User talk:Jenniferhsrn

Tensaw,_Alabama

I deleted a large amount of material here that you seem to have copied from elsewhere in Wikipedia. I couldn't find the original page. To preserve the copyright and attribution history you need to doa bit of work before you can copy material, even within Wikipedia. Please read WP:COPYWITHIN Meters (talk) 22:58, 4 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Only a portion was copied. Most of the information about the censuses and the history was not copied but my work. You deleted everything I wrote!

I've indented your reply for clarity (one colon for your reply, 2 colons for my response). Your material is not gone. It is still available in the page history. The article as you left it is here and your changes are here. I'm not saying that the material is not acceptable for the article (it may or may not be), just that it wasn't sourced properly. The link in my first message takes you to how to source material that is copied from elsewhere in Wikipedia.

Your own research is not acceptable as a source for Wikipedia. Please read Reliable Sources, and No Original Research. You need to cite the original sources you used, not what you wrote. I can see that you're working on the article so I'll give you a chance to change your refs.

It looks like you are intending on adding a significant section on the early histroy of this area. Since the article is only a stub, and about the area as a whole, I'm wondering if you might be better off writing a seperate article on the history aspect. Meters (talk) 01:56, 5 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I am not opposed to creating a new page, but I couldn't figure out how to do one. As for original sources used, I did cite them. "Anglo Americans in the Spanish Archives" lists the same names as the transcriptions I referenced, it just doesn't list them in each census year, but instead is a listing with tables with boxes checked. The Creek War information is published in Picketts, Halbert and Ball and several other sources. I guess I am confused, if it is verifiable in original source documents (like the service records) why is putting something together that has not been written wrong? This settlement was of extreme importance, it was the largest settlement of American (largely expats) in the Spanish territory. Yes, my inclusion of the individuals who lived there by researching the census records of the Spanish period is new, but I don't see how it is inappropriate, as the census record itself is a reliable document. I think you are reading into original research. From what I saw, it says it can't be something you can't point to a document and say here is the proof. A census document is a reliable source, albeit secondaryJenniferhsrn (talk) 03:27, 5 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I see User:BusterD has already given you some help and you've moved the Tensaw material into your sandbox. I'll add a comment to the article Talk page to explain what's going on. There should be no problem referencing a census but make sure that you provide some way for the information to be verified (such as the particular page number in the census). Referencing your own transcription of it is not allowed. There's no way for anyone to verify that your transcription is correct.

Unless you are an accepted authority in an area you cannot reference your own work. For example, you wrote "Although most of the victims of the Creeks during the Creek War are associated with the Fort Mims Massacre, the truth is hostile Creeks were attacking white settlers all over the area." Unless you can reference that, it appears to be your conclusion, and thus original research.

When I removed your edit it was because it had been cut and pasted from another source without referencing that source. It appeared to be from Wikipedia, but even then it has to be sourced. I pointed out that you were going to have problems with your references so that you could start working to correct them rather than having me or someone else revert your work again. You're doing a good job of adding the appropriate refs. The "Anglo Americans in the Spanish Archives" that you mention above was not in your original edit, for example.

Good luck, and feel free to ask me for help. I'd be happy to review the current state of your article to look for any remaining problems. I'm a family historian mysekf, so I enjoy this type of research. Meters (talk) 17:33, 5 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks again. Actually though the exaample you used as original research, "Although most of the victims of the Creeks..." is not, I have read accounts of the Creek War written by not just Halbert and Ball, but Pickett, and several newspaper articles during the time, and it is a fact that Creeks were raiding and killing white settlers all throughout the area. It seems you want every line referenced, which is a bit tedious. I am not done yet, so I can easily find the referenced material. Jenniferhsrn (talk) 17:39, 5 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Welcome!

Hello, Jenniferhsrn, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

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I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your messages on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically insert your username and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or ask your question on this page and then place {{help me}} before the question. Again, welcome! BusterD (talk) 02:52, 5 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I appreciate the warm welcome and thank you! What is your interest in the Bowman family, is it military alone or in the family itself? Jenniferhsrn (talk) 03:28, 5 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I came onto the Bowman story by accident. I was helping to fill redlinks on a list article about USMA superintendents. I was an early contributor to the superintendent list page years ago, and somebody I know raised the work to featured status. West Point superintendents make excellent Wikipedia subjects because they are invariably easy to source well. You just didn't get that billet unless you were well known. As to AH Bowman himself, I found his story very interesting because of his family's martial history. The Bowman Hill book is fascinating reading and I once drove by the the old house (which now houses a taxi company if memory serves) as I passed through Wilkes-Barre. I'm planning an enlargement of the page at some point in the future; I've really only scratched the surface of his military career. BusterD (talk) 04:11, 5 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, his story is very interesting, as is most of the Collins family. They are very very distantly related (Mary Pyburn is the sister of my 6th great grandfather). Mary had a sister Eulalie who married a banker from Mobile, but the other sister, Cecelia married two military men, one of whom was the brother in law of President Tyler's son (John W. Rochelle, his sister Martha Fannie was married to John Tyler Jr.). The mother, Mary Pyburn Collins ran a hotel and plantation in Pensacola. (She owned all the family slaves, not her husband). Both burned over the years. When the Hotel burned she moved it to her plantation north of Pensacola. Not long before the Civil War the plantation was struck with a fire. I ran across several newspaper articles about the balls Mrs. Collins gave for the military and diplomats in Pensacola. Her husband was involved in Pensacola government for a brief time as well. After the Civil War, Marie Bowman's father killed himself by jumping out of a window in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, despondent from losing everything in the war. I suppose the family moved there to be closer to Mary Louise Bowman. One man wrote also of them in the Pensacola Journal, and he described Mary Collins most amusingly. [1] Thanks again!Jenniferhsrn (talk) 04:27, 5 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Alexander Hamilton Bowman

