User talk:Dineshkannambadi/Archive3

Corrections for Tirumala

Hi,Thanks a lot.I never knew that there was one more Vijaynagar King of the same name.(Southernstar)Southernstar

—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Southernstar (talk • contribs) 13:58, 2 January 2007 (UTC).

Hi

Hi! Was looking at Hoysala Empire. Excellent work! This time the references have been taken care of from the beginning, right? Anyway, I have a request. The article Tamil people has been brought to FAR. Could you please see the FA Review and help improve the article? Regards.--Dwaipayan (talk) 05:40, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

Hoysala

Hi! The best person to copyedit would have been Tony1 (talk · contribs) (because he is the best, plus he is non-Indian). But he is usually busy. You can ask Nichalp (talk · contribs) or Ambuj.Saxena (talk · contribs). If I can manage some time, I shall try. Regards.--Dwaipayan (talk) 18:08, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

Temple at Somanathapura

Hi, I didn't want to make any changes on my own. However, I still believe that the most appropriate name for the temple would be something like Chennakeshava temple (Somanthapura). Like the temple in Belur, the temple in Somanathapura is also widely known as Chennakeshava. Please see this google listing. Some of the links are to pages that happen to mention both Belur and Somanathapura, but certainly there are many references to the Somanathapura temple as a Chennakeshava temple. A good number of these google hits are tourism packages. But this hit from the Archaeological Survey of India, on an official government website, refers to the Somanathpur temple as a Chennakesava temple. Not that it counts for anything, but my personal experience is that the temple is referred to as Chennakeshava. --BostonMA

It would help me if I could understand why you prefer "Keshava" to "Chennakeshava". Chenna is just means beautiful. The two names are used interchangably, and so I am reluctant to label one temple as Chennakeshava and others as Keshava. It seems to be perpetuating a myth that there are two different names. Consider, the most commonly used name for Tiruchirapalli is Trichy and the most common name for Ootacamund is Ooty. But at Wikipedia, we use the more "correct" name for an article, even if it is less common, and have a redirect from the alternative name. In my opinion, Chennakeshava is more correct. I do not wish to obstruct. I am just presenting my point of view. --BostonMA ^talk 01:09, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Thank you for being so patient with me. I apologize that such a small detail matters to me. It is fine to not use brackets. Which way be be easier to do the merge? First move Keshava temple to Chennakesava temple at Somanathapura (or whatever) and then move remaining material from Somanathapura, or vice-versa? --BostonMA ^talk 01:31, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

The Somanathapura article seemed longer, so I split that, moving the temple section to Chennakesava Temple at Somanathapura. I will merge the Keshava temple article into that tomorrow. However, if you have the inclination, please move ahead. Sincerely, --BostonMA ^talk 02:47, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Re:Cpedit

Oh! I didn't know that. Please let me know if I have to keep something else in mind before I move onto next sections. Gnanapiti 02:26, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Re:Hoysala Empire

I don't copyedit articles, but I critique the text for inconsistencies. I'm busy during the week, so I'll have a look at it over the weekend. Regards, =Nichalp «Talk»= 16:38, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Re: Hoysala Empire

Hi! IPA is International Phonetic Alphabet. Audio means add pronounciation of Hoysala (preferably the native pronounciation). These are not must for FAC though. Please see the article Kolkata (and many others) where there is a link to the audio pronounciation at the beginning, and also the IPA form. You may contact SameerKhan (talk · contribs) for IPA rendering. He is a specialist. Regards.--Dwaipayan (talk) 17:20, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Copyedit request

Hi,

I had been busy for the last couple of days so couldn't work on your request. I will try to do a copyedit tomorrow or the day after. Hope this is not very urgent. — Ambuj Saxena (talk) 19:07, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Hi! Good work. Now have to address the concerns in the FAC. So be ready for quick works :) Try to add the IPA and audio. Regards.--Dwaipayan (talk) 04:09, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Hoysala Empire and Hoysala architecture

Sir, this article is being nominated for FA review. A thorough spell check would be appreciated by me( whenever you have time). In fact, waiting for a few days for reviews to get over before spellcheck may be a good idea. Thanks.Dineshkannambadi 00:12, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Hi. Thank you for doing spell check.Dineshkannambadi 21:14, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

You're welcome, and good luck with the featured article process. By the way, did you know that Firefox 2.0 has a built-in spellchecker for many languages? You might find this useful in future. Cheers, CmdrObot 23:00, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Wikiproject Karnataka

Hi Dinesh, you should join this. Thanks. Sarvagnya 23:35, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Hoysala and others

Hi! It's great that Tony saw the article. He is one of the best in the business of reviewing. Now, the article has to go through strict perusal and changes. Yes, dewikilinking of all those years will be beneficial. Just follow what Tony recommends.

Regarding Western Chalukyas, there is no problem!! It's a different article and can become FA in its own right. Regards.--Dwaipayan (talk) 06:58, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Just addressing the specific examples cited by Tony won't be enough. He would cite more if he manages some time to review again. Try to rope in someone else. You can try Parthi (Venu) (though he is busy with Tamil people FAR). Ambuj will be great if he can manage. Regards.--Dwaipayan (talk) 20:03, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Map

I have made the changes to the map. It's actually quite easy to make maps and diagrams. I taught myself the art of cartography earlier this year. Get a copy of inkscape, (its free and available for many OS platforms). Go through the tutorials that come with it, and I'll guide you from there on once your through. Regards, =Nichalp «Talk»= 15:38, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

was that helpful?

Didn't know if I was helping or interrupting something you were doing! What is the status now regarding your article? Sincerely, Mattisse 16:08, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

Help?

Is there anything I can do to help? (I have a little confidence back -- probably temporarily!) Also, where is the link to your FA review? Maybe some of those other articles I could start using your article -- then you could refine it? Sincerely, Mattisse 16:30, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

Hoysala article

I've been doing some copyediting, trying to simplify and vary the wording. Hopefully I haven't done anything destructive. Two things I know FA people do not like. One is footnotes in the middle of a sentence (if it can be avoided), and another is links to a heading in another article (e.g. Dravidian) because if someone changes the heading the link will break. Regarding the religious part, are there some general statements that can be made about religion then? To me it gets very confusing quickly because of all the Hindu detail, then it mentions the decline of Jainism and Buddhism, but later it talks about sumptuous Buddhist monestaries. What? I thought they were in decline? I'm joking but hopefully you get my drift. The whole article has to hang together as one. (I wrote an article today to take care of one of your red links - Siraf. It turned out to be very interesting learning the little bit I did writing it! Sincerely, Mattisse 23:47, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

a few things I's change - second to last para - something like this

Major political changes were taking place in the deccan region in the early 14th century when significant areas of northern India were under Muslim rule. Alla-ud-din Khilji, the Sultan of Delhi, was determined to bring isolated South India under his domain. To this end he sent his commander Malik Kafur on a southern expeditions to plunder the Seuna capital Devagiri in 1311 and by 1318 the Seuna empire was subjugated. The Hoysala capital Halebidu (also called Dorasamudra or Dwarasamudra) was sacked twice, in 1311 and 1327.

Sincerely, Mattisse 00:52, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

last para in history - suggestions - haven't checked where the links go

By 1336 the Sultan had conquered the Pandyas of Madurai, the Kakatiyas of Warangal and the tiny kingdom of Kampili. The Hoysalas were the only remaining Hindu empire who resisted the invading armies. Veera Ballala III stationed himself at Tiruvannamalai and offered stiff resistance to the southern invasions, curtailing the growth of the emerging Sultanate of Madurai. Then after nearly two decades of resistance, Veera Ballala III died in 1343 at the battle of Madurai and the Hoysala empire was merged with the emerging Vijayanagara Empire. Sincerely, Mattisse 01:01, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Much improved!

I'll keep running through it tommorrow for flow and continuity. It's 100 percent better! Sincerely, Mattisse 03:47, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Religion section cleared right up!

