User talk:CJ Withers/Quebec French (syntax)

"Au Canada, ils parlent anglais et français. (Au Canada, on parle anglais et français.) They/people speak English and French in Canada. "

This might not be such a good example as this could be perceived as a case of someone prefering not to include himself in Canada rather then a replacement of ON with ILS.--Marc pasquin 18:55, 19 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Absence of elles

I have to disagree with that, quite commonly you can hear "è" being used as the pronoun for 3rd person plural..--Marc pasquin 18:55, 19 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

ils vs. on

That's exactly the point. It's ambiguous for people like us who are familiar with Q.F. That's why people who are unaware of this use will always and only think "others".

Absence of elles

elles pronounced "è" in that case is an exception; it is a borrowing from the written norm/standard (exogenous or endogenous). The absence of elles is explained in Denis Dumas' Nos façons de parler : les prononciations en français québécois c1987. In that book, there are charts showing the system of pronouns in spoken Quebec French and an explanation of why elles has fallen out of most oral usage. (Note there is a parallel with lui, l', les, eux.) Also, there is a strong tendancy in oral Quebec news media, as opposed to in the rest of la Francophonie, to use informal registers in formal siuations. This phenomenon was observed in the Jacques Maurais' research in La langue des bulletins d'information à la radio québécoise : premier essai d'évaluation c2005 and commissioned by the OQLF.

As for how representative your observation is, all I can say is that among the lesbians I know who organize events or are at the head of lesbian or women's organizations in Quebec, they have all stated that use of ils where one should expect elles is indeed common and widespread, though obviously ubiquitous in the written language. Often, the women who find themselves saying ils for elles "correct" themselves if they realize their so-called mistake, that is, if they don't find the situation humorously ironic. CJ Withers 16:34, 20 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

"how representative", I couldn't say for sure. Wheter those you mention are the rule and I (and those around me) are the exception (or vice versa) might be a question of either social or geographical provenance.--Marc pasquin 19:28, 20 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]