Hi there and thanks for contributing to Wikipedia. Can you tell me where you got the genealogical information you added with this edit? The sourcing you added doesn't give as much detail as you entered and the "Bowman Hill" pdf doesn't give this much info either. The subject is an interest of mine; I created it and watch the page for changes. I'm glad to see your contribution. I assume good faith that you didn't invent material of this sort of detail and complexity, so I wondered where you found it? Please respond here on your own talk page and I'll look to see when you've replied. Remember to sign your posts here with four tildes as described in the welcome message above. Thanks! BusterD (talk) 02:57, 5 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I sourced the marriage record information for Alexander Hamilton Bowman and his wife Marie Louisa Collins. I found a great deal of personal information on the family in some of the histories of Wilkes Barre, Pennsylvania I found on google books. I also searched the Censuses, which is where I got all the names. If I recall, I don't remember which book, I found the obituary or something else of Marie Bowman that listed all her daughter's married names. The obituary of her daughter Louise mentioned her daughter's married names, and between Census and death records in California I was able to trace the Otis family. Charles Bowman you had already addressed. Sons Alex Jr. and Walter are only found in the census, as is one of the daughters Mary Ellen. Eulalie who married James Rollins I found in Missouri but not her death date. I tried to find the original obituary I found in the book, but I was unable to today, I will however keep looking for it. Marie Louisa Collins is found first with her parents in a 1820 census of Pensacola (Spanish) I found in a book written by Coker. I just took notes on that one. She is not enumerated of course in 1830, as only her father as head of household is listed. The Spanish census gives the maiden name of Mary Pyburn which confirmed what I already knew. Mary Pyburn was baptized in Tensaw at her mother's home Nov 5, 1788 baptisms Sept 1784 birth, house of widow Pyburn, godfather K Cassin Castanares, this I got from the Archdiocese of Mobile via a phone conversation with the previous archivist Richard Chastang. The present archivist won't copy records. Thanks Jenniferhsrn (talk) 03:17, 5 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

(Notice that I've indented your reply by using a colon and this post by indenting with two colons. This use of indenting allows us to more easily follow the thread of discussion.) Thanks for your reply. With your permission, I'd like to cleanup some of the sourcing you added directly to the page. I'll likely do this in the morning. After I do, look at the difference between versions (in page history, what we wikipedians call a "diff") so you can see the changes I made to citation format. This might help you to make your next edit a little better each time. Thanks for editing boldly; it's a sign of a newcomer who has the chance to be successful. It's better to get your purest intention on the page (then cleanup little mistakes later) than to be bashful because you may not have much experience yet. BusterD (talk) 03:57, 5 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks and I welcome the constructive criticism. I am working on a new article. Would you be opposed to assisting me with it? I need to move it to a sandbox I guess, but not sure how to do it. I am writing the content, and leaving places for the resources I have to get publisher information on, but I have no idea how to do the addition to a group and the fancy thing on the side. Jenniferhsrn (talk) 04:07, 5 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Happy to help. I sometimes create a temporary sandbox in my own userspace to create an article. Here's one I haven't yet had deleted: User:BusterD/Lake County Discovery Museum. If you click on the edit tab there, you can get an idea of how I constructed it. Don't let the code confuse you overmuch; it's very intuitive once you've done a bit of editing. Sometimes new editors go through the useful and educational WP:Articles for Creation process, but I find it a bit confining, since I've been around a while. In either case, reply here with requests for assistance from me, or visit my talk page if you wish, or feel free to ask any other editor whose work you like. If you get really stuck and need assistance, use the help me template described in the welcome message above. This will attract a number of eyes. (Addition to a group? I think you might be referring to categories, which are really easy to add. Fancy thing on the side? Very likely referring to an infobox. There are different types of infoboxes depending on the subject matter. Notice that both the biography we've edited together and the community page you added to both have such infoboxes, but the content is quite different.) When you're working in your own sandbox, nobody will come along to complain about how what you did broke some feature of the page. So it's good to work uninterrupted, but still be able to ask for help when needed. Glad to help you get started. I'll be available part of the next few days, so feel welcome to call on me. BusterD (talk) 04:30, 5 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

This is what I have come up with already [2]Jenniferhsrn (talk) 04:42, 5 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia talk:Articles for creation/Tensaw, Alabama concern

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Wikipedia talk:Articles for creation/Tensaw, Alabama concern

Hi there, I'm HasteurBot. I just wanted to let you know that Wikipedia talk:Articles for creation/Tensaw, Alabama, a page you created, has not been edited in 6 months. The Articles for Creation space is not an indefinite storage location for content that is not appropriate for articlespace.

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