That is much better! Now I understand. Sincerely, Mattisse 16:33, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

just a suggestion

Perhaps in the literature section it would be better to give more of an overall summary of the direction literature was taking. Then give only a couple of specific examples to emphasise your general points, especially since there is an article readers can go to if they want to know more detail. What do you think? I'm going to read over again what FA people said. Sincerely, Mattisse 18:24, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

read the latest

O.K. They seem to like it except for the flow. I can work on that. Spelling -- even though I lived in Britain for a while as a child I sometimes get the spellings mixed up. I was looking for pictures on Wiki Commons for greater variety. Are there any of coins, or fabric, flags? Sincerely, Mattisse 18:46, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

"family inscription"

I'm not clear what that means. At first I thought it was like an insignia. But no? Sincerely, Mattisse 18:58, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

is mathmatics a literary work?

Reply Yes, from what I read. Maths is classified as secualr works.

If there is something remarkable about it -- something that stands out. If there were a place where you dicuss scientifc, agricultural, engineering advances and such it would fit in. Is is mentioned in the literature article? The problem is, for a person like me, there are so many names. That would be my reservation over adding another. On the other hand, it seems there is so much concentration on the arts in this survey article, and I secretly believe the Hoysalas had to be more accomplised in other areas than they are given credit. Else, how did these "hill peoples" pull this whole thing off, conquer lands etc. They could not have had the luxury of building fabulous temples if they did not have a strong grip on other areas. So, bottom line is, I don't know. You could try it and see if you can work it in someplace meaningful. (Experimentation is O.K.!) Sincerely, Mattisse 20:17, 12 December 2006 (UTC) Reply India was highly advanced in Math and architecture at this time. Its no wonder the Hoysalas had such good architects under them. In addition, Soapstone the material they used for their sculptures is found in plenty in the Mysore Plateau (South Karnataka).It is soft when mined and hardens over a period of time, a sculptors utopia!!! Hill Peoples does not mean "Hill billies". In fact, Hill people always had an advantage in that they controlled the sources of water, had all the vantage points. In one of your edits in the Architecture para you wrote "modern interest in the Hoysalas". There in lies the key to your question. Today we are only concerned about their architecture because it encompases all their intelligence such as math, astronomy, soil engineering and religious fervor. You will understand this only if you visit the temples. Every thing in the temple, every sculpture, pillar, bracket, decor has a logical reason. Most of the sculpture work was not just for beauty but also as "metallurgical stress relief" to the material itself.

P.S. Did the Hoysalas originate or promote the Kannanda language or was it coincidental that it flourished during their time? Was it related in some way to social factors, like the empowerment of the "locals"? (But as the FA editors stuck in, the caste systme remained firmly in place.) Sincerely, Mattisse 20:17, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

ReplyThe hoysalas were native to Kannada speaking region of South India and hence they encouraged their native language. Kannada has a recorded history of over 2000 years. Please read Kannnada Language when you find time (my mother tongue).

port cities?

I realised from the Sarif article that trade of consumer goods in this area started very early and was flourishing big time by the 4th century. The Hoysalas were probably benefitting from all this activity and foreign contact. Archiologists have found relics (is that the word?) from India in Sarif. Did the Hoysalas have port cities specifically?. Sincerely, Mattisse 20:37, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Reply-->Yes, they traded freely on the western sea board. The map does not show this but the coastal Karnataka was under Hoysala control as the Alupas and Santharas who ruled the coastal areas were a Hoysala feudatory. This is mentoned in one of the sub articles.

government

I do remember one of the reviewer complaining about this sentence:

The Hoysala centralised administration was similar to that of the Western Chalukya and Western Ganga Dynasties in matters of cabinet and command, local governing bodies and division of territory into provinces and districts . . .

The specific complaint was that the sentence does not say anything if the reader is not already familiar with Western Chalukya and Western Ganga Dynasties form of government and that you cannot assume the reader is. Can you rephrase it to be more specific without the references to the prior dynasties? Sincerely, Mattisse 21:15, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Reply-->The complaint was before my edits to the line. I can reword it anyway.

not trying to harass you

Just trying to understand. I wasn't suggesting they were "hillbillies". It's just that one has to image the reader coming upon the article without the background you have -- like me, and I am a fairly educated person. But I don't have the context. I am learning. I realise that India is enormously sophisticated and certainly was then. Amazingly so. We want the reader to understand this. Sincerely, Mattisse 23:30, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

ok

I can stay out of it. Apologise for trying to fill in the blanks. Sorry. Sincerely, Mattisse 23:46, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Tamil people

Its two week FAR is almost up - are concerns addressed? Wikipedia:Featured article review/Tamil people. Sandy (Talk) 18:31, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Hi

Hi! Do not worry, Hoysala should pass the FAC, provided Nichalp's concerns are satisfied. FAC is not a vote. Even one single strong proper oppose may outdo a number of supports. Nichalp has, as usual, guided the article towards proper direction. Let's wait to see if he has something more to say. After his concerns are addressed, try to knock Tony once (say him in gist the thorough change in the article's architecture and language per Nichalp's review). It would take some more time, but it seems the article should pass the FAC.

I am not a history buff per se. However, like to read history articles. I get to know many things about all those things I just happen to remember the names of from school text books! Also, any India related FACs are great to watch. The problem nowadays it seems that lesser number of people are participating in FACs. Also, the quality demanded in FAC has become pretty high, sometimes tough to attain. But that's good for wikipedia. Regards.--Dwaipayan (talk) 14:28, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Re:Jainism in Karnataka

Thanks Dinesh. In fact planning to approach you after bringing these articles to a decent shape, so that we can work towards making it an FA. Meanwhile, I will continue to work on these articles and see if I can find some more good sources. Naveen ^(talk) 16:17, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Jainism in KA

This is how we need to structure the page (I think this will under go change) This is a big topic and may take a long time to develop.

• Jainism in Karnataka
  • Early History (300BC to 500AD)
  • Medeival History (500AD-1000AD)
    • Mention of Kingdoms and how they encouraged with main article link Western Ganga Dynasty
  • Late medeival History(1000-1500AD)
    • Decline (in Hoysala/Vijayanagar time)
  • Modern Histroy(1500-date)
  • Pilgrim places
    • Shravanabelagola (with main article link)
    • Kambadahalli (with main article link)
    • Others
  • Jain architecture briefs
  • Jain Literature (Kannada/Prakrit)

Dineshkannambadi 16:48, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Sure, I think this organization would suit given the vastness of the topic. I will work on these lines. -- Naveen ^(talk) 16:56, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Pronunciation in Hoysala Empire

Dinesh, I have added the pronunciation of Hoysala empire in Kannada (ಹೊಯ್ಸಳ ಸಾಮ್ರಾಜ್ಯ). Can you check it out and see if it sounds OK. -- Naveen ^(talk) 16:56, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

I was also confused with Sameer's comments, so I added the audio pronunciation of this in Kannada which Sameer can also listen to it and see if the IPA transcription matches the exact pronunciation. I have left a note at his talk page. Meanwhile, I wanted you also to listen to the audio once and see if it sounds OK. -- Naveen ^(talk) 02:20, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

Thank you for the Barnstar!

That is very kind of you. I looked at the article today and read the newest comments by the FA people. What do you think? Do you want me to contiue? Sincerely, Mattisse 19:35, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Queen Umadevi

Do you know what she achieved in governance and miliary? I can't figure out how to fix "made notable achievements in governance and military." Any ideas? Sincerely, Mattisse 01:42, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

Feudalism vs feudal society vs Examples of feudalism

Take a look at this: Indian feudalism. I looked up "feudaltory" and Wikipedia does not have an article on it.

