User talk:Laurie Spiegel

October 2011

Welcome to Wikipedia. Everyone is welcome to contribute to the encyclopedia, but when you add or change content, as you did to the article The Lathe of Heaven (film), please cite a reliable source for your addition. This helps maintain our policy of verifiability. See Wikipedia:Citing sources for how to cite sources, and the welcome page to learn more about contributing to this encyclopedia. Please note that the word of a Wikipedia editor does not constitute a reliable source. Thank you. -- Doniago (talk) 13:56, 25 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Laurie. While I do not doubt your stated credentials, please note that Wikipedia can only publish information that comes from verifiable sources; unfortunately, we have no way of confirming your identity and cannot accept information that cannot be reliably sourced. You may also wish to review WP:PRIMARY. Thank you for your understanding, and please reply here if you have any additional questions or concerns. Doniago (talk) 12:42, 28 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Doniago, is it not sufficient that both of the credits I was trying to enter (audio and visual special effects by Laurie Spiegel and Ed Emshwiller) are shown in both the credit roll at the end of the film and in IMDB's entry for the film at this link?

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0081036/combined

If that is not sufficient could you tell me what is? And if it is sufficient would be willing to undo your removal of the changes I entered? Laurie Spiegel (talk) 06:42, 8 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Laurie, I reviewed the information you added previously and it went beyond strictly who created the audio and visual special effects. Specifically you stated, "Loxton also tapped two Artists in Residence in WNET's Experimental TV Lab to do special effects," which would need to be verified. I'm not sure this information is generally included in film articles in any case unless it has received attention from secondary sources; that might be a matter to discuss at WP:FILM, though if it was added with appropriate sourcing I would not contest it myself. I am curious as to why you consider this information important enough to merit inclusion, however, especially if secondary sourcing is not available...it doesn't seem particularly appropriate for Wikipedia at that point in my opinion. In any event, I do appreciate you coming to me with your concerns, but aside from addressing the lack of sourcing provided, I am not exactly an expert on film articles and would encourage you to review the resources available at WP:FILM, including editors more knowledgable on such matters than myself. Doniago (talk) 14:16, 8 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Doniago,

That Ed was an Artist-in-Residence at WNET's Experimental TV lab is already on his Wikidpedia page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ed_Emshwiller

And it's not hard to document various other places online of which here is one: http://www.vasulka.org/archive/Institutions1/WNETnews/Vol2No1Telenews.pdf

Ed and David Loxton are both listed as invovled in the TV Lab here: https://experimentaltvcenter.org/vhp/video-and-television-review-begins

I don't think it's on my Wikipedia page that I was also an Artist in Residence at WNET's TV Lab. (Someone else wrote my Wikipedia page and I have yet to edit it to add more information.) but I was an AIR there too, and I also composed the series music for the TV Lab's weekly tv series that WNET broadcast on New York channel 13 starting in 1976. That same year I was also a video artist in residence at the TV Lab.

My AIR status at WNET's TV Lab is mentioned in this press release on the Museum of Modern Art's site for a concert I did at MOMA the same year I was resident at WNET: http://www.moma.org/docs/press_archives/5404/releases/MOMA_1976_0064_53.pdf?2010

My production credit for music for the TV Lab's series "VTR" ("Video and Television Review") is in the IMDB here: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1780702/combined

David Loxton is listed on the above IMDB page as the series producer, but more than that he ran the TV Lab and the series consisted of video productions created at the TV Lab by the Artists in Residence.

The reason I thought this worth mentioning is that The Lathe of Heaven was not a typical production but a project done by a group of people doing important work in experimental video in a unique experimental studio that David Loxton was the prime mover for. That studio pioneered and developed experimental visual techniques which have since became relatively ubiquitous. The TV Lab is too little known and too rarely mentioned (not even a Wikipedia entry for it yet!) so I wanted to to mention it here, as the film grew out of and drew on the TV Lab's people and resources. And I feel it is important that the Lathe film grew out of a group of people already working together and supporting each others' work for years already before the Lathe film - that there was the shared studio experience and its community of creative people. The Lathe of Heaven was not created by a crew of people individually hired for the individual film project (though of course there were some not from the Lab hired for just the film too).

I hope the above documents and clarifies enough. I thank you for helping me through the process of learning what is required for Wikipedia information. - Laurie Laurie Spiegel (talk) 03:30, 21 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Laurie,

You'd be welcome to add the information into the articles with the sourcing you've listed above, but a couple of notes- 1) wikilinks don't constitute reliable sources, as the article linked to can be changed or even deleted such that the information is still unverifiable...what you can do is get the actual source from the article and copy it as needed, 2) IMDb references should be avoided if possible, per WP:RS/IMDb...in this particular case I think it would be okay, but a non-IMDb source would be preferable, 3) you should be very careful about editing a page about yourself, as you can fall afoul of WP:COI...make sure anything you add or change is backed up by reliable sourcing. Please see WP:CITINGSOURCES if you need information regarding how to properly format references. Hope this helps, and thank you for your patience during this discussion. Doniago (talk) 16:59, 21 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

You'd make a good teacher Doniago. Thank you, and special thanks for taking time to include the various how-to and what-to links. They are definitely helpful. Laurie Spiegel (talk) 05:28, 23 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks Laurie! I'm glad I was able to be of assistance. If you have any other concerns please feel free to contact me. I'll certainly help out if I can. Doniago (talk) 13:41, 29 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

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