go into the fact that the American Cancer Society does not recommend infant circumcision for the prevention of penile cancer. In addition to the ACS stance, a Danish study found that despite a constant male circumcision rate of only 2.3%, Denmark saw a decrease from 1.15 per 100,000 to 0.8 per 100,000 over the years (Frisch M, Friis S, Kjær SK, Melbye M.), which was attributed to better penile hygiene. Do you see my line of reasoning here? Is there anything you would like to add to "Circumcision" paragraph under the Prevention article? (MurasakiSunshine (talk) 19:00, 22 March 2012 (UTC))[reply]

Okay, if you're not willing to restore the material, I shall do so. I do take your point about timing, however: I'll insert the words "before adulthood", so that it reads "lack of circumcision before adulthood". Jakew (talk) 19:05, 22 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for taking the timing of circumcision into consideration because that was part of my concern. May I ask if there is there any common ground on changes we could make together? Perhaps expand the circumcision paragraph under the prevention article to include information that you wish to put regarding lack of circumcision as a risk factor? Or how do you feel about combining "Risk factors and Prevention" into one article? That way we do not have to repeat information in separate parts of the page. (MurasakiSunshine (talk) 19:12, 22 March 2012 (UTC))[reply]

There is a lot of overlap between the 'risk factors' and 'prevention' sections, and yes, I think it might be a good idea to combine this under the 'risk factors' heading. After all, saying "X is a risk factor for Y" is closely related to saying "not doing X can help to prevent Y". I don't intend to add a great deal of information, really: we already cite sources documenting that lack of circumcision is a risk factor, which is the key point. I'd quite like to briefly discuss the mechanisms by which it does so — we already include reduction in risk of phimosis, but I'd like to include HPV as well. I'd also like to note that some authors view neonatal circumcision as a strategy for preventing penile cancer, while others disagree.

Incidentally, your style of writing is familiar. Have you previously used another username? Jakew (talk) 19:29, 22 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Alrighty. I'll try to miminize the article so it doesn't drag on. I'm glad we can reach a compromise here. And yeah, I did have one back as a teenager for about 5 minutes. Used to edit things on pop culture back then mostly (nothing remotely educational). But I haven't been on Wiki as an editor in a long while. I made this account back in January because I kept seeing a lot of articles like the Rin Aoki one be so poorly edited. I'm still trying to learn basic html formatting though. (MurasakiSunshine (talk) 19:42, 22 March 2012 (UTC))[reply]

I think it'd be great to discuss that the phimosis reduction but I'm not sure about HPV. If you add circumcision as a way to reduce the risk of HPV, I think you should stress that HPV can be transmitted very easily (ACS reports that even condoms can provide only 70% protection against HPV). (MurasakiSunshine (talk) 19:51, 22 March 2012 (UTC))[reply]

Don't worry, I don't intend to add circumcision as a way to reduce the risk of HIV as such. But I do think it would be interesting and informative to the reader to explain some of the proposed mechanisms by which circumcision reduces the risk.

Incidentally, we need to ensure that the sources we cite support the points we're making in the context of penile cancer. For example, if we're citing a source about HPV prevention (through a vaccine, say), that source has to explicitly link the vaccine to penile cancer. This is required by the no original research policy. Jakew (talk) 20:12, 22 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Alrighty. I went ahead and merged the two if you want to review/edit/or source some things. I think I got the basic format for everything down. (MurasakiSunshine (talk) 20:24, 22 March 2012 (UTC))[reply]

Hello MurasakiSunshine, I agree with all of your points about Circumcision. Castration also reduces HIV transmission but no one recommends that do they? It's sad when people talk about the foreskin as if its some kind of birth defect when trying to justify their religious and cultural reasoning. Now the pro circs have a new banner, HIV prevention, but in reality this false promise probably encourages unsafe sex and hence increases the spread of HIV. See you around and keep up the good work. Garycompugeek (talk) 20:21, 10 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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Children's names

MurasakiSunshine, I see you've added the problematic material to your user page. This isn't an appropriate use of a user page, and at some point I will take issue with it, but for the time being please would you remove the names of children involved? The boy named in the last paragraph would be nine years old now. Can you imagine what it must be like for a nine-year old to have some user page on Wikipedia talking about your penis and identifying you by name? Jakew (talk) 15:40, 28 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

They went on record in public with their pictures and participated in interviews. When you go to the press, let them take pictures of you, and participate in interviews, I'm guessing they'll be okay with having their name and face out there.(MurasakiSunshine (talk) 15:50, 28 April 2012 (UTC))[reply]

FYI, I've reported this issue at WP:BLPN#User:MurasakiSunshine‎#Lawsuits with the Mogen clamp. Jakew (talk) 10:27, 29 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

So, I can't write about what is public information on my Wikipedia page? Anyone with access to Google can find the information I've posted. Those people volunteered to share their identities with the world. Wiki promotes censorship? (MurasakiSunshine (talk) 10:55, 29 April 2012 (UTC))[reply]

Hi - can you see how less than optimal it is in using your user page in an attempt to publish content that has been deemed unfit for article inclusion. Perhaps just remove it would be better, less disruptive than fighting to keep it there Youreallycan 11:04, 29 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

People researching circumcision have a right to know the Mogen clamp harmed these boys and that if they are opting to undergo circumcision or circumcise their sons that this what can happen and they should seek out safer methods. Do you believe in withholding information from people? Because I don't. Isn't Wikipedia about informing and educating people? It's not informing or educating when you censor what you can inform people about and how you can inform and educate them. (MurasakiSunshine (talk) 11:09, 29 April 2012 (UTC))[reply]

I don't about any of that right to know free spoeech stuff = its just that you are using your talkpage against WP:TPG in using it to publish material that has for good reasons been removed from article space - would you please add {{NOINDEX}} and {{Userpage draft}} as is normal to such content in userpage please -

Anyone googling Mogen clamp injury can find Terrel's story. It's not as if I took a private matter and made it public. It was a public matter and Terrel and his family consented to publicity from the case. All I did was link to the stories and provide a summary. (MurasakiSunshine (talk) )

Talkback

Hello, MurasakiSunshine. You have new messages at Talk:Mogen_clamp#Vandalism.
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