• Feudalism
• feudal society
• Examples of feudalism

What is the meaning in your article, as apparently it has many meanings. Sincerely, Mattisse 02:47, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

Veera Ballala II

Would it be all right to try to put the information about Veera Ballala II in one place so the reader can grasp this was all done by the same person? He was the greatest monarch, he founded Bangalore (presumable since it was founded during his time), he defeated the aggressive Pandya etc. Just a suggestion. Sincerely, Mattisse 14:50, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

Kannada

Tell me if this is right: The Hoysalas were local people. Their language was Kannada. When they gained control they encouraged the local language, literature etc. Hence the importance of Kannada during this period. Sincerely, Mattisse 19:17, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

Vishnuvardhana

He is mentioned in both para 3 and 4 under history. Is there a way of combining him in one place? Sincerely, Mattisse 19:41, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

My problem was with using merging with emerging empire in same sentence

Need different words. Actually, what you just wrote me is very clear. Maybe you should use that. Sincerely, Mattisse 00:22, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

Sorry!

There has been much awfulness going on here at Wikipedia. I have just withdrawn from massive arbitrations and nastiness. Perhaps now I can get back to thinking about your article. Sincerely, Mattisse 01:55, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

It's not over -- these things never end here

But maybe a few days peace before some further disruption. As BostonMA says, "There is always drama on Wikipedia." Massive understatement, but he has been stellar. He is truly wonderful person. Sincerely, Mattisse 02:28, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

Stubby sentences

O.K. Tomorrow first thing. Sincerely, Mattisse 03:49, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

Hoysala FA

The last FA comment was very favorable and notes only small barriers to FA status. I will run through for stubby sentences. Sincerely, Mattisse 15:23, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

how about "hired and supervised"

instead of the less direct " were responsible for" Just a suggestion. Sincerely, Mattisse 16:25, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

Re: combining sentences

I try to keep that in mind and I am assuming you are following in my tracks (at some point) to rectify by changing or removing text. I'm not meaning my edit to be the last one but sometimes just to point in the needed direction. Just overturn anything I do that you don't like. (That editor appears to have given you good suggestions on specificity and clarity.) Sincerely, Mattisse 16:41, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

local language

I don't want to mess up things now as they seem to be going so well, but I have the urge to stick the word "local" in a few places to point out that Kannada was the Hoysalas local language brought from the hills. Sincerely, Mattisse 17:00, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

died is so bland

Maybe you could say "gruesomely murdered" or something colorful but accurate and then go into details in note if you want. Sincerely, Mattisse 17:49, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

Dandanayaka

Is there a reason for mentioning Dandanayaka then? That is the commander? What was the name of the head of each province? I'm trying to get an overall outline of the administrative structure but I am not understanding. Sincerely, Mattisse 18:35, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

I don't know what to do about it then. I'm just trying to make sense of it. Perhaps just discuss the one province as an example of the structure of the others? The word itself is not going to have any meaning to the general reader. It seems like these words are useful if they enlighten the reader regarding the article's subject in some way - like the explanation of the Hoysala name. Otherwise, they obscure the flow of the article and perhaps belong in the Kannada language aricle. Of course this is just my opinion. Maybe Blacksun has some suggestions. Sincerely, Mattisse 19:06, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

temple dancers

Were they always women? In the article it is assumed that they are from the context of the statement. However, there may be readers from countries where that may not be the case. Thanks! Sincerely, Mattisse 21:02, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

Actually, Devadasi sounds like a form of prostitution. Sincerely, Mattisse 21:09, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

Are you sure you want a link to that page then, rather than just use different words in your article that explains the situation at the time of the Hoysalas? Sincerely, Mattisse 21:20, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

It's about writing

So I guess its about English prose, the ability to communicate in English. But this is the case in my profession also. A person in my field completes certain tasks to make a professional decision, but success is more related to the ability to communicate that decision than to the tasks that determine it.

Of course, Wikipedia is a whole different story in that you will have to let go of this article at some point, as people will eventually do what they want with it. Personally, I am uncertain if this Wikipedia model of knowledge accumulation will work over time. The pleasure must be in the creation for people like you and me -- trying to get it right, be accurate but also to communicate the major points you want to make in a way that will interest the reader.

Hope you are not feeling discouraged as it is work and some of it involves sacrificing what you want personally. And that is hard to do. I know that from personal experience. Sincerely, Mattisse 22:25, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

temple building

I removed it because it came out of nowhere and referred to nothing after it . It didn't say who was competing or why. If you can find a way to relate it to something or explain it, then stick it back in. Sincerely, Mattisse 23:55, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

Congratulations on Society in Hoysala empire DYK

Just saw that Society in Hoysala empire is on the front page. Congratulations! --BostonMA ^talk 01:28, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

DYK

On 18 December, 2006, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Society in Hoysala empire, which you created. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the "Did you know?" talk page.

--Yomangani^talk 01:28, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

I didn't notice that you had forked the article from the main Hoysala page. Technically, it isn't eligible that way, but I didn't know so I nominated it anyway. :P Blnguyen (bananabucket) 02:07, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

You mean point the bold to the main article? If that's the case, if can't be done as it isn't a new article. Someone else will notice and likely remove it altogether... Blnguyen (bananabucket) 02:55, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Hoysala/Chalukya etc.

Instead of putting the rulers in the Category:Indian monarchs (which is too large) do try to create new cats "hoysalite monarchs" (dont know if thats the right noun) "Chalukyan monarchs", etc. Itlessens the load on the main cat. Check Categgory:Meitei royals for an example.Bakaman 02:32, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Hoysala FAC

Hello, I have added 2-3 more inotes and I have added a question to one of your responses to the inotes in the FAC section. Please respond to it when you can. Good job with the article btw.--Blacksun 14:29, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Main page

I guess I missed it -- it's not there now on the Main page. Or maybe I am not looking at the right place! Sincerely, Mattisse 14:42, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

How far back in the archives? I've look pretty far back. Also, to me the Hoysala Empire article seems to be in good shape. I'll take a few runs through it, but it looks good. Do you see any particular problems? Sincerely, Mattisse 15:19, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Architecture pic

Vimana, Somanathapura

This picture is just a suggestion to show what you mean about the detailed, ornate tower versis emphasis on height. Plus it gives some variation to the other pictures which tend to be so dark with no white tone. (I know I don't know what I am talking about.) Just an idea! Sincerely, Mattisse 18:31, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

put it back the way it was

I'll just return it to its original state today before I tried to change it. I'll revert that section to a previous version. Sorry! Sincerely, Mattisse 21:46, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Dambal

Maybe you can tell me what to put in it. I found that link you have to the book on architecture of the Indian subcontinent. Sincerely, Mattisse 22:30, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

P.S. That photo really demonstrates what you are talking about in the Hoysala architecture section. Also, I'm not saying the dark pictures are not beautiful, and what you describe about the lighting is wonderous. I was just thinking of the overall impact of the article more from a design point of view. However, the Che Guevara FA starts out with all black and white photos and that is effective so there are may ways to go. Sincerely, Mattisse 22:37, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Each photo has its pluses. I like the one that is on the page now because if the person is not familiar with Indian architecture, it really shows the incredible amount of detail. I know that I was not aware of the level of detail, even after working on Indian temple articles until I ran across that multicolored detailed temple picture that is in several articles. Then I started to look much closer. To the uninitiated westerner, of which I am probably representative, a building is form, structure, lines etc. I've never personally seen a building covered with such intricate design, so I'm not expexting to see it. In my case, it had to hit me over the head. The second photo gives a better view of the overall form of the building. Also, it depends what other photos you are going to put in the article. If you are going to have other temple photos, then it would be good to vary the perspective. Hope this helps! Sincerely, Mattisse 00:59, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

Hoysala see also

Hello, I have removed the vertical list structure of the see also section in the Hoysala Empire article. Too much white space is a no no in FACs. --Blacksun 09:59, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

In fact, their is no need for a "See Also" section as all the links mentioned in it are already present in the article. I have gone ahead and deleted that section. PS. this is consistent with other FA articles - quite a few Indian history FA articles have no see also section. --Blacksun 10:05, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

Your message

Hopefully you are not a single use account meant for vandalism

Not hopefully but most certainly.

(not a marathi newspaper or journal)

I take this as deep offense. How would u feel if I say u cant use newspaper or journal of ur language? You are not entitled to comment something like that. I can obviously use any citations from any Indian languages. Please refrain from making such immature statements.

Addition of Marathi script

If u dont know, Rashtrakutas have ruled present day Maharashtra and Maharashtri Prakrit was also a prevalent then. This makes a strong reason inclusion of Marathi script.

Thanks for ur warm welcome. :) Mrtag 14:07, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

Please prove it with scholarly citations the way Wikipedia expects us to

English language wikipedia and all citations have to be in English or should be translated to English from any other language

राष्ट्रकूटांनी आपल्या राज्यात कन्नड कला-साहित्याला राजाश्रय दिलाच परंतू तिसर्या गोविंद (७९३-८१४) व विदर्भातील राजकूटांनी महाराष्ट्री प्राकृतला सन्मानाची वागणूक दिली. Rashtrakutas developed not only kannada culture literature but Third Givinda and Rashtrakutas from Vidarbha (especially) respected Maharashtri Prakrit.मराठी भाषेची जननी असलेली महाराष्ट्री प्राकृत राष्ट्रकूटांच्या काही भागात राजभाषा म्हणून उदयास आली होती. Mother of Marathi language, Maharashtri Prakrit was court language in few parts of Rashtrakuta empire. Mrtag 14:34, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

What misleading? If u want the exact Maharashtri Prakrit,so be it.Stop reverting I have even provided the citationsMrtag 14:44, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

You are vandalising the Seuna page and we know pretty well who you are

Is this a threat? Who I am? Rather who are u to pass such comments? Plz find some authentic sources and stop ur vandalistion for Kannada was a weak language (if compared to Marathi) during the reign of Yadavas. Just asking another source for ur tall claims is not vandalism.Mrtag 15:30, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

I am not with prejudice. Maharashtri Prakrit was indeed a major language during rashtrakuta times. rashtrakutas have ruled Maharashtra which is not a secret. Yadavas are pure Marathi rulers or atleast they patronized Marathi which was indeed the strongest language (rather only language) at their times. Although their is no consensus about they being Kannada. This is a fact and not prejudice.

Secondly I dont want to waste time by quarreling with you. Not only you are a chauvinist but extraordinarily rude and inconsiderate. Mrtag 15:46, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

All citations should come with book name , Author, publisher, ISBN or OCLC or any identification number validating its publication. All web links need to be accessable and should provide author, publisher and preferably be copywrited. I intend to follow up on your citations as I said and make sure they are valid.thanks

The answer to ur anxiety and threatening is that I have recently read WP:BITE. Thanks :) Mrtag 17:30, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

Who said that? Mr.Kannambadi stop ur rhetoric as u have messed with wrong person this time. I promise to counter ur misleading and mockery of history. You can't insult our glorious past and go hands-free. Mrtag 03:41, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

Hoysala infobox

I think the reason why a reviewer wanted the photo within the infobox was because a "???" image would previously show up if no flag nor coat of arms was provided. I have since altered the infobox template so this does not happen. This infobox is more complicated than most templates so if you have any questions or requests about it, pleas ask. As for the list of leaders, it just looks a little unusual to say that the Hoysala Empire started in the 10th century but the table lists leaders only from the 11th: a minor thing - 52 Pickup 20:05, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

Mr.Kannambadi i have zero intrest in communicating with u. You are too rude and snobbish. Dont address ur messages to me or write on my talk page.Mrtag 03:07, 22 December 2006 (UTC)

Barnstar

		The Epic Barnstar
		Awarded to Dineshkannambadi by deeptrivia on behalf of WikiProject Indian history for outstanding contributions to articles related to Indian history. deeptrivia (talk) 06:51, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

Congrats

Hi Dinesh, Congratulations on yet another FA. I must say the effort you put into this and the way you handled the Peer review and FAC review speaks about your dedication. -- Naveen ^(talk) 17:28, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

Congradualtions and thank you!

I would be happy to help you out with further articles. It forces me to have to think which is why I like copy editing. And I love to learn. I've watch you patiently persist through the FA process and admire how you handled that. Congradulations again! Sincerely, Mattisse 17:34, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

Congratulations

That was quite an effort. Well done. Sincerely, --BostonMA ^talk 21:01, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

Congratulations on this great effort Dinesh! - Parthi ^{talk/contribs} 21:14, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

Congratulations

Congratulations on yet another FA. This is truly a reward for your hard work. Keep the good work going. Gnanapiti 00:54, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

Happy Christmas!

Thanks for the greetinngs and congrats in getting the article featured. Anyone can add the {{featured article}} template after it is featured. Make sure it is placed somewhere at the bottom of the article. Regards, =Nichalp «Talk»= 05:47, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

suryakant Kamat

I'm starting to see a lot of work attributed to him on wiki. I myself have used his work on a new page I created on N.G. Chandavarkar. Who is he? I'm assuming a noted South Indian historian, but thats about it. Could you give me some background?Bakaman 20:36, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

Thanks. Its good to have a true-blue Desi being quoted. Have you heard of Sukhanand Shetty (I think he was famous in Karnataka)? That's going to be my next project in my userspace. Bakaman 20:48, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

Oh no not a historian. He was a Hindu BJP politician from Mangalore who became a martyr after being murdered by jihadis operating in Karnataka.Bakaman 20:55, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

Congrats and Request

Hi! Congrats on getting Hoysala to FA status. Great work. I missed the moment when it got the status. So I am late. What's the next target? Vijaynagara?

I have a request. Please go through the article Delhi, at least the History section. Since you have many books on Indian history, you may be able to polish the section and also furnish some reputable references. Delhi is now at Peer Review. Regards.--Dwaipayan (talk) 07:18, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

Yadavas of Deogiri

U have crossed each and every limit of indecency and idiocy. I had promised u that i will end ur rhetoric and I think I am doing well as per my promise. U have tried many ways to suppress me or block me but again let me assure u of my conviction and determination.

I think you should see this before opening ur mouth and churning out nonsensical comments. Let me again remind u of behaving urself and talking gracefully with colleagues. Its important because it reflects the upbringing and teachings we received from our parents.

Vishu123 06:24, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

Vijayanagara next?

It would be great to see Vijayanagara empire featured. Let's see if we can work on it. We have almost 100 members on WP:HOI. I think it is time to start a Collaboration Of The Week there. Even if 10% people participate, we'll have 10 editors collaborating on one article. We can certainly acheive a lot in terms of FAs. The project is still waiting to really get started. It would be great to see things moving ahead. Let's figure out how to make that happen. Regards, deeptrivia (talk) 09:16, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

Western Chalukyas

Hi, the translation[1] provided by 59.95.28.231 is OK. It seems that although Manasollasa was a Sanskrit work, it contained some Marathi songs as well. I've added an English-language citation as well. Hope this helps. I really appreciate the awesome amount of work you've putting in the history-related articles. Just try to keep away from revert wars. utcursch | talk 10:15, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

Epic Barnstar

		The Epic Barnstar
		Epic Barnstar for your phenomenal effort and tireless contributions in articles relating to History of Karnataka. Hoping to see more FAs from you.Naveen (talk) 06:25, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

Happy New Day!

Happy, happy everything. I feel camaraderie with you since (I believe) you confessed that you don't understand religion very well. I feel you are more like me than most here. So I wish you happiness. Sincerely, Mattisse 03:20, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

Vijayanagar(a)

I think let's first decide on a consistent spelling, and then stick to it throughout wikipedia. My preference for Vijayanagara is entirely due to the textbooks I read, but maybe we can discuss it with more people. The move to Vijayanagar Architecture can be requested if we decide on that spelling. I think yesterday I had added a's at many places because I thought they were missed out by accident. So, let's choose one of these, and use the same spelling everywhere. Regards, deeptrivia (talk) 19:03, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

I recently got Indore, India moved to Indore. It was easy.. leave this to me! deeptrivia (talk) 19:09, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

Vijayanagara Empire

i would get involved but I don't want to get in the way -- edit conflicts and such when there are may people working on the same article at once! Sincerely, Mattisse 02:18, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Yadavas of Devagiri

Hello! Happy new year to you as well. I am writing u for a possible solution of our disputes over Yadavas of Devagiri as suggested by a senior member of wikipedia.

Yadavas of Devagiri,according to me and by citations I provide, are Marathi speaking. Although few South Indian historians might consider them as kannadigas. You have provided the citation of Mr.Kamath. In the same way I have the books of Mr C.V.Vaidya (and possibly Mr.Altekar,need to search them) which talk about Chalukyas/Rashtrakutas in the same fashion. Mr.Altekar, Mr.Bhandarkar, Mr.vaidya, Mr.Rajwade are all noted historians. Hence the possible solution to this is we dont insist on Kannada/Mararthi scripts on disputed articles and keep the 'origin' controversy a low-affair.

The Kannada script on yadavas page and 'official language' is not necessary. It is proved beyond doubt that yadavas of devagiri had Marathi as their court language. However we can add that a historian feels that during Sevunachandra times kannada was a court language and a brief information about their possible kannada origins. Ditto for Rashtrakuta and Chalukya, Kadambas and other medieval kingdoms which Vaidya/Bhandarkar/Rajawade claims are of Maratha origin.

Our ceasefire is necessary is it might be trouble times ahead for both of us.I request u to think about it.And of course I am still ready for ur proposal of rashtrakutas.

Vishu123 07:01, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Sure.

• Medieval India (madhyayugin bharat) By C.V.Vaidya- It contains both the theories of Dr.Bhandrakar and V.K.Rajwade
• Marathyancha Itihaas By Dr.S.G Kolarkar (it books too contain many postulates of above noted historians)
• Maharashtrache prachin rajyakarte by V.K rajwade
• Bharatacha Ithaas Dr.S.G Kolarkar

I think few of this books are out of print. But u can find them in big libraries. Vishu123 16:59, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Dr.Altekar specifically mentions 'Rashtrakutas are marathi speakers'. U r also requested to not mix Kannadiga origin and Kannada language as in Yadavas of Devagiri. Vishu123 17:01, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Great! I will be looking forward for it :) Anyways I have got two good books which will further the confusion about Medieval kingdoms being Marathi or Kannada. Ur incivility is again rampant. Maintain some decency and stop removing cited info.Dont act like a child. Dont u think that it is only u who reads history. as I said,u have really messed up with wrong person this time. Vishu123 17:08, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

While you are not capable of getting any articles to FA status, dont throw your "so called citations" in the LEAD and spoil the article.

We all know you are not in wikipedia to achieve anything useful.

This is what I call elitism. I would certainly not want to write nonsense as u write and hide the truth and facts. Yadavas are Kannadigas,so tomorrow Lodhi and Mughals are Kannadigas? Its a shame that such lingual chauvinists are disrupting media with their dubious citations.U r certainly not suitable for writing balanced neutral and sensible history articles.Pity!

The number of sock accounts you have created over the last 6 months must be mind boggling even to you, given this where is the credibility of your character and historical readings.

I am on wikipedia from past 10-15 days. What sockpuppets? What should one do when someone conspires and blocks ur account unnecessarily? For god's sake learn some manners.You will be unsuccessful everywhere if u continue ur nonsense lingual chauvinism everywhere.Thanks. Vishu123 18:48, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Marathi citations

Enough is enough.I had warned u against scorning Marathi books or citations. Who the hell are u to comment? Marathi is rich and diverse language. Marathi authors do not take English's help for their expression. If ur Kannada language is not flourishing or dead, books are not publishing in it is not our fault. Damn u,dont dare to speak anything against my language.Vishu123 19:01, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Stop removing cited info

Stop removing cited info for once. It is clear by now that ur depressed and lost because ur nothing but a fanatic lier who writes nonsense anywhere and everywhere. If u remove the content I will follow the suit. Loser! Vishu123 19:11, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Vishu123

Hi. I am back from a short break. I see that another sock account has been created. I will do what I can to prevent further disruption by this user. - Aksi_great (talk) 14:05, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Yes, I just saw the personal attacks on the Seuna page and on other pages. I am waiting for some admin to comment on the AN page. If that does not happen in one or 2 days, or things become very bad, I will take further action. - Aksi_great (talk) 16:09, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Your vandalisation

Please see this and this. Google books and other language citations can be used in wikipedia. So stop ur vandalisation now. Vishu123 06:53, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

re: merge

Yes. Plus what is the Background section? Also, it seems like the History section is overwhelmingly long for those of us not well versed. What do you think about whittling it down to major historical landmarks that an uneducated reader could follow? Sincerely, Mattisse 22:59, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

articles galore

• Origin of Vijayanagara Empire
• Ancient City of Vijayanagara
• Life in Vijayanagara Empire
• Vijayanagara
• Hampi

plus:

• Battle of Talikota
• Haridasa - redirect from Haridasas of Vijayanagar Empire

and articles on architecture, literature etc.

It seems like these articles are scattered around already. Could you consider incoporating extra information in an existing article perhaps? Sincerely, Mattisse 23:25, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

Yes, that would be better

On the Hoysala article, the FA people wanted a straight forward organization. I think we should follow the same one, unless there is a compelling reason to do otherwise. (I don't think I did too much damage today -- I spent a lot of time confused and trying to figure things out! Some sections, like History, were over my head.) Sincerely, 23:30, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

not suggesting yanking them

I'm suggesting using them. Put the info there if possible rather than create new articles. And as you say, incorporate links to them at strategic places. Sincerely, Mattisse 23:36, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

Sounds like I have some reading to do

This article Vijayanagara Empire is a survey article, right? So, in my opinion, your main goal is to make all this information about India comprehensible snd fascinating to the general reader who (the assumption must be) knows nothing about the topic. Then the links can go to more specialized information. If you worry about offending people (Indians, I am hypothesizing) then, in my opinion, that is directly contrary to the general goal of appealing to everyone else.

And the article must hang together. The outline for the Hoysala article is the traditional one at Wikipedia so I recommend we aim for that. Then you can go crazy with all the details in the subarticles.

In my opinion, the more you can relate the Vijayanagara Empire to other topics, especially outside India like the trade issue -- which was going bonkers in those days -- the more readers can see that everything is connected . What happened in India was part of the whole world progression. Muslims were there, Christians, Portuguese, Dutch . . . Like you say, the enorous creativity stemmed from the tremendous interactions. (It was the same for the Hoysalas.)

Sincerely, Mattisse 01:35, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

Yes - that would give us a framework we can work from

Keep it simple, as they say. You can have as many sub articles as you want, but organized it in a way the reader (Indian and non Indian) can find what they want. Sincerely, Mattisse 02:05, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

Keeps saying "template" in your outline

Must be one of those wiki formatting things. I'm about to crash right now -- but something along the lines you are proposing sounds good. Sometimes when writing, you have to feel your way through, and then it becomes obvious. The material directs you. That will happen in this case. I have to familiarize myself with it. I didn't know about all of the sub articles until today. Sincerely, Mattisse 02:12, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

having a hard time

Since this is a survey article, I think the history section should be radically chopped and summarized. It is very hard to follow and the overall points get lost in the details. It's too bad the other Indian articles are in such bad shape that you can't count on links to help you out. Many of them have been redirected and go to a different name entirely. There does not seem to be any consistent naming policy. (I got very discouraged today over all this today, trying to figure out all the terminology and names etc., but I'm trying to pick myself up now and get over it!) Sincerely, Mattisse 01:47, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Can you move the sources else where?

That whole big paragraph ends up coming to no conclusions. Can some of that go into sub articles and the sources moved else where in the article? (Anegondi needs some help.) I know that much of the intro is repeated word for word in the article, but it is more clearly written in the intro. (My opinion, of course.) Do you want me to stop? (I know you get nervous with big changes -- but with the strikeout method, nothing is removed.) Do you want me to work on one of the sub articles? Or I can leave so you can recuperate! Sincerely, Mattisse 18:42, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

torn apart

Really, I know how that feels. But at least you have the opportunity of sub articles. I've had to painfully give up many brilliant, insightfull etc. etc. words for the sake of being clear to my audience! (For all writers, that is the hardest part -- but must be done.) That's what a good editor at a big publishing house does ruthlessly to manuscipts. The author is too close to see what must be done -- even great ones. I feel your pain, as they say. Sincerely, Mattisse

don't understand

"The most important contribution from Kannada poets and scholars of this period is to the Vaishnava Bhakti movement fostered by the haridasas (devotees of Vishnu), Brahminical writings and continued growth of Virashaiva literature."

What does this mean? Does it mean the Vaishnava movement was fostered by the haridasas, Brahminical writings, and growth of Virashaiva literature?

Or does it mean the poets and scholars were fostered . . .

Sincerely, Mattisse 20:49, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

ragale metre?

I can't find a definition for it anywhere. Also, I'm assuming Dasas means poem? Sincerely, Mattisse 21:20, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

I think you should just pick a few good examples and maybe explain a little more the importance of each example. Between all the religion words and then the literary works, words and people, there is just too much. I just fixed up Srinatha because it had "unreferenced" on it.

Remembering from the comments on Hoysala Empire, the FA people don't want unexplained words that the average reader won't know, like "ragale metre". I guess it is a verse form or is it music? Sincerely, Mattisse 22:27, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

On the controversy

Calligraphic emblem

You can't just say some claim this <ref>, some claim that <ref> but it's still controversial<ref>? Sincerely, Mattisse 22:35, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Also, what about Economy and Administration? Sincerely, Mattisse 22:52, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

ok

I won't do anything ruinous. I've been cleaning up some of the linking articles. Sincerely, Mattisse 23:28, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Re: thanks

Done. Let me know if you need me to have a look at anything else. Not sure how long before I (or someone else) lifts the protection, but I think a few days, at least. Luna Santin 00:19, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

Shamesless groupism. Any rationale whatsoever for removing my info? Any justification for not adding Marathi inscription thing. The fool as u r,see the Vijaynagara empire,ur actions are bringing bad name to ur state and language! Get rid of ur kannada inferiority complex!! Adding Marathi Yadavas or Telugu/Tulu Vijayanagara empire to kannada will not make ur Karnataka great! Cheap loser that u r.Stop this foolish tactics. 59.95.15.185 06:35, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

yes, there are lots of articles, I'm finding out!

I wondered about that link. Maybe I should be clear when doing that -- linking to something that I am not 100% sure of the sourcing. But then, that would be practically every link! The more links for all of those names/places the better -- but not if they are bogus, of course. Sincerely, Mattisse 18:14, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

P.S. I keep losing your articles because I can't remember their exact names and there seems to be no central source -- except for your user page for your articles. Mattisse 18:14, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

Is there a particular part?

I tried to work on History, but to do so I would have to chop it into blocks for editing like I did yesterday. For me it is just too long and complex to edit. Should I just continue with other sections? Sincerely, Mattisse 20:20, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

Copy edit Architecture (not clear if you meant that or Social)? Sincerely, Mattisse 22:48, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

Tomorrow. It looks very colorful just glancing through it. Another bad, awful, scary day at Wikipedia. I'll do it tomorrow. Sincerely, Mattisse 01:22, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

Award

The Black Cross of St. Declan You, Dineshkannambadi, are awarded the Black Cross of St. Declan for going medieval on our asses with your excellent work on articles of Dark Ages and Middle Ages interest. De réir a chéile a thógtar na caisleáin - "It takes time to build castles" Ciarán of Clonmacnoise 05:59, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

Your articles of the time period referred to lay outside the scope of Christendom, but that's not what the award is about. Keep up the good work!

secular arch

Stables at Hampi

Ecample of secular. Sincerely, Mattisse 21:17, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

That sounds wonderful. (I am looking at that link you sent.) It will be fun to get the pictures just right to match the context. Sincerely, Mattisse 22:01, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

minor strike outs

I did some minor strike outs in the last two paragraphs of Social earlier. I can go ahead and remove the strike out parts, or you can take a look first. Sincerely, Mattisse 01:31, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

delete article

To request deletion put {{db-author}} tag on it signifying that you are the author and are requesting deletion.

Yesterday I wrote Mandapa and found it had many links. However, I could not find much information to put in it! What do you want me to do today? Sincerely, Mattisse 14:53, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

Vijayanagara Architecture

Seems like the Salient Features heading should be removed as there is no other heading at it's level. (Wikipedia servers have been unbearably slow today.) Sincerely, Mattisse 19:48, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

ok

relief on pillar

Deccan manuscript

I went through the two other articles today, Vijayanagara Architecture and Ancient City of Vijayanagara. Hope I did right by them. Sincerely, Mattisse 03:03, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Went through Governance. Sincerely, Mattisse 17:25, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

which article?

I've been poking around on several. Sincerely, Mattisse 01:10, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

Great! I need something to keep my mind off all the awful Arbitration stuff going on about me -- which I refuse to get involved in and so I ignore it to the degree I can and keeping busy helps. So anything you want me to do, let me know. Sincerely, Mattisse 18:45, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

O.K.

That sounds good. I've learned a great deal lately reading your articles and associated articles, plus looking thing up on the web. So I'm not as clueless as before. Sincerely, Mattisse 18:57, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

"mandapa" or "mantapa"

File:1008linga.jpg

Lingas carved on a rock surface on the shore of the river Tungabhadra at Hampi

I did quite an extensive search of all the articles on Wikipedia using the word and "mandapa" was used in almost all of them. In fact, your articles may be the only ones using "mantapa". I didn't do much of a web search. I got the definition from the Architecture of the Indian Subcontinent site and from [2] where "mandapa" is used. TempleNet uses "Mandapam". Sincerely, Mattisse 20:26, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

The Hindu murthis

"The Hindu murthis are considered to be self-manifestations of the deity...." I didn't write that part . It was already there. I removed much of what was in the article but I left that for later -- didn't want to get more people mad at me! (I never put anything in an article without a reference note.) Sincerely, Mattisse

Hoysala Architecture article structure

Just a suggestion for a change in structure to something like this:

Introduction

1)Deities

• Dedication
• Depiction

2)Basic elements

• Jagati
• Mandapa
• Vimana
• Pillars
• Sculpture

3}Other information

• Famous architects
• Famous temples
• Research notes

I accidently sent this so I am correcting the mistakes now! Sincerely, Mattisse 18:32, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

O.K., I'll do that. I think it will make it easier to see what is happening in it. Thanks! --Mattisse 18:52, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

Reorganisation

Should I copy the whole article and rearrange it there? Then move it back? Probably I could do it right where it is -- just rearrange the section blocks. --Mattisse 20:10, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

Changes

I know I make mistakes. A problem I was having is that the links do not go to where they say they do -- the name of the deity has been changed and somehow the reader needs to be warned about that. I'll look at the mistakes I made and try to learn! Sincerely, --Mattisse 22:41, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

Sometime you will have to tell me how you do all this writing -- on your computer in a text editor? I know you don't do it like I do, directly on Wikipedia! Sincerely, Mattisse 01:43, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

There are so many georgeous pictures. I suggest you choose ones that illustrate your points in the text. Sincerely, --Mattisse 03:09, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

About vijaynagar empire

Ok, thanks for your encouragement. I will wait adding images until you complete peer reviews and cleanup of the page. Mlpkr 12:21, 13 January 2007 (UTC) http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Dineshkannambadi&action=submit

Sure, will look forward and help in contributions whenever I can and communicate with you on discussion page before making some changes. Do not worry about edit wars. Is there is a style template for empires? btw, I enhanced article on badami today. One online text book you may refer http://igmlnet.uohyd.ernet.in:8000/gw_44_5/hi-res/hcu_images/G2.pdf for information related to Andhra Pradesh as part of Vijayanagara kingdom. Mlpkr 16:20, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Yes, thanks a lot for your advice. Are you talking about content in a specific article or about talk and communication on some articles? Mlpkr 18:12, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Samagra Andhra Sahityam by Arudra is a telugu book that collects about all authors and books written in telugu till 1900. Side note, I think saying Potana is a cousin of Srinatha is most likely fiction, not truth. Mlpkr 19:04, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

