User talk:GlasgowStuart

I'm interested in feedback on my contribution on the musical/rhythmic form of limericks, in section 1.1 of "Limerick (poetry)". As a lyricist, I have a different take on it from pure poets which I hope adds new insight.— Preceding unsigned comment added by GlasgowStuart (talk • contribs) 17:26, 21 March 2013‎

Hello. Thanks for the contribution - it's an interesting explanation for the popularity of the limerick, and seems like something it'd definitely be good to write about. But is this drawing from existing literature, or is it your own personal analysis of the poetry form? One of the core pillars of Wikipedia is that it contain no original research, that everything in a Wikipedia article has already been stated by (and can be verified in) an existing source. Could we point to some books or articles that have analysed the limerick and covered the angles you've written about? --McGeddon (talk) 16:54, 24 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Hi, as an amateur musician, song writer, folk poet and lyricist, I thought I was just pointing out the obvious. Other contributors to the article have already said that one of the earliest forms was as a song, so that's already established. And the song and limerick must have the same rhythm. I always tap out out the beat of the limerick, as I've described. If you can find any published reference to the rhythm of a limerick song, I'd be interested. Try musical resources - and I'll keep my eyes open as well. I'm also involved in folk/Morris dancing, and that also has an obvious connection to the rhythm of the song. Maybe the staff at Cecil Sharp House, HQ of the English Folk Song and Dance Society can help. Good luck and thanks for the interest. I'd be happy for you to publish it, as long as I was credited as the source, somehow. Please let me know how you get on.— Preceding unsigned comment added by GlasgowStuart (talk • contribs) 17:29, 24 March 2013‎

Hi again, a clear rendition of a limerick in 6/8 jig time can be seen on YouTube - search for "The Limerick Song" or goto http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=k-rN3DGMCsE . Although all limericks are 5 lines in verse, the music is quite clearly 8 bars of jig time - just tap it and count the beats. I don't think it needs external verification, but if you put this youtube ref in as a footnote, would that help?— Preceding unsigned comment added by GlasgowStuart (talk • contribs) 19:33, 24 March 2013‎

Hi again from Glasgow Stuart. I've changed the example limerick from "Popeye, the sailor man" to the well known children's song "Hickory, dickory dock", where the 6/8 music is freely available on the Web. Although more likely to be sung today in 6/8, the music for "Popeye, the sailor man" was originally published and sung in slower 3/4 time in the movie cartoons. For those poets who do not read music or have ever danced in jig time, I've referenced a good Wikipedia section on the subject of rhythm or musical metre. This should complete the required edit to include external verification. No OR as far I can see.— Preceding unsigned comment added by GlasgowStuart (talk • contribs) 12:15, 27 March 2013‎

Thanks for your comments. I'm not a musician so am probably missing some of "the obvious", but the statements that look like the need sourcing are "Limericks are usually sung to a tune with 8 bars of 6/8 jig time" and "This is one reason for their popularity, especially with children" (and possibly "If a Limerick is sung very slowly, the music may be written as 16 bars of 3/4 time", although I appreciate this may just be a simple mathematical truth). I'm sure the statements about their the tune and popularity are true, but we really need to point to a source that has said that, so that other editors can confirm it as true - if left there without a source, then other editors may "correct" it to their own understanding of the tune, or simply remove it for not being attributed to any source. I'm sure there's plenty of literature out there that talks about the tune of limericks and why children enjoy them. --McGeddon (talk) 14:49, 27 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Again, thanks for your help. I don't really want to spend more time out of my limited remaining life on this, to be honest. I prefer performing folk poetry, song, music and dance while I can. I hope that future contributors think before they remove the obvious, or better still, add the extra material you would like to see. Why not just say "citation needed" and hope it comes along. It's all a positive step forward, and should continue in that way. Goodbye, GlasgowStuart, still to learn full editing.