I will take when I visit it next time. You can have look at here meanwhile http://www.svzoo.org/graphics/photos/places/chandragiri.jpg. Actually there was one more fort in Udayagiri, but that is also in ruins. Mlpkr 00:38, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

I uploaded image http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Vijayanagara-empire.svg, but for some reason the India is cutoff. Do you know why or can you guide me with whom to talk? Mlpkr 16:56, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

Thanks! I left a message to nichalp. Mlpkr 17:20, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

The image does not show clear demarcation http://www.vijayanagaracoins.com/img/map.jpg, send me your scanned page, when you have time. Mlpkr 17:28, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

Vijayanagara Gallery

Ancient Market place Hampi

File:1008linga.jpg

Lingas carved on a rock surface on the shore of the river Tungabhadra at Hampi

• 
  Sanke and Siva Lingam at Lepakshi
• Gaint Nandi at Lepakshi
  Gaint Nandi at Lepakshi
• 
  Pillars at Virabhadra temple
• 
  Virabhadra temple

Lepakshi

Those are images of Lepakshi. There are even some wall paintings from the vijayanagara period. See http://www.kamat.com/kalranga/andhra/lepaxi.htm Is there a section called "arts" like literature? Mlpkr 18:42, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Edit conflicts

Just lost a bunch of edits through edit conflict. I think I'll lay off for a while. Sincerely, Mattisse 18:15, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Economy

I copy edited Economy. It may be too long and need to be tightened and summarised. Sincerely, --Mattisse 23:42, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Hi i have got the English book written by C.V.Vaidya. Once again i request u to stop insulting Marathi language and books as I could do the same. Also,stop removing cited info. Sarvabhaum 07:24, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

Vijayanagara empire

Moving it to review is very motivating, as the reviewers can be quite direct in their criticisms. (I was wanting to expand on the water systems part a little -- the empire was actually quite sophisticated. It had to deal with sewage somehow in the city. And although the city was provided with more luxurious services, the empire irrigated the fertile land beyond the city -- as you say in the article, agricultural produce was crucial. Also, that huge royal tank in the city core was filled with water for entertainment purposes like boat battles, one article said. It had no drain and was filled via aquaduct.)

The reviewers would help us focus on the relevant, as I think we both have a tendency to get caught up in favorite details!

I will continue to work on it today.

Sincerely, --Mattisse 18:02, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

Changes to Governance

Just made some STRIKEOUTS you should check. I reworded a few places but that should not be a problem. I moved the palace administration up to the top to be with the other administrative matters. And I moved a senctence about province commanders down to where provinces are discussed. Hope nothing went wrong. I'm trying to tighten and reduce wordage.

Let me know what you think. Sincerely, --Mattisse 19:35, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

how about this for intro -- then reduce or remove part about "origins' to make History smaller???

The Vijayanagara Empire (Kannada: ವಿಜಯನಗರ ಸಾಮ್ರಾಜ್ಯ, Telugu: విజయనగర సామ్రాజ్యము) (literally City of victory) was an important South Indian empire based in the Deccan. Beginning in 1336, it ruled until 1660 although its power declined after a major defeat in 1565 by its main foe, the Deccan sultanates. The empire's founders were Harihara I and his brother Bukka Raya I, guided and mentored by Saint Vidyaranya, and it is named after its capital city of Vijayanagara whose impressive ruins surround Hampi in modern Karnataka, India.

The empire's legacy are the monuments spread over South India, the best known being the group at the royal capital of Vijayanagara at Hampi, now a World Heritage Site. Efficient administration and vigorous overseas trade brought new technologies such as irrigation through water management systems. The mingling of the Southern Indian people, irrespective of faith and vernacular, inspired architectural innovation of Hindu temple construction in the Deccan and later in the Dravidian idioms using locally available granite. The temple building traditions of previous Southern Indian empires came together in the Vijayanagara Architecture style. It's secular royal structures show the influence of the Northern Deccan Sultanates architecture. The empire's patronage of the fine arts enabled literature and poetry to reach new heights in the languages of Kannada, Telugu, Tamil and Sanskrit, while Carnatic music evolved into its current form. The Vijayanagara Empire created an epoch in South Indian history that rose above the politics of narrow regionalism by promoting the ancient and indigenous Hindu dharma.

Recent archaeological excavations and research are now revealing clues to its origins and history that attest to its power and wealth. The writings of medieval European travellers, such as the Portuguese Domingo Paes and Nuniz and the Venetian Niccolò Da Conti visiting in 1420, provde the critical information needed to piece together the history of the empire as do works of literature in the local vernaculars. Writings by various foreign travellers during the late medieval era and modern research in the Vijayanagara principality have helped uncover much needed information about the empire's history, its fortifications, its scientific developments and architectural innovations.

(I left everything intact, so slight rewording with footnotes in last part would be needed). Sincerely, Mattisse 19:55, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

Interesting picture

Hi Dinesh, I think you will be interested in seeing this. This must be the same as Image:Ugranarasimha statue at Hampi.JPG before the restoration. Parthi ^{talk/contribs} 22:25, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

Thank you!

You are very kind. I also applaud you in seeking reality over preferred beliefs, your dedication to (so-called) truth, and your flexibility in compromising with the (almighty) FA article editors. I also appreiciate your trust in me (albeit not instant, but understandably so). So thank you very much. It means a great deal to receive this stamp of confidence from you. Sincerely, --Mattisse 03:30, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

(I just discovered a button at the top that records signitures with a push!)

P.S. Many famous authors still use pen and paper like you, so no failing there. Just that I woudered as you are a micro-chip designer by training . . . leagues above anything I underdant!

Ur message

History of mediaeval hindu india

(BEING A history of Indian from 600 to 1200 AD)

By

C.V Vaidya

Oriental book supplying agency,Pune

U have again reverted Yadavas of deavgiri. I dont understand why kannada wikipedians have so much hatred about Marathi or Maharashtra! I did expect muslims and marathas fighting over historical articles but not marathis and kannadigas. Look, i am tired with this fighting. Its high time u should take 2 steps behind. It seems Seunachandra had kannada as official language but not Ramchandra and Mahadev Yadav which had their capital in Devagiri. So we can rename the original article as Yadava dynasty and I would like to make seperate article of Yadavas of devagiri.

Sarvabhaum 04:31, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

empire declined

In the fourth paragraph under History, why did the empire decline in the late 15th century until 1485? What happened after Deva Raya II, possibly the most capable ruler? Sincerely, --Mattisse 17:17, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

thoughts

It just seems strange that after the most capable ruler, the empire declines for no reason. And I never thought of looking at the info box to fill that in. I think a small explanatory phrase is needed, personally.

I've been reading the FA comments and trying to fix the little stuff. They seem inclined to want the information in the article -- all proper nouns linked etc. I linked your favorite person - Numiz - but that is why I wanted to strike him before. I have written little stub article for some links, but there is really nothing to put in a stub even about him.

They found a mispelled word so I will scrutinise for those. It was luxuray -- an obvious typo.

Sincerely, --Mattisse 18:06, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

FA comments

Yes I have been doing the things on their list. I fixed the typo and will look for other misspellings. I am linking proper nouns now and will put the m dashes in. I forget what is next on the list. I won't do anything complicated or over my head -- hopefully. Sincerely, --Mattisse 18:12, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

British spelling preferred

I will look for American but having gone to school in both countries, sometimes I get confused. Try to keep my eyes open for those. Sincerely, --Mattisse 18:15, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

I have setup my mail

It already exists in wikipedia, so you may send throigh it. I am little hesitant to give it here to avoid spam. Let me know if it does not work. mlpkr 18:38, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

FA editor said all proper nouns must have links

That is what I though I read, anyway. I think he is right if he did say that. Some of links you might what to remove, because without information on them the names are meaningless anyway to most readers. Others we can make stubs for. Let me know what you think. (I am finding other solutions to some of them and using piping.) Sincerely, Mattisse 19:07, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Vijayanagara Empire template

How do I get at that to fix the m-dashes? I can't find any in the article itself -- I may be missing some. Sincerely, --Mattisse 20:37, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Goudas!!

That is why you have to inform the reader! I just guessed by the context and see how far off I was? Sincerely, --Mattisse 21:28, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Been doing b and d

Mainly I have been checking and dabbing links -- and cleaning up the link target article a little if it has a big "subject lacks importance" template on it like the last one did. I've made some articles -- very superfical ones for now. I'll work on the stubby sentences -- did they mention that again? I don't know anything about SVG info boxes. Sorry. --Mattisse 21:46, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Messages for you on Talk:Vijayanagara Empire discussion page

See messages on Irugappa and also on literature on arts and sciences. I also divided the Vijayanagara Empire Literature page into more sections like history, sciences etc. mlpkr 23:56, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Look the change yourself and make a cell. I thought they are good for diversity and okay to remove. I already did that on subarticle. mlpkr 00:02, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

Look at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Vijayanagara_Empire#Jain_Scholor_Irugappa. Just infor so you would use it for Jainism. mlpkr 00:05, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

ok, that pdf page is actually a text book. Somebody scanned it and put on their webpage. mlpkr 01:16, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

Linking

Yes, I was thinking the same thing about too much linking. It is hard to have perspective when I get too involved. Why don't you think about what you want me to do tomorrow. I'm laying off for now. I'm completely bummed out by the arbitration going on about me. (I am a really famous person, you know. I must be that so many people are preoccupied about what I do on Wikipedia. But I am safe under your umbrella for now!) Sincerely, Mattisse

Thanks

Thanks for the barnstar. utcursch | talk 12:34, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

Hello. Thanks for the barnstar. It always feels great to get them. I was busy for a few days and couldn't reply to your messages. - Aksi_great (talk) 14:18, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

Today

I have been putting in more red links -- probably overdoing it. However, I think it serves the purpose of drawing your attention to them so you can make the final determination. I will work on creating and cleaning up stubs too. Probably you would be better at creating the historical biographies, and I can try to do stubs for places, do you agree?

I notice that you improved the article greatly last night - removing the unnecessary red link temples - and generally tightening it up. It looks much better.

Do you have any other ideas for me today, other than continuing to proof read, besides what I suggested above? Sincerely, Mattisse 14:48, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

ur message

Hello Mr.Kannambadi, I have genuinely tried to take a middle path by allowing kannada script at yadavas page. I expect the same gesture from u. And one more thing, u can call names to me or have personal attacks,but plz make sure u dont speak anything against my language.

Wikipedia has not banned Marathi citations. Mr.Utcursch has used a Marathi citation. Many other wikipedians across this website use it. Wikipedia says to give preference to English citations,i hope u understand the meaning. Sarvabhaum 18:04, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

Ho[e this explains

However, do give references in other languages where appropriate. If quoting from a different language source, an English translation should be given with the original-language quote beside it. at WP:REF Thanks.Sarvabhaum 18:45, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

Preference = favor, liking, fondness; priority, precedence, superior status; something that is preferred, favorite; (Computers) option within a menu that can be individually adjusted and determines the appearance or function of a program or operation system (usually used as "preferences")

Above is the meaning if u want it. Preference comes into picture when the claim has two citations in differnent langauges and one has to be chosen. Preference comes when choice has to be made. Sarvabhaum 18:55, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

All i can say is u r fighting for the sake of it!Sarvabhaum 19:26, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

U are welcome. Btw the interpretation u made about the wikipedia rule is not valid. Mr.Utcursch has himself used a Marathi book. Thousands of articles across wikipedia has non-English citations. Do u want few examples? Wikipedia should reflect and accommodate others views as well. Sarvabhaum 19:31, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

Ref

I was also looking at that. AFAIK, the Bhahadiswara Temple was completed in the 25th year of Rajaraja Chola, which would mean around 1010 CE. I don't what he means by 'completed in 1803'. Parthi ^{talk/contribs} 19:17, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

web article

Pattern of Temple Grants in Medieval South Western India You probably already have seen this. It pretty much confirms the information you are presenting in the article.

Today I spent a great deal of time trying to come up with stubs but only acheived a few pitiful articles. Sincerely, Mattisse 20:45, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the encouraging words

I do feel bad when I make a mistake but I appreciate your letting me know. Otherwise I would not learn. Thanks! Mattisse 01:27, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

Red links

I noticed that you fixed them! There was one FA comment that I could not find -- something about "significantly profitable" or something similar. Sincerely, Mattisse 01:54, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

infobox

Out of my league -- don't even know how to get at it to fix the — part. --Mattisse 01:58, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

many others such as the Dasa tribe, Griddhraj Parvat Parampara

I don't understand it either -- I tried to figure out what was going on there, looking up the terms in various articles, but finally had to give up regarding Dasakuta. I could have left the sentence out, but I was worried about "the other side" that you are usually concerned about. (I thought maybe you would know was it meant!) Sincerely, Mattisse 12:13, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

ur message

I request u to stop bullying me.I know ur a senior member and might have worked very hard here,but it is no secret that the books and the writers u use are all pro-south india,rather pro-karnataka. Chalukyas, rashtrakutas are part of Maharashtra history, views of noted historians like C.V.Vaidya, Dr.Bhandarkar and others should also find place here.

Also Utcursch has confirmed to me that English language citations should be used as first preference and non_english citations should not be used when English books are available.

U can find Marathi book quoted on yadavas page. I can show u thousands of articles where non-English books/websites are used. Its quite natural,history of Maharashtra will be in Marathi medias. If a frech wikipedia wants to do a article on Maharashtra's history naturally they cant rely only on french books. Preference comes to picture when same matter is available with the books/websites. English books are written by English authors. The views of Marathi historians are mostly found in Marathi.There are many Marathi books quoted on innumerable articles across this website. Same might hold true for ur language.

Sarvabhaum 15:36, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

remove the word?

Dasa? I'm having a horrible time with the literature section. It just seems patched together. The word "notable" is on the FA editors' list of words never to use. Also, under Economics, I do not know what Juda is. I changed it to Judea just so it would not link to a town in Scotland (or some place). Sincerely, Mattisse 16:34, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

What did you want me to do when you said it was a "sensitive" word? Anything, or just leave it there? --Mattisse 16:46, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

I was working on Vijayanagara Empire article

I did not know about the word on Dasakuta, but I can remove those sentences from it if you want. Should I remove it from the Vijayanagara Empire article too? --Mattisse 17:07, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

Astadiggajas

Do you have any references for this link, Astadiggajas? The article has a huge Original Research template on it. If we had some references, we could remove that. --Mattisse 17:37, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

Dasas

What do you mean by this word. There is nothing I can link it to and it needs some small explanation. Is it a literary form, something like that? --Mattisse 19:24, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

I do not know your context. Dasa means Devotee and Dasas is plural form for it. mlpkr 20:08, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

Map for vijayanagara

I was waiting for your copy of map. Just now noticed it you sent it. I will create one today. mlpkr 15:17, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

Hey, the map is ready at Image:Vijayanagara-empire2.svg. See if it looks good. mlpkr 20:07, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

Two other references including the book of Durga Prasad also includes them. I think Portugeese were paying horses to Krishnadevaraya. It mentions that during 1506 Raichur's capture, portugeese helped it. They are friendly except when one general Martin tried to revolt in 1542. mlpkr 21:49, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

I included the page numbers of both the books. Other references gave general outline with multiple kingdoms like some of them are not even parallel like kakatiyas and vijayanagaras. So it should not be a problem. I still removed them. mlpkr 22:11, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

Architecture

It seems like the links in the Architecture section have no rhyme or reason to them. Most don't go to temples, or if there is a temple on the page it is farther down than the reader is willing to go. And all those links don't explain anything. (Not meaning to be hard on you -- just my thoughts.) Sincerely, --Mattisse 21:07, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

I think the key is to be selective rather than comprehensive, selecting links that will provide the reader with useful information. In some case, the map showing the town's location is useful. But the reader does not get many actual architectural links. Sincerely, Mattisse 21:46, 17 January 2007 (